Blade Runner 2049 - more human than human [Spoilers!]

[boojam]

13 hours ago, felice said:

Though it might not have been a farm at the time, or at least not the same type of farm.

Interesting that Sapper and Freysa where there. How long had they been there? Apparently N8's only came on-line in 2019? They went off world and came back by at least 2021. Lot squeezed in just a couple of years.

[boojam]

I thought this was interesting.

 

https://img00.deviantart.net/15e2/i/2017/289/7/8/the_unicorn___pregnant_rachel_blade_runner_2049_by_halhefnerart-dbqs37m.jpg

 

[PetyrPunkinhead]

On the technical aspect of things, I just discovered the film's cinematographer, Roger Deakins, doesn't rely on social media like Twitter & Insta to communicate with fans--he is still running an old school website with a forum and blogs. I've spent the past two hours  surfing on there and highly recommend it for fans of BR2049.

Here's an article on Deakins' cinematography, and if you scroll to the bottom there are three or four videos on Blade Runner 2049 specifically.

Here's a nifty video on the miniatures shot by Weta. And here are Deakins' comments on it.

 

[Werthead]

Owch. Blade Runner 2049 has cleared $250 million, which is more than the budget but less than the marketing. Apparently the Sony-Alcon deal means that Alcon will be taking an $80 million hit for the movie, but Sony is in the clear on it.

So, rather obviously, no sequels unless the streaming/media release is absolutely huge.

[boojam]

30 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Owch. Blade Runner 2049 has cleared $250 million, which is more than the budget but less than the marketing. Apparently the Sony-Alcon deal means that Alcon will be taking an $80 million hit for the movie, but Sony is in the clear on it.

So, rather obviously, no sequels unless the streaming/media release is absolutely huge.

Tho I do wonder in all the years since Blade Runner's release and how it remained 'visible' , so many versions, if it actually made some money? I think this film will also remain a favorite of serious film goers.

It is really disappointing to me , I wait for films like this, big-budget-serious-movie , they are just not there. Tho we did get Dunkirk this year which I was also very entertained by. Thought there were at least another 50 million dollar worth of tickets out there like me. (It did very well in Great Briton.)

Since 2000 some 'big' films that I liked :

Gladiator (2000)

Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon(2000)

Lord of the Rings (surprising adaptations)

Master and Commander (2003, a total gem, which did not do well)

Dark Knight (2008)

Gravity (2013)

The Martian (2015)

There are some , for me, mildly entertaining , like Avatar , which don't get a cigar from me.

 

 

[williamjm]

22 hours ago, Werthead said:

Owch. Blade Runner 2049 has cleared $250 million, which is more than the budget but less than the marketing. Apparently the Sony-Alcon deal means that Alcon will be taking an $80 million hit for the movie, but Sony is in the clear on it.

So, rather obviously, no sequels unless the streaming/media release is absolutely huge.

You're probably right, although I suppose a lower-budget Blade Runner sequel could be possible since it's mostly the comparison to the large cost that makes its box office performance look weak. If they thought they could get a similar box office for half the budget then it might happen, although I'm not sure it would be a good thing.

[Eggegg]

On 15/11/2017 at 1:28 AM, Werthead said:

Owch. Blade Runner 2049 has cleared $250 million, which is more than the budget but less than the marketing. Apparently the Sony-Alcon deal means that Alcon will be taking an $80 million hit for the movie, but Sony is in the clear on it.

So, rather obviously, no sequels unless the streaming/media release is absolutely huge.

I'd rather there were no more sequels. For a start I'd rather Villeneuve went off and did new things ( and took over the industry) rather than go back. Secondly I don't really want to watch a new universe based on Bladerunner. It told a story, it was a good story. Its done. We can leave it alone and let our imaginations run wild about what happens next.

I guess the sad truth of life is that a movie's success is mostly about marketing, not movie quality. We've seen some absolutely DIRE movies do well recently, like Suicide Squad, and bad reviews haven't really even created a dent. I just don't think your average movie goer is even reading (anything) reviews, they just care about what their mates said about it or a cool trailer or poster. I also don't think many people like to be forced into thinking or appreciating something in a cinema, they want something fun. They want to be entertained for a bit and forget about a movie.

I find that sad but its just the way things are. Blade Runner 2049 is doing well to make as much money as it did, there are so many reasons why it shouldn't have been successful, from the lack of awareness of the original, the lack of action, the long run time.. it was a struggle from the start.

[Wilbur]

On 10/24/2017 at 6:32 AM, mcbigski said:

...I didnt understand the scene where Wallace kills the new replicant.  He gives a monologue about how hard it is to make each replicant and then stabs one to death about a minute after birthing her because he already knew she was sterile?  Surely they have a less hands on/more clinical approach to ending failed experiments besides scalpel to the uterus...

We went to the local second-run theater and watched it again, and on the way home we were discussing the historical allegory of the Tyrell / Wallace corporations.  The Tyrell corporation created a product (replicants) that turned out to be perceived as negative for society, and is closed by government regulators and goes bankrupt.  The Wallace corporation lobbies the government to re-open the replicant market, and proceeds to create larger profits and even greater societal upheaval with their efforts.

In the last decade, the banks created a huge economic trap and fell into it themselves (through rehypothecation, mortgage-backed securities, owning rating agencies that rated bad loans as good, front-running the market, etc.), causing a world-wide economic collapse.  The government steps in, but because of the regulatory capture of the government compliance institutions, the end result is even larger banks, with even larger liabilities, and even more socialization of risks and privatization of profits while providing even less access to capital for economically productive businesses.

My daughter pointed out that the Wallace Corp following the Tyrell Corp is like Julius Caesar following Marius; JC's appeal to the masses was EVEN MORE dangerous to the Roman Republic than was the Marians' previous brand of populism.

Also, I noticed for the first time that the garbage-scow ships dropping Los Angeles' garbage onto San Diego (ha! HA!)  were straight out of the movie Soldiers.  http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120157/mediaviewer/rm4180095232

[Darth Richard II]

Yeah, Soldier is set in the same universe.

[Werthead]

I didn't catch that. That's a nice call-out to Peoples.

[Wilbur]

One other ironic thought about the Wallace Corporation is that they are really succeeding beyond their expectations in creating sentient beings with self-determination.  Both their replicants (eg. K) and their software (eg. Joi) are so fully realized that they rebel against their creator's paradigms and compliance requirements to take their own paths to freedom.

Like teenagers exploring their boundaries through rebellious acts, K and Joi both go off the predestinate rails that the Wallace Corporation has laid down for them.  My wife reckoned they were like long-time Calvinists suddenly experiencing existentialism at a Wesleyan revival and choosing their own adventure.

So while Wallace may not know the ultimate secret to replicant reproductive techniques, and while he may personally be a repellent weirdo in need of a shave and a haircut, he is hell on wheels at making some complex, intelligent artificial organisms.  Ten points for style there.

Also, I loved the William Gibson Neuromancer-like microsofts that Wallace jacked into his socket to operate his fleet of micro-drones.

[boojam]

4 hours ago, Wilbur said:

One other ironic thought about the Wallace Corporation is that they are really succeeding beyond their expectations in creating sentient beings with self-determination.  Both their replicants (eg. K) and their software (eg. Joi) are so fully realized that they rebel against their creator's paradigms and compliance requirements to take their own paths to freedom.

Like teenagers exploring their boundaries through rebellious acts, K and Joi both go off the predestinate rails that the Wallace Corporation has laid down for them.  My wife reckoned they were like long-time Calvinists suddenly experiencing existentialism at a Wesleyan revival and choosing their own adventure.

So while Wallace may not know the ultimate secret to replicant reproductive techniques, and while he may personally be a repellent weirdo in need of a shave and a haircut, he is hell on wheels at making some complex, intelligent artificial organisms.  Ten points for style there.

Also, I loved the William Gibson Neuromancer-like microsofts that Wallace jacked into his socket to operate his fleet of micro-drones.

I didn't get the impression that Luv had gone 'replicant rogue' , she seemed to be obeying Wallace. I have seen the idea 'newer' replicants are going rouge because of the 'memories' , Ana (the daughter of Rachael and Deckard) is placing in them. We don't know how many 'memory' makers that the Wallace corp employs , rather has sub contracts with. I like the idea. Tho both Sapper and Freysa went 'rogue' way back , seemingly , before 2019....  

[felice]

8 hours ago, boojam said:

Tho both Sapper and Freysa went 'rogue' way back , seemingly , before 2019....  

Certainly before 2021; it seems unlikely they were already rogue at the time of the original film, though, since the limited-lifespan Nexus-7 were still state-of-the-art. It seems like all (or at least many) of the unlimited Tyrell Nexus-8s went rogue pretty quickly; it's only Wallace's new Nexus-9s that appear to need the real memories to have a chance to break their conditioning.

[boojam]

3 hours ago, felice said:

Certainly before 2021; it seems unlikely they were already rogue at the time of the original film, though, since the limited-lifespan Nexus-7 were still state-of-the-art. It seems like all (or at least many) of the unlimited Tyrell Nexus-8s went rogue pretty quickly; it's only Wallace's new Nexus-9s that appear to need the real memories to have a chance to break their conditioning.

I am going to have see the DVD and track the dialog, because what I remember of the Freysa - K dialog was that she showed or someone showed the same photo he had found at Sapper's farm , there she was holding a baby, at that point , not sure she said anything about Sapper, but implicitly , since K had seen the photo before, and the photo shows Freysa at Sappaer's farm, she just flat says she was on Calantha, only implication I can take from that is she knew Sapper on Calantha . Anyway if she was at Sapper's farm and held Ana , she and Sapper had to be caring for Rachael. Which leads to the implication that they were in the 'plan' that Deckard mentions.

Which brings up the question just how big was this 'replicant underground' ?  when was it formed? It seemed to have arranged some pretty effective things, 2019 - 2022 ,plus lasted for 30 years and stuff! 

If the Nexus 8s were introduced in 2019 Freysa and Sapper had to go off-planet then , to , apparently, interstellar distance (FTL implied) and 'escaped' back in 2020? or early 2021? Whew at lot happens in a few years. Maybe Nexus 8s were going off world before 2019? So the short lived Nexus's had an underground going in 2019, before that? It could be humans were already helping or setting up the replicant underground , maybe years before 2019? 

 The replicant underground seemed to have arranged some pretty effective things, 2019 - 2022 ,plus lasted for 30 years. Freysa and Sapper are still around in 2049 , how many other underground replicants were Nexus 8. Freysa and Sapper seemed to have aged*, sure seems implied. That seems to imply that Mariette is a Nexus 9 , she is much younger. That true of Freysa's other Doxies? I mean I was a bit startled when I realized in the Freysa - K scene late in the film that the early confrontation of Mariette and K was a replicant underground operation , seems to gain access to K so as to track him. 

There is a ton going on under the surface of the film narrative !

 

*  Villeneuve states explicitly in the book The Art and Soul of Blade Runner 2049 that Sapper is 60 years old. Found that odd. I guess at inception he was an effective 30 years old and aged 30 more years? Same would be true of Freysa. 

[Wouter]

Excellent movie, if a bit long. The story is relatively simple, but then we have a blockbuster movie without serious, obvious plot holes here.

Villeneuve is a director to watch. I hope Blade Runner 2049 gets some kind of nod at the Oscars.

[Werthead]

Blade Runner? Otherwise the obvious recommendation would be Villeneuve's previous SF movie, Arrival.

If it's the cyberpunk stuff that appeals, there's the new Netflix series Altered Carbon which debuts in two weeks, or the anime movies Akira and Ghost in the Shell (I haven't seen the recent live-action version). 

If it's the replicant/artificial intelligence angle that interests you, there is the movie Ex Machina or the 2003-09 TV series Battlestar Galactica. Or the current anthology series Black Mirror, which is set in a shared universe revolving (at least in part) around a way of digitising consciousness.

[polishgenius]

5 minutes ago, Werthead said:

Blade Runner? Otherwise the obvious recommendation would be Villeneuve's previous SF movie, Arrival.

If it's the cyberpunk stuff that appeals, there's the new Netflix series Altered Carbon which debuts in two weeks, or the anime movies Akira and Ghost in the Shell (I haven't seen the recent live-action version). 

If it's the replicant/artificial intelligence angle that interests you, there is the movie Ex Machina or the 2003-09 TV series Battlestar Galactica. Or the current anthology series Black Mirror, which is set in a shared universe revolving (at least in part) around a way of digitising consciousness.

To be honest, I think it's getting people to click on a link to bestsimilar.com that appeals.

[Relic]

bot alert

[Corvinus85]

I watched it again last night. Much more enjoyable from the comfort of your own home, where the booming sounds of the soundtrack are not so ridiculous. I really like this movie, but there were a couple of potential plot holes in the story:

• how does Wallace learn that there is a child? the discovery is made by the LAPD, and the lieutenant wouldn't be the one to divulge things about it, the ME, Coco, gets murdered by Luv later; maybe it was the other cop in the room.
• how doe Joe learn that Wallace plans to move Deckard off-world? Does the replicant underground somehow learn of it and informs him?

[Aemon Stark]

I have to watch it again, but I assume Luv got tipped off by some of K's questions when he visited the Wallace HQ.