One last big twist in Season 8?

[Apoplexy]

Tyrion dying, due to any reason, would be a major twist. He seemed upset about the Jon-Dany romance in the last episode. Maybe he betrays Dany for cersei, and then cersei ends up burning him anyways. But I really don't think this will happen.

[MinscS2]

5 hours ago, 4 Eyed Crow said:

Not expecting this to happen, but I think it will be pretty cool if this is the twist:

Turns out, Cersei put in a slow-acting poison in the wine Tyrion drank during their meeting in 7x07. The cryptic look on Tyrion's face was because he was starting to feel the effects of the poison and wanted to tell Dany, but was caught off guard by boatsex. However, we won't be able to tell that he's been poisoned until 8x01. Then a few or all of season 8 episodes will follow Tyrion's deterioration. 

Doubt it, mainly because I doubt Cersei has a poisoned jar of wine (let alone a slow-working poison) in her private chambers and because she didn't know Tyrion was gonna go talk to her in the first place.
If Tyrion dies in S8 I doubt it would be due to Cerseis own wine being poisoned anyway. It would be unexpected though.

[jcmontea]

16 minutes ago, MinscS2 said:

Doubt it, mainly because I doubt Cersei has a poisoned jar of wine (let alone a slow-working poison) in her private chambers and because she didn't know Tyrion was gonna go talk to her in the first place.
If Tyrion dies in S8 I doubt it would be due to Cerseis own wine being poisoned anyway. It would be unexpected though.

I think Tyrion plot armor seems him through to the end. 

The most depressing his end will be is he ends up on a vinyard with no real friends as he talked about in Season 6. If he is lucky, he contributes in a meaninful way next year so Dany doesn't dismiss him.

[4 Eyed Crow]

 

23 minutes ago, jcmontea said:

I think Tyrion plot armor seems him through to the end.

If Tyrion dies in S8, they'll probably have a red priest(ess) revive him. In the unlikely event that he's poisoned, they'll find a cure for him. 

[Deminelle]

16 hours ago, MinscS2 said:

Doubt it, mainly because I doubt Cersei has a poisoned jar of wine (let alone a slow-working poison) in her private chambers and because she didn't know Tyrion was gonna go talk to her in the first place.
If Tyrion dies in S8 I doubt it would be due to Cerseis own wine being poisoned anyway. It would be unexpected though.

Cersei didn't drink because she's pregnant. There was no poison.

[4 Eyed Crow]

1 hour ago, Deminelle said:

Cersei didn't drink because she's pregnant. There was no poison.

Well, one does get curious as to why the wine was in her office if she's not drinking due to pregnancy. It could be Jaime's or Qyburn's, but neither seem like they normally drink. Maybe she's seeing someone. Or maybe she expected Tyrion to come (due to little birds or just being steps ahead) and knew how much he likes wine.

But I know it is unlikely for the wine to be poisoned, so it's probably just S7 writing. Still would be cool, though.

[Deminelle]

10 hours ago, 4 Eyed Crow said:

Well, one does get curious as to why the wine was in her office if she's not drinking due to pregnancy. It could be Jaime's or Qyburn's, but neither seem like they normally drink. Maybe she's seeing someone. Or maybe she expected Tyrion to come (due to little birds or just being steps ahead) and knew how much he likes wine.

But I know it is unlikely for the wine to be poisoned, so it's probably just S7 writing. Still would be cool, though.

I thought they would always have some wine for any possible visitors. When did that Iron Bank fellow visit? IMO the scene was to make Tyrion notice the pregnancy.

[4 Eyed Crow]

29 minutes ago, Deminelle said:

When did that Iron Bank fellow visit? 

7x03 and 7x04

[hewman]

On 9/18/2017 at 3:11 AM, jcmontea said:

I think Tyrion plot armor seems him through to the end. 

The most depressing his end will be is he ends up on a vinyard with no real friends as he talked about in Season 6. If he is lucky, he contributes in a meaninful way next year...

I think so too. Always believed Tywin's "You are not my son!" was meant literally: Tyrion is Aerys' son. So valar morghulis will be for him, but later after revealing he's the dragon's third head.

[btfu806]

8 hours ago, hewman said:

I think so too. Always believed Tywin's "You are not my son!" was meant literally: Tyrion is Aerys' son. So valar morghulis will be for him, but later after revealing he's the dragon's third head.

I like the idea that he is not Tywin's son. But I always have a hard time believing there are two secret Targs. Maybe there are, but for me though, can't really picture it.

[LittleScorpion]

I think the last "omg moment" that grrm told the showrunners about is probably Cersei burning down King's Landing. 

[Zapho]

On 18.9.2017 at 7:22 PM, 4 Eyed Crow said:

Well, one does get curious as to why the wine was in her office if she's not drinking due to pregnancy.

Not drinking due to pregnancy is a very recent invention and Cersei is a very medieval lady in that respect. She was drinking wine all the time. 

Might explain Joeffrey somewhat. Besides him being a result of inbreeding.

[4 Eyed Crow]

1 hour ago, Zapho said:

Not drinking due to pregnancy is a very recent invention and Cersei is a very medieval lady in that respect. She was drinking wine all the time. 

Yes, it's inconsistent with the time period. And yet she did not drink wine when Tyrion offered her some. Regardless of what her intention was, it seemed like the scene was trying to communicate that Cersei not drinking is in some way related to a pregnancy. 

[falcotron]

7 hours ago, Zapho said:

Not drinking due to pregnancy is a very recent invention and Cersei is a very medieval lady in that respect.

Actually, a lot of women did stop drinking wine. Not because they anachronistically knew about the effects of alcohol on the fetus, but just because alcohol and tannins are both triggers for morning sickness in many women. It's certainly not universal, or even as high on the list as, say, fish or garlic, but it's definitely common enough that people knew about it, and you can find plenty of stories (until the last few decades) where women are relieved to reach week 20 so they can start drinking wine again without throwing up.

And, even if Cersei isn't actually intolerant to wine because of morning sickness, she's looking for ways to get Tyrion to "figure out" that she's pregnant and trying to hide it from him. Refusing wine is another conspicuous hint to drop.

[alienarea]

My final twist would be this: Jon and Daenerys fight the Army of the Dead at Winterfell but lose. The Night's King marches his army towards Kings Landing and attacks the city. Un-Viserion's blue flame light the wild fire, blowing up Kings Landing and the Night's King. With him dead, all of his army shatter for good. Cersei is remembered as the hero Queen who gave her life to save humanity.

[MinscS2]

1 hour ago, alienarea said:

Cersei is remembered as the hero Queen who gave her life to save humanity.

Would be an interesting twist but it won't happen; the victor writes the history, and even if Cersei were to take out the NK, the people who rebuild the world (Dany & Co) still knew what an evil, treacherous, narcissistic piece of work she was. She won't be remembered for anything good, the survivors will make sure of that.

[MrJay]

On 9/20/2017 at 3:12 PM, 4 Eyed Crow said:

Yes, it's inconsistent with the time period. And yet she did not drink wine when Tyrion offered her some. Regardless of what her intention was, it seemed like the scene was trying to communicate that Cersei not drinking is in some way related to a pregnancy. 

Her rubbing her tummy as if to say "look here. There's a baby in here!" made that clear as all hell. They couldn't make it any more obvious without making her outright say it. 

[jcmontea]

@MinscS2 did you watch the Game Revealed for Episode 5 that came out today? 

It def. really gave some credence to the idea of Tyrion betraying Daenerys. Dinklage speaking about the scene of burning the Tarly's really hit on the idea of how horrible Tyrion felt that act was and how he is having serious doubts as to whether he backed the right person. 

Interestingly they did not include any scenes from the meeting where he proposed the wight plan. But it does seem to heavily suggest what Tyrion's mindset was in that meeting. 

The whole thing gave me the feeling that some big consequences could come from that next year. 

EDIT: Although this season really killed Tyrion for me. When I look at him now I just see an idiot who is still struggling with his daddy issues. If he thinks something is bad, makes me think yup Dany was totally right. 

[MinscS2]

1 hour ago, jcmontea said:

@MinscS2 did you watch the Game Revealed for Episode 5 that came out today? 

It def. really gave some credence to the idea of Tyrion betraying Daenerys. Dinklage speaking about the scene of burning the Tarly's really hit on the idea of how horrible Tyrion felt that act was and how he is having serious doubts as to whether he backed the right person. 

Interestingly they did not include any scenes from the meeting where he proposed the wight plan. But it does seem to heavily suggest what Tyrion's mindset was in that meeting. 

The whole thing gave me the feeling that some big consequences could come from that next year. 

EDIT: Although this season really killed Tyrion for me. When I look at him now I just see an idiot who is still struggling with his daddy issues. If he thinks something is bad, makes me think yup Dany was totally right. 

No I haven't seen it yet, but I agree: my opinion of Tyrion has really worsened this season. He's always been one of my favorite characters since season 1, but now I'm not so sure anymore. He might redeem himself in season 8, but if he continues on the path he's currently on, I probably wouldn't even feel sad if he ended up dying (which he won't though.)

Daenerys is the first person ever (except for Jamie) who treats Tyrion with respect, acknowledges his wits and intelligence, and who never looks down on him for being a dwarf, but instead treats him as a (near) equal. She made him her hand, a sign of the respect and trust she has for him, and she even stands up to him when other people disrespect him (like when she basically told Ellaria to shut up in episode 2).

How does he repay her? He betrays her by putting his own interests before hers, gives her bad advice that serves to aid his family instead of her strategy, and essentially works to undermine her war effort. A lot of people would consider what he's currently doing as treason. I'm glad that Daenerys actually seems to be onto him though, since she's called him out on the fact twice (once in episode 4 and once in episode 6), even if it currently is only something she says in the "heat of the moment" when she's annoyed at him, she's probably far closer to the truth than she realizes.

I'm not even buying the "Tyrion started second-guessing his decision to back her up"-statement after witnessing her burn the Tarleys: That was in episode 5. He started undermining and thwarting her strategy way before that happened, and it's not like he didn't know that she has a ruthless side before she even made him her hand.

I read an interesting post a few days ago which raised the subject of how Tyrion seems to actively remove all other men Daenerys inner circle. He convinced her to banish Jorah a second time, he convinced her to leave Daario behind and he might try to convince her to break up with Jon. It might be a red herring or a coincidence though.
 

[Guest TheRealKingInTheNorth]

Interesting, this Tyrion betrayal. It would really hurt but I also think it would make perfect sense and probably the best bit of character development in these recent seasons. Tyrion for all his maltreatment at his father's and sister's hands has still sought their acceptance. Maybe he truly believed in Dany initially (and probably still does to some extent) or maybe she was just another person he could hitch on to so he could wield some sort of power - he did confess how much he liked being hand to Joffrey. However, he might also be convinced that his new position will finally give him the respect and acceptance even from his family (Cersei in particular). He is a Lannister after all and family for them is everything. I wonder what Varys' role in all this is.