Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
DominusNovus

Robert’s Wars

16 posts in this topic

It seems to me that Robert makes a decent wartime king.  It also seems to Robert that he does, and he often longs for war.

Why doesn’t he just find a war? Either go crush some wildlings (bonus: hang out with Ned!) or march against the Mountain Clans (bonus: you’ll never find them all, so fun warring for as long as you want) or find some Free City that wants the weight of the Iron Throne in one of their wars (bonus: Essosi whores!).The latter option would be a tougher sell, of course, but its not a matter of having to call all his banners, just to have enough to make things a safe venture and keep Robert busy.

Edited by DominusNovus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, StraightFromAsshai said:

The Stepstones is lovely this time of the year

I agree, though it does have the problem of primarily being naval warfare, which doesn’t seem to be Robert’s area of expertise.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, DominusNovus said:

I agree, though it does have the problem of primarily being naval warfare, which doesn’t seem to be Robert’s area of expertise.

On the other hand, it might have the added bonus of silencing that annoying teeth-gridning sound that he can hear 24/7 from all the way across Blackwater Bay in Dragonstone.

On the third hand, there has to be a reason previous attempts have never been able to set up a lasting domain over the Stepstones, and that Tywin and all of Aerys's other advisors argued strongly against it even long before Aerys had gone mad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Despite being a legendary warrior and great battle commander Bobby really wasn't the warmonger people make him out to be. He was forced into Robert's Rebellion after Aerys signed his and Ned's death warrants. Then he fought the Greyjoys after they declared war on the green landers by burning Lannisport. Robert really didn't go looking for wars but when found them he finished them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Ralphis Baratheon said:

Despite being a legendary warrior and great battle commander Bobby really wasn't the warmonger people make him out to be.

Toward the end, definitely not. When he offers Ned the job of Hand, he says, “I am planning to make you run the kingdom and fight the wars while I eat and drink and wench myself into an early grave.” So he sees war as one of those unpleasant tasks that go with being king.

But when he was younger? It isn't just Barristan Selmy and others who don't know him very well who say he "loved the song of swords"—even Ned thinks it. For example, after he dies, Pycelle says "The gods give him rest", and Ned replies, "No. He hated rest. the gods give him love and laughter and the joy of righteous battle".

Maybe he'd rather not lead those battles, but he wanted to take part in them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

He declined taking back the Summer Island for Jalabhar though. That would have been an interesting setup.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wars are the most expensive thing a medieval state can engage in. Would just be a waste not everyone would be willing to allow.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, falcotron said:

But when he was younger? It isn't just Barristan Selmy and others who don't know him very well who say he "loved the song of swords"—even Ned thinks it. For example, after he dies, Pycelle says "The gods give him rest", and Ned replies, "No. He hated rest. the gods give him love and laughter and the joy of righteous battle".

Maybe he'd rather not lead those battles, but he wanted to take part in them.

Righteous being the key word in that sentence. A battle that is justified fighting.

It's still hard to label him a warmonger when he never started any wars, even as King. He may have loved the song of war hammers and waxed poetic about his single's combat victory over Rhaegar but he still only went to war when he was provoked and others he respected thought it was the right thing to do.

For example if he was a warmonger he probably would have declared war on Dorne when Oberyn was trying to raise Viserys against him. instead he sent Jon Arryn there to seek peace with Doran. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, King Merrett I Frey said:

He declined taking back the Summer Island for Jalabhar though. That would have been an interesting setup.

Far away and not worth it....all those troops and ships etc all have to be paid for and whats the payback? Westeros has no real  connection there  to talk of pretexts or grand claims , no great wealth to be plundered nor is jalabhar even  well liked enough to motivate nobles.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Also, if we're treating things remotely realistically, then most of the soldiers only owe a few months of service out of the year and will want to go home after that. So forget multi-year expeditions unless you contrive a VERY good reason for the common troops (e.g. a holy Crusade; not something reproducible in Westeros due to how weak religion seems to be) with tangible monetary awards to boot; even then you're not going to get more than a minority of your troops to sign on for it.

Edited by Nihlus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/21/2017 at 4:35 PM, DominusNovus said:

It seems to me that Robert makes a decent wartime king.  It also seems to Robert that he does, and he often longs for war.

Why doesn’t he just find a war? Either go crush some wildlings (bonus: hang out with Ned!) or march against the Mountain Clans (bonus: you’ll never find them all, so fun warring for as long as you want) or find some Free City that wants the weight of the Iron Throne in one of their wars (bonus: Essosi whores!).The latter option would be a tougher sell, of course, but its not a matter of having to call all his banners, just to have enough to make things a safe venture and keep Robert busy.

Bob loves 5 things. Drinking, whoring, fighting, fantasizing about killing Rhaegar and lyanna, in that order. While the war was ripe ground for all of these things, As king he could do all of them as well with virtually no limits. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Nihlus said:

Also, if we're treating things remotely realistically, then most of the soldiers only owe a few months of service out of the year and will want to go home after that. So forget multi-year expeditions unless you contrive a VERY good reason for the common troops (e.g. a holy Crusade; not something reproducible in Westeros due to how weak religion seems to be) with tangible monetary awards to boot; even then you're not going to get more than a minority of your troops to sign on for it.

Exactly.

People forget that we're only getting to see Westeros only during a very extraordinary period, with a prolonged succession war, and a particularly nasty one where many houses are fighting for their very survival. So some people have been able to call up troops and keep them in the field for years, but that's not at all normal. And we can see the consequences—which shows why the feudal contract is the way it is in the first place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Robert, for his lack of executive interest, has a good nose for these things.  He knew the Dany/Drogo marriage meant war, and he was rightfully suspicious of the loyalties of many lords in Westeros.  He was not able to put two and two together, and wasn't playing Matlock in his spare time, but he knew a war was coming.  Something was rotten, and he didn't need it spelled out. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 22/09/2017 at 0:35 AM, DominusNovus said:

It seems to me that Robert makes a decent wartime king.  It also seems to Robert that he does, and he often longs for war.

Why doesn’t he just find a war? Either go crush some wildlings (bonus: hang out with Ned!) or march against the Mountain Clans (bonus: you’ll never find them all, so fun warring for as long as you want) or find some Free City that wants the weight of the Iron Throne in one of their wars (bonus: Essosi whores!).The latter option would be a tougher sell, of course, but its not a matter of having to call all his banners, just to have enough to make things a safe venture and keep Robert busy.

 

I think it reflects the weaknesses in his character, he doesn't have much proactivity. He was awesome when thrust into the rebellion, but he didn't really start it, that was just a position he was put in. I can imagine he's the sort of person who wakes up thinking he'll sort things out, but gets distracted by the wine and the whores and never gets round to it. Like with Jalabhar, I think he really wanted to do that, he just couldn't get round to actually getting it sorted, and no one else was keen.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Robert was not that strong of a king.  Taking loyal bannermen across the Narrow Sea to fight Braavos will just invite trouble for him back home.  Besides, you don't attack your bankers. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0