Weirwood thrones. And who sits on them

[AlaskanSandman]

14 minutes ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I don't think so, but that's a very creative, and viable, suggestion. 

I agree. This is why the Maesters comment works so well though. On it's own, its sensible. Untill you actually start looking at everything else Imo. 

[Reekazoid]

On ‎10‎/‎9‎/‎2017 at 4:33 PM, LiveFirstDieLater said:

Given that a Weirwood throne was probably carved from a Weirwood that was cut down, isn't it possible that this would have been a symbol of the Andal Arryn conquest of the first men's Veil.

A very litteral taking of the throne... chopping down the Heart tree of the previous rulers, which may have literally housed the ancestors of that family or at least their memories, and making it into a throne for themselves.

 Maybe a way legitimize themselves to an extent before their conquered subjects?  Yes we have strange gods and funny names and we kicked your ass, but really we're legitimately and divinely entitled to rule by the old gods, *and* the new. 

*knocks on throne*  See? Weirwood, just like your old kings. We're practically one and the same!

[AlaskanSandman]

20 minutes ago, Reekazoid said:

 

I should also point out that Preston Jacobs has an interesting series on Sweet Robin and that chair being a device able to allow some one to enter into Sweet Robins Dreams.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNgGIgXmOAw&list=PLCsx_OFEYH6vAkHO0gakDrZ8Kuteu-nUn&index=5

Its an interesting idea. Especially given that no weirwood would grow there so the Old Gods would have no power there with out potentially bringing that chair up there.

[Reekazoid]

5 minutes ago, AlaskanSandman said:

I hear what your saying and i tried touching upon this in a comment above about Dragon Steel being made from the Weirwood trees. The magic is in the trees, no matter alive or dead. Weirwood petrifies to stone also, meaning all this black magical stone we see, could just be the black trees petrified. Given an asteroid wouldnt leave enough material to build two giant cities.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/148774-dawn-valyrian-steel-the-black-white-trees/

All the power seems to derive from the trees. Look at the what im saying about the Grey King's legend too. Dragons and Magical fire born of the Trees.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/148826-the-grey-king-ygg-and-naggas-living-fire/

 

Well... Hmm. All of that is prerty good. Plus the weirwood arrows at Torrhen's Square... Morna's mask.. 

 Still  not convinced   it'd be a full bandwidth pipe to the weirnet, but even the echoes of it would have power.  

 Alright, I'm sold. This weirwood throne counts as a Weirwood Throne.

 If I wasn't on my phone I'd throw out an idea i have about what reigning from a weirwood throne could actually mean.

 

 This meta is addicting.

[AlaskanSandman]

3 minutes ago, Reekazoid said:

Well... Hmm. All of that is prerty good. Plus the weirwood arrows at Torrhen's Square... Morna's mask.. 

 Still  not convinced   it'd be a full bandwidth pipe to the weirnet, but even the echoes of it would have power.  

 Alright, I'm sold. This weirwood throne counts as a Weirwood Throne.

 If I wasn't on my phone I'd throw out an idea i have about what reigning from a weirwood throne could actually mean.

 

 This meta is addicting.

Hahaha Though i definitely think there is something here going on. Im also quick to distrust anyyy visions or dreams coming from anything to do with those Trees, Petrified trees, or Fire possibly born out of those trees (Fire visions and dream visions). We know you can enter dreams via Glass Candles and those darned Trees (Weirwood Paste/Shade of the Evening). 

This gives us possible players Glass Candles- Urrathon Night Walker, The Citidel, Maester Marwyn, and Quiathe. Warlocks?

The Trees, black or white- The CotF, Bloodraven, The Green Men, The Warlocks and the Undying.

[Javelin Catcher]

Thank you for the response to the idea of weirwood throne having significance and not just symbolic 

 

[Reekazoid]

41 minutes ago, AlaskanSandman said:

Hahaha Though i definitely think there is something here going on. Im also quick to distrust anyyy visions or dreams coming from anything to do with those Trees, Petrified trees, or Fire possibly born out of those trees (Fire visions and dream visions). We know you can enter dreams via Glass Candles and those darned Trees (Weirwood Paste/Shade of the Evening). 

This gives us possible players Glass Candles- Urrathon Night Walker, The Citidel, Maester Marwyn, and Quiathe. Warlocks?

The Trees, black or white- The CotF, Bloodraven, The Green Men, The Warlocks and the Undying.

 Plus Leyton Hightower, imho.

[AlaskanSandman]

9 minutes ago, Javelin Catcher said:

Thank you for the response to the idea of weirwood throne having significance and not just symbolic 

 

Your welcome!  and much respect to the others as their views are equally as legit, but it is nice to ponder beyond what we're told at face value.

[AlaskanSandman]

10 minutes ago, Reekazoid said:

 Plus Leyton Hightower, imho.

Agreed! I think he has the Green one. Given they were the Green party in the Dance of the Dragons, it would seem fitting. Plus their deeper tie to dragons and Garth the Green.

[White Ravens]

6 hours ago, AlaskanSandman said:

Pretty sure that chapter has been out for months but either way it doesn't spoil anything really.

And sure it does, it means that for 6 or something years, that this is all he wanted people to know. Only adding confusion later. Through the Maesters no less, who can't make ass from elbows half the time. Was the Bracken/Blackwood tree poisoning 1000 years ago or 500. Andal Invasion, 6k, 4k or 2k years ago. Alyssa Arryn 4k or 2k years ago. The Long night was 12k, 10k or 8k or something. Did the Andals carve axes and stars or hammers and stars. Did the COTF leave when the Andals came, or before the Andals came. Was the ancient sea faring race that existed before the Valyrians, the Valyrians? Sure why not! The Maesters are just sooooooooo smart. Were the Iron Islanders among the first men who crossed the Arm of Dorne even though they didn't sail? Sure!!! Why not???? Who built all these round towered constructions? Must be the Andal!! 

First men didn't have writting???? Sure!!!! Why not!!!! Sounds good!!! Never mind that runes are a written language and can be hand written or carved!!!! We'll just ignore that fact, because hey, the Maesters say so. 

The Maesters, who had runes for writing, who have been around since Uthor of the Hightowers' son's since around the time of Garth the Green and the Age of Heroes, but sure, the Maesters dont know anything beyond what those Andal Septons recorded for them 'thousands' of years after the fact. Never mind the fact that the above passages show that the Age of Heroes lasted long after the Long Night and that the Andals invaded during the peak of Iron born expansion in the West while Theon Stark is the pivot point needed to anchor these events. 

Never mind that despite the Maesters claim, the history of event's actually show us that the two men can indeed be the same guy. 

But sure, go with the Maesters answer. 

I think you can tell that I've already gone with what the Maesters say.  If you are going to argue through hyperbole, sarcasm and exageration do you have to make me read so many words of it?  There should be a character limit on this sort of thing.  But thanks for at least limiting yourself to clusters of question marks and explanation marks.  Bolded allcaps would have been over the top so early in our dialogue. 

[LiveFirstDieLater]

On 10/9/2017 at 5:26 PM, Javelin Catcher said:

I have been following the thread on Naggas ribs being weirwood trees, but have a question:  the Arryns were Andals, but sat a weirwood throne. Was the Eyrie built by the first men?  And how does this weirwood throne fit with other legends?

 

16 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

I don't think so, but that's a very creative, and viable, suggestion. 

The Eyrie was build by Artis Arryn's Grandson... the original seat of house Arryn was the Gates of the Moon, which I can't find any evidence of having a Godswood. However, it is right next to the path up the Giant's Lance, future site of the Eyrie, and where supposedly Artys Arryn defeated the Griphon King.

We know the Royces were once the Bronze Kings... then near the end had United the First Men of the Vale, Mountains of the Moon, and Fingers under their rule. The last king Royce was defeated at the Gates of the Moon (by Artys Arryn), even though their seat is Runestone on the eastern coast. I don't know if Runestone has a Godswood.

Artsy Arryn won the Battle of Seven Stars, making himself King of Mountain and Vale.

He won this battle by using a goat track on the Giant's Lance to take the First Men from behind after dressing up an imposter to serve as a distraction.

I certainly think it's possible that this is part of why he is conflated with the Age of Heroes character the Winged Knight.

He did climb the mountain to overthrow a king (one could even say he flew up the mountain in secret with his knights) it was just a Royce not a Griphon king he defeated.

However, back to the Weirwood throne... The Gates of the Moon appears to have been the first seat of power for Artys Arryn and was located where he defeated the last Royce King. However, as I said above, I don't think there is mention of a Godswood there.

Why was King Royce and his First Men Army entrenched here at all (litterelly spiked trenches and all)?

The choice of this location for the First Men's last stand appears significant, especially since it isn't their King's seat of power.

I'd throw out the idea that the Giants Lance served as the Godswood for the First Men, wether there was a castle or not (maybe a ringfort), I suspect there was a Weirwood (and accompanying enthroned rooted corpses) atop the Giant's Lance. 

Artys Arryn likely cut down the tree and then descended the mountain to take the First Men in the rear... The tree serving as the wood for the Arryn throne is symbolic, as I tried to point out at first, of the Andal Conquest. But of course there are further implications.

It is no surprise to me that Artys's Grandson would build the Eyrie where the First Men had had their Godswood throne, and no surprise that he would be unable to grow a Weirwood. Forgetting the rocky soil for a moment, it seems to me that Weirwoods require human sacrifice to grow, and that there doesn't seem to be any reason an Andal House would know any of the secrets to growing Weirwoods. Frankly an argument could be made that the Arryns are usurpers, sitting on a weirwood throne that rightfully belongs to the Royces (and might be made from their family's Weirwood).

But this is just my speculation, so season heavily with salt and all that... cheers

[cpg2016]

I think the answer is a combination of the symbolic (weirwoods are holy to First Men, and therefore might help bind recalcitrant First Man Houses like the Royces to the Arryns) and practical - weirwoods don't rot.  Symbolism + practicality is great.