DominusNovus

Your favorite 'hateable' character

103 posts in this topic

ASOIAF is full of characters that are just hated, both in the fandom and in-universe.  Of these characters, are there any that you like, despite it all?  I'm not talking about characters that you can't help but respect, like many can't help but just admire how well Littlefinger plays everyone.  Characters that you genuinely like, root for, etc. even though you're not supposed to.

Mine is Randyll Tarly.  I read him, and I can't help but admire his ability and direct nature.  He's basically the manifestation of the ideal of Westerosi feudalism, warts and all.  Yes, he's unforgivably brutal to Sam, yes, his attitude toward women, particularly Brienne, galls the reader and is harsh even by Westerosi standards.  He reminds me of a slightly less ruthless Tywin, minus several of Tywin's more notable character flaws.  He's not viciously ambitious, he's not manipulating those around him, he's just, well, he's very comfortable with the idea of his place in a feudal society (you can't blame him, he's got a nice spot in the hierarchy): be a soldier, follow your liege, rule effectively over your smallfolk, and raise your son to do the same.  All of his flaws are tied into the nature of his society; his derision for Sam's bookish nature is based in Randyll's view of his duty - and, by extension, his family's duty - as the Lord of Horn Hill.  I guess what I'm trying to say is that you can look at Randyll, and, even if you dislike him, he's immensely understandable.

Thats my unpopular pick for a character I just can't help but like, whats yours?

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Mine would be Lady Dustin, but primarily because I think she has a hidden agenda.

For a lot of the reasons you listed, I guess I might also admit a grudging respect for Roose Bolton. He's a sociopath, but he's not terribly gruesome or melodramatic about it. He just sees team Lannister as the best way to survive or to get ahead.

I also love Lord Manderly, in spite of the Frey pies. But maybe he doesn't fit your definition of someone we're not supposed to root for - I guess most of the Stark allies are seen as "white hats" in fandom.

There's something very sinister about Myranda Royce, but I like her, too. (So far.)

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7 minutes ago, Seams said:

Mine would be Lady Dustin, but primarily because I think she has a hidden agenda.

For a lot of the reasons you listed, I guess I might also admit a grudging respect for Roose Bolton. He's a sociopath, but he's not terribly gruesome or melodramatic about it. He just sees team Lannister as the best way to survive or to get ahead.

I also love Lord Manderly, in spite of the Frey pies. But maybe he doesn't fit your definition of someone we're not supposed to root for - I guess most of the Stark allies are seen as "white hats" in fandom.

There's something very sinister about Myranda Royce, but I like her, too. (So far.)

Interesting choices.

To give a better idea of what I had in mind with characters we’re supposed to hate, I’m thinking Tywin, Joffrey, Cersei, Randyll, Craster, Roose, Ramsey, Gregor, Meryn, Walder, Littlefinger... that ‘tier’ of characters.

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With Roose Bolton and Randyll Tarly (great characterisation of him, btw!) already named, I go for Alliser Thorne:

Yes, he is a bitter, mean man, and he hates Jon with a passion for being a bastard Stark (and being proud of it), but he keeps his vows, tries to convince Tyrion and KL about the Others, does not interfere when Jon executes Janos Slynt (and it does not speak for Jon that he is disappointed by Allisers non-reaction). He does argue with Jon, but in the end does as he is told.

I somehow pity him, dont know why. I wish he would get a hug. :D

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Robb Stark had to fail. I don't hate Walder Frey and I think Roose Bolton is very interesting character. 

I have no any feeling for Randyl Tarly (I love Samwell).

Before hating Gregor Clegane you have to hate his father, Tywin and Robert Baratheon. They never punished him. 

 

Characters I hate: Mizzi Maz Daur (although she had reasons) and Joffrey.

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Walder I do not hate him I do not love him I do not admire him, but I am rooting for him.

He did what was best for himself time and time again, he is fitting in this world, and a fitting end would be "In my own bed, with a belly full of wine and a maiden's mouth around my cock, at the age of eighty," or 100 as the case may be.

It's not a fairy story the good guys should not always win go Walder.

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53 minutes ago, Morte said:

With Roose Bolton and Randyll Tarly (great characterisation of him, btw!) already named, I go for Alliser Thorne:

Yes, he is a bitter, mean man, and he hates Jon with a passion for being a bastard Stark (and being proud of it), but he keeps his vows, tries to convince Tyrion and KL about the Others, does not interfere when Jon executes Janos Slynt (and it does not speak for Jon that he is disappointed by Allisers non-reaction). He does argue with Jon, but in the end does as he is told.

I somehow pity him, dont know why. I wish he would get a hug. :D

Oh, thats a good one! Give me a moment to re-evaluate my choice...

Randyll still wins my vote, but only because I get the impression that far more people hate Randyll than hate Alliser.

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Tom Sevenstream. Everytime he appeared I got Sansa'd (when you think 'not this guy again') but I also couldn't help enjoying the damn character. 'tis was a weird thing.

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5 minutes ago, DominusNovus said:

Randyll still wins my vote, but only because I get the impression that far more people hate Randyll than hate Alliser.

Most people would have forgotten Alliser by now. ;)

More serious: Randyll winning is fair enough; we know a lot about him, so he is really the way Sam has described him. While I think that Alliser may be more likeable if we knew him better.

So, yes: Randyll also wins my vote, too. But Alliser is close behind.

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Walder Frey is hilarious - I don't share his values and think he is a little twerp, but his "I give two bits what you think about me I'm going to do what I like and say what I like" attitude is sooooo funny in his talks with Catelyn and Robb.  I want him to survive if only to see a conversation between him and Stannis.

Re-reading Joffrey is actually perversely enjoyable once you know he is going to eat shit in ASOS.  First read was terrible and infuriating.  Second read is great just seeing how naïve he is to the real danger he is in and lack of power he has.

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Its interesting how many people are saying Walder Frey. One of the reasons I loathe him actually helps explain why I like Randyll Tarly: Walder absolutely violates the societal norms of Westeros for his own benefit, whereas Randyll works within the system and takes his responsibilities within that system seriously. He wants to advance his family’s position, of course, but he has expectations of that family; they don’t get any slack just because they’re blood. He’s by no means an egalitarian like Aegon V or (to some degree) Stannis, but he clearly has some sense of noblesse oblige (a very martial sense of it, mind you).

Hmm, I wonder if you could call Tarly a Mohist?

Edited by DominusNovus

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1 hour ago, Reginald blackfield said:

Vargo Hoat. I still miss him.:(

At first glance, he's good, pious man. His god demands daily blood sacrifice, and he obliges. And he tries to cause maximum suffering while sacrificing as many people as possible. And taking over the Brave Companions and hiring out to people like Tywin is a good way to serve those goals, while also carrying the glory (and imagery) of the Black Goat to new lands.

But the Black Goat wants children more than adults, and Vargo's killing mostly adults. And noble sons should also be a priority, but he lets Jaime (well, 90% of him) go free.  So, I don't think he's actually as devout and holy as he appears.

And really, if he were faithful, would the Black Goat have abandoned him and done nothing to help defend Harrenhal when the Mountain attacked?

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Ugh I HATE RANDYLL TARLY lol! 

I've always liked The Hound. Even before his character started to turn.

I think mine would be Cersei. I sympathize with her. She gets forced into a loveless marriage & isn't allowed to love the person she really does. Her children are considered an abomination to those who know their true parentage & she is trapped in a patriarchal society. 

She is also bat shit crazy. 

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6 hours ago, Morte said:

. . . I go for Alliser Thorne:

Yes, he is a bitter, mean man, and he hates Jon with a passion for being a bastard Stark (and being proud of it), but he keeps his vows, tries to convince Tyrion and KL about the Others, does not interfere when Jon executes Janos Slynt (and it does not speak for Jon that he is disappointed by Allisers non-reaction). He does argue with Jon, but in the end does as he is told.

I somehow pity him, dont know why. I wish he would get a hug. :D

Excellent point! I think there's a big secret attached to Ser Alliser. Or something we haven't yet put together.

5 hours ago, Davos the Dragonslayer said:

İ forgot Varamyr Sixskins.What he did his brother is brutal.

Yes! He teaches us (readers) so much important stuff about skinchanging. There is something likable about him - or maybe pitiable is a better word - in spite of his ruthlessness about occupying the bodies and minds of others.

4 hours ago, Reginald blackfield said:

Vargo Hoat. I still miss him.:(

Another good one. He's so over-the-top, in his grotesqueness. And his death was so brutal. You have to feel a little sympathy.

 

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I thought of an interesting way to consider this question: What if you knew this person?  Setting aside the perils of Westeros itself, how many would want to be Cersei's husband, Randyll's kid, Walder's dinner guest, Aliser's student, etc.?

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Not on your list, and maybe we aren't supposed to hate him but a lot of people on the forum do, Darkstar.  He fascinates me and I look forward to reading more about him in Winds. 

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Yeah, I have to go with Roose the boss, but I guess it's mainly because I admire his toughness and shrewdness.  He just seems like such a boss, chilling in his pink clothes, barely eating anything, having leech baths during meetings.  Anyone who can completely cow and punk Ramsay like he did I can't help but root for a little bit.  

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