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Crazy Ex-Girlfriend S4 - We Want to Be Here [spoilers]


HexMachina

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7 hours ago, Buckwheat said:

This finale was brilliant. I was glued to the screen the whole time.

Yes. Though I’m guessing you weren’t a fan of the birthing song since Maybe This Dream was too vulgar for you :P 

Me, I loved that song...I wonder what this says about me? :D 

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32 minutes ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Yes. Though I’m guessing you weren’t a fan of the birthing song since Maybe This Dream was too vulgar for you :P 

Me, I loved that song...I wonder what this says about me? :D 

Oh, I liked it. :P As soon as I realised there was going to be a song with beautiful imagery and nice lyrical tune, I expected very graphic lyrics, because that is what this show does (see also: Maybe This Dream, OMG I Think I Like You). I also like the song about UTI, so I don't necessarily dislike everything about bodily functions. (Hate the crappy song from Valencia, though.) Here is the demo recording of the Miracle. The article also has a nice picture of a whiteboard with the whole season plotted out.

Maybe it says it is time for you to start planning a family? :lol:

Actually, the other song weirded me out a lot more. I just really hoped it was not real and was going to be subverted - I was pretty sure the nobody's fault was going to be, but I was not so sure about the love part, and the episode didn't give closure on that. I would hate it if Rebecca and Nathaniel have any sort of romantic connection from now on. Nathaniel really needs to learn to move on. Also, I have never noticed this before, but he sounded like an inferior singer than she is in that song. Rebecca's voice sounds so much richer and more expressive in the duet.

Do you have any other comments?

Here are just a few thoughts from me:

This show is great and brilliant and awesome and beautiful and everything. The best parts of the season were the first few episodes and the last two - the part in between with the pregnancy and all was a bit weird.

I think they wanted to make it so that the baby not-Heabecca (please, Darryl, change that name now) is part of what Rebecca needs to take responsibility for in the next season. She started to do that in the last episode, but she needs to do a lot more work to atone - not sure how that will unfold, but thinking about how she has passed on her genes to a child she will not be raising herself on a whim is something that is probably going to play a role. I think the pregnancy storyline was rushed though - Heather was supposed to battle with a situation she couldn't quit, but I think the plot was underdeveloped.

Also, where the hell is Madison here? The older sister is one of the first people who should get to know the baby, no?

Valencia didn't have a whole lot to do in the whole season, like they didn't know what to do with her ... I hope in the next season, they either write her out or give her something meaningful to do. Same with Josh.

Poor Mona. She seems like a normal, good person, if a bit too forgiving, but certainly very much into Nathaniel. She just got cheated on for almost a year, then when the guy and she just moved in together, she was dumped almost the next day, and on her housewarming party, there was an attempted murder. She is going to need some extra sessions with Mr. Dr. Akopian.

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Lengthy article detailing the work that went into filming and editing and directing (etc.) the finale. http://www.vulture.com/2018/02/crazy-ex-girlfriend-season-3-finale.html 

On 2/17/2018 at 8:57 PM, Buckwheat said:

Oh, I liked it. :P As soon as I realised there was going to be a song with beautiful imagery and nice lyrical tune, I expected very graphic lyrics, because that is what this show does (see also: Maybe This Dream, OMG I Think I Like You). I also like the song about UTI, so I don't necessarily dislike everything about bodily functions. (Hate the crappy song from Valencia, though.) Here is the demo recording of the Miracle. The article also has a nice picture of a whiteboard with the whole season plotted out.

Maybe it says it is time for you to start planning a family? :lol:

Actually, the other song weirded me out a lot more. I just really hoped it was not real and was going to be subverted - I was pretty sure the nobody's fault was going to be, but I was not so sure about the love part, and the episode didn't give closure on that. I would hate it if Rebecca and Nathaniel have any sort of romantic connection from now on. Nathaniel really needs to learn to move on. Also, I have never noticed this before, but he sounded like an inferior singer than she is in that song. Rebecca's voice sounds so much richer and more expressive in the duet.

Do you have any other comments?

Here are just a few thoughts from me:

This show is great and brilliant and awesome and beautiful and everything. The best parts of the season were the first few episodes and the last two - the part in between with the pregnancy and all was a bit weird.

I think they wanted to make it so that the baby not-Heabecca (please, Darryl, change that name now) is part of what Rebecca needs to take responsibility for in the next season. She started to do that in the last episode, but she needs to do a lot more work to atone - not sure how that will unfold, but thinking about how she has passed on her genes to a child she will not be raising herself on a whim is something that is probably going to play a role. I think the pregnancy storyline was rushed though - Heather was supposed to battle with a situation she couldn't quit, but I think the plot was underdeveloped.

Also, where the hell is Madison here? The older sister is one of the first people who should get to know the baby, no?

Valencia didn't have a whole lot to do in the whole season, like they didn't know what to do with her ... I hope in the next season, they either write her out or give her something meaningful to do. Same with Josh.

Poor Mona. She seems like a normal, good person, if a bit too forgiving, but certainly very much into Nathaniel. She just got cheated on for almost a year, then when the guy and she just moved in together, she was dumped almost the next day, and on her housewarming party, there was an attempted murder. She is going to need some extra sessions with Mr. Dr. Akopian.

The second song was definitely troubling, though deliberately so. That doesn't become obvious until the stuff about Hitler, but it's pretty well done. As for the love stuff, the point seems to be Nathan loves Rebecca in spite of the irresponsible actions and damaging behaviours. Which is touching (see the article posted regarding what the song almost was, it gives you some insight into how the writers view Nathan and Rebecca) but still not great. Because Nathan doesn't care if she accepts responsibility and tries to change, in fact he might even encourage her craziness. Whereas Paula, having grown since we first met her, now wants Rebecca to change and accept responsibility for her actions like Paula has begun to do. And the Court scene and speech (which was awesome) shows Rebecca choose Paula and change over Nathan and denial. Sort of like choosing her ego over her id. 

I liked the whole season but agree with you that the beginning (episodes up to Rebecca's suicide attempt) were the strongest, and I liked the musical numbers in those the best too. I can't even begin to pick a favourite this season, though Let's Generalise About Men has to go down as a classic...

I think season four, again after reading the article from Vulture, will focus on Rebecca rebuilding herself after bottoming out. The latter half of season 3 (post suicide attempt) laid the groundwork for this, but showed that 'life doesn't make narrative sense' (sorry, last time I reference that I promise...) and had Rebecca take one step forward two back and spin in circles through her recovery - just like most people do! I did love her talk with Dr. Akopian though, showing she has grown somewhat.

I liked Heather's brief manager arc. I'd have liked to see more of that than the baby arc personally.

Forget Madison, where the hell is Karen? Is she having a manic episode? 

Side note, I loved all the references to song titles in the finale. There were a few obvious ones and a few less obvious but all made me laugh. "This isn't a group hang in just having a few people over." "After everything she did for you that you didn't ask for!" And there were others which I forgot for now, will think of them on a rewatch.

Valencia had small moments of growth but yes she was short changed. Maybe a byproduct of her not being intended as a long term character in the beginning. I think originally she was in one episode in season one?

Josh got more focus than Valencia but I think his lessened screen time was intentional - Josh is Irrelevant was really very good at cutting to the heart of things as an episode title. Rebecca's obsession was never strictly speaking about Josh, it could have been anyone.

Couple of miscellaneous thoughts; 

Maya's obnoxious millenialisms are hilarious. "Awkward turtle." :lol:

Rachel Bloom is a brilliant actress and singer and all around superstar and deserves literally all the awards. 

The work that goes into this show is crazy...I'm, no pun intended. You do don't want to be crazy.  

There was supposed to be a "Settle for Her" number that had to be scrapped because Scott Michael Foster was sick. This was presumably where the Settle for Me instrumental was playing in the background. Damnit I want this song now :(

 

Edit: oh ok, we linked the same article. I did read the rest of your post I promise :P I just didn't open the link...

 

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Okay, I can see you guys liked the finale. 

I thought the whole season was sort of a pointless circle. It seemed like we were going to get somewhere but we didn’t, after all. We went back to that same starting point. Something bad, deep and meaningful happened and we are expecting Rebecca to change. 

I got the feeling that they are running out ideas about what to do with the story. This is why Rebecca kept running in circles, very little was done with Paula or Nathaniel, and literally nothing was done with Valencia or Josh or Heather. 

Darryl’s baby business was handled very stupidly with his being gone for the time when Heather was struggling with pregnancy and only being present for the shower and a birthing party. 

The one thing that could have given the finale substance would have been if Trent had actually died. Right now this is just another version of Rebecca did something terrible and she barely got away with it, so now she had an awakening and she promised to be a better person. 

I really think it’s time for me to leave this ship and tune in for the next season. 

Oh and I still can’t decide how I feel about the birth song what the message was trying to be. 

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The second song was definitely troubling, though deliberately so. That doesn't become obvious until the stuff about Hitler, but it's pretty well done. As for the love stuff, the point seems to be Nathan loves Rebecca in spite of the irresponsible actions and damaging behaviours. Which is touching (see the article posted regarding what the song almost was, it gives you some insight into how the writers view Nathan and Rebecca) but still not great. Because Nathan doesn't care if she accepts responsibility and tries to change, in fact he might even encourage her craziness. Whereas Paula, having grown since we first met her, now wants Rebecca to change and accept responsibility for her actions like Paula has begun to do. And the Court scene and speech (which was awesome) shows Rebecca choose Paula and change over Nathan and denial. Sort of like choosing her ego over her id.

Nathaniel has not learned to take responsibility. When Josh is appalled that they tried to have his father deported and his grandfather murdered, Nathaniel basically makes a joke out of it. Maybe his arc in the next season will be learning how to take responsibility over it. This whole season basically overturned the "asshole rich guy is changed by a quirky girl" trope because although Nathaniel has learned to be gentle towards Rebecca, he does not show the same sentiment towards other people.

He loves her, yes, but I am very doubtful she loves him too. She was obviously very sexually attracted to him, but with her, it is hard to tell if she has some deep feelings of understanding, trust, wanting to be mature with him. The part where she was afraid of starting a relationship with him because she might do terrible things was an excellent point and it gave us a kickass Face Your Fears reprise, but I think that plot point was underdeveloped - they should have spent more time on this dilemma. And also probably not with the guy who at the time was in a relationship with another girl.

Although, this show really just ends up confusing me on what love actually is. It is not just sexual attraction. It is not obsession. It is not secret pining. Rebecca does not have a healthy pattern in her head to follow on what she has to do to have a mature trustful relationship with somebody. When she might have a chance at that, she will probably reject it because it is too mundane, she is always looking for grand dramatic scenes and gestures (like her expectation of the wedding in S1).

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I liked the whole season but agree with you that the beginning (episodes up to Rebecca's suicide attempt) were the strongest, and I liked the musical numbers in those the best too. I can't even begin to pick a favourite this season, though Let's Generalise About Men has to go down as a classic...

I could never just say "this is my favourite song" of them all. There are plenty that I like and for different reasons. I think the strongest are Head in the Clouds, Strip Away My Conscience, Buzzing in the Bathroom (purely because of the singing), After Everything You Made Me Do, The End of the Movie ... okay, many, but I agree, most of these are before the diagnosis. I think the only one that is really at the top from there on is A Diagnosis. Which is still in the good part of the season, only it went down with Valencia's song there which was probably the worst.

But we have to take some time to relisten to stuff to be more objective. I think I was wrong about Nothing Was Ever Anyone's Fault - maybe Rachel really has richer singing voice, but when I listen to it again, there is nothing wrong with Nathaniel singing either, he just sounds a bit like a Disney character in the beginning. Which is possibly the point. :P

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I think season four, again after reading the article from Vulture, will focus on Rebecca rebuilding herself after bottoming out. The latter half of season 3 (post suicide attempt) laid the groundwork for this, but showed that 'life doesn't make narrative sense' (sorry, last time I reference that I promise...) and had Rebecca take one step forward two back and spin in circles through her recovery - just like most people do! I did love her talk with Dr. Akopian though, showing she has grown somewhat.

You can make as many references to any CXG song as you want any time! Especially from this song, which, if I were to choose the top songs from the series, would be a strong contender. ;) Whatever this show is, we are clearly obsessed with it! You checked Rachel Bloom's twitter 36 times, her instagram 14 times. (Yes, this is also a reference.)

I hope the fourth season is announced soon!

She has definitely grown. She is now responsible for her actions, and it is not her illness who does stuff for her. I would actually like more expansion of what are Rebecca's personal character traits and what are BPD symptoms in her behaviour.

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I liked Heather's brief manager arc. I'd have liked to see more of that than the baby arc personally.

Completely agreed. I think the point was to stick her into a situation where she couldn't quit, but the decision was quite random, out of character, and the plot was, again, underdeveloped. It did not show enough of her struggle. That is what I think is the ultimate problem with the episodes somewhere between 8 and 11 - they wanted to squeeze in so much plot and so many different plotlines that none of it was fully realised because they ran out of time. I count these examples:

  • Heather being in a situation she cannot quit and the whole pregnancy
  • Valencia's sexuality AND her business - that was not even a coherent story, just some random scenes
  • conflict between Paula and Rebecca - that should have started to develop much earlier, like with Paula harshly criticising Rebecca's decisions to stalk Nathaniel's father, to donate an egg, to sue Nathaniel ... they had the chances in the story, just probably no time. Maybe the last episode would have been even more impactful if that had happened.
  • Josh's struggle with growing up and finding a place to live and a job ended up unresolved somewhere in the middle - but okay, that does not seem like a big oversight, it can freely continue next season.
  • Rebecca's dilemma about not wanting to start a relationship because she is afraid - as I said, great point to develop, but it stayed ... just there
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Forget Madison, where the hell is Karen? Is she having a manic episode?

She left work at Whitefeather's to be a model. I am sorry, but I really don't miss Karen as much as you seem to. She was not presented as an important character for somebody's identity. Madison, on the other hand ... remember I Love My Daughter (but not in a creepy way)? The battle for custody? His desperation when he was home alone when she visited her mother? There is literally a scene in the finale when Darryl points at a room full of random people - Valencia, and Beth, really? What are they doing here? - and says "this is my family" - and there is absence of maybe the most important person in his life. Who, coincidentally, is also going to have to live with that baby, so it will impact her life so much - probably more than any of the other people in the room. The more that I think of it, the more the absence of Madison mentions pisses me off. It is like Darryl did not even stop to think how having another child will impact the one he already has.

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Side note, I loved all the references to song titles in the finale. There were a few obvious ones and a few less obvious but all made me laugh. "This isn't a group hang in just having a few people over." "After everything she did for you that you didn't ask for!" And there were others which I forgot for now, will think of them on a rewatch.

They are having a soirée. ;)Like Darryl.

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Valencia had small moments of growth but yes she was short changed. Maybe a byproduct of her not being intended as a long term character in the beginning. I think originally she was in one episode in season one?

Yup, I think so too. She just had some scenes in this season, but they did not feel like a connected story to me.

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Josh got more focus than Valencia but I think his lessened screen time was intentional - Josh is Irrelevant was really very good at cutting to the heart of things as an episode title. Rebecca's obsession was never strictly speaking about Josh, it could have been anyone.

Yes.

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Couple of miscellaneous thoughts; 

Maya's obnoxious millenialisms are hilarious. "Awkward turtle." :lol:

I have never heard of that phrase before.

Quote

Rachel Bloom is a brilliant actress and singer and all around superstar and deserves literally all the awards. 

The work that goes into this show is crazy...I'm, no pun intended. You do don't want to be crazy.  

Yes.

Also, I saw somewhere on the internet the nice comment about Rebecca's final dilemma - plead insanity or not - ties into "You do / you don't wanna be crazy." Think about that. :wub:

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There was supposed to be a "Settle for Her" number that had to be scrapped because Scott Michael Foster was sick. This was presumably where the Settle for Me instrumental was playing in the background. Damnit I want this song now :(

Maybe Mona should sing that. Settling for a cheating soul-sucking corporate piece of trash, who only cares about sex, lies, and cash. ;)

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Edit: oh ok, we linked the same article. I did read the rest of your post I promise :P I just didn't open the link...

I see your link and I raise you an adorable video with a plastic placenta.

Do you think we are supposed to think Maya, Tim and George saw Trent holding the knife over Nathaniel? The editing in that scene is so weird.

1 hour ago, RhaenysB said:

Oh and I still can’t decide how I feel about the birth song what the message was trying to be. 

That birth is painful and disgusting.

ETA: Whoops, sorry for the too long post. :blushing:

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3 hours ago, Buckwheat said:

[awful long die hard fan monster post] 

That birth is painful and disgusting.

ETA: Whoops, sorry for the too long post. :blushing:

Well that’s it, birth is not disgusting. It’s a natural function of the body. I mean you could make a song about how disgusting eating is, what happens to food in your mouth and then in your digestive system. You could say that any bodily function is disgusting. But why?

Well, I just don’t have any chemistry with this show at all. But it’s so fun and adorable to see you guys obsess over it, like every Helena or Buckwheat post I see is a CXG reference :D 

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Someone seemingly did make the effort to rank the songs this season. And here it is! 

https://www.npr.org/sections/monkeysee/2018/02/21/587275147/the-25-songs-of-crazy-ex-girlfriend-season-3-rigorously-and-definitively-ranked?utm_campaign=storyshare&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social

Don't necessarily agree. Very surprised to see The Moment is Me at the top, not because it's bad but I find many others better. But then I guess if you take each so g separately from the visuals as this ranking does it makes some more sense. Maybe I'll attempt my own ranking sooner or later. I totally haven't been adding each song to my Spotify playlist after each episode aired and listening to them on repeat...

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So your post inspired me to find a playlist of all the songs on Spotify and I've been listening on and off all day.

My favorite from season 1 are I'm So Good At Yoga, and California Christmastime.

Season 2 definitely The Math of Love Triangles, and It Was A Shit Show, and We Tapped That AssYou Go First is pretty great.

Season 3: The Buzzing From The Bathroom.   First Penis I Saw.    My Sperm Is Healthy.

 

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@HelenaExMachina I am not sure, but I have a feeling that putting The Moment Is Me is being ironic ... I mean, it is a cool song, and very funny for Heather's performance (and the two backup dancers!), but it is not one that is central to Rebecca's development or central issues in the show. It is also not a vocal standout - yes, I know that is the point. The lyrics are funny because they are so over-the-top cheesy and clichéd, but not that witty in their own right.

It also puts Head in the Clouds below I Feel Like this isn't about Me. Which is just wrong. :P

I would put these higher: Back in Action (people don't like this song?), Where's Rebecca Bunch (I enjoy the dialogue between the choir and Rebecca's solo), Head in the Clouds.

And these I would put lower: This is Movement, I Go to the Zoo, The Moment is Me.

My favourites from the season are probably Strip Away My Conscience, A Diagnosis, The End of the Movie, Fit Hot Guys Have Problems Too (but we don't have a problem staring at them, hihi ;) ), Head in the Clouds (yes, I am partial to tapdancing, why do you ask? :P ), and Rebecca's reprise of After Everything I've Done for You that she sings in the church. If I were to rank them in a linear order, I would probably put The End of the Movie highest, followed by either Strip Away My Conscience or A Diagnosis.

ETA: Oh, and I'm Just a Boy In Love! Can't forget that, it was the funniest thing in the whole season. :lol:

ETA2: And here is a mashup of both the original and Trent's song, so you can see how the choreography and the camera shots match.

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  • 1 month later...
On 23/02/2018 at 5:28 AM, SpaceChampion said:

So your post inspired me to find a playlist of all the songs on Spotify and I've been listening on and off all day.

My favorite from season 1 are I'm So Good At Yoga, and California Christmastime.

Season 2 definitely The Math of Love Triangles, and It Was A Shit Show, and We Tapped That AssYou Go First is pretty great.

Season 3: The Buzzing From The Bathroom.   First Penis I Saw.    My Sperm Is Healthy.

 

Ok going to try and do this too. Top 3 per season:

Season 1:

I Gave You a UTI

After Everything I’ve Done for You

Oh My God I Think I like You

Season 2:

Math of Love Triangles

Friendtopia

It was a Shitshow

Season 3:

End of the Movie

Nothing is Ever Anyone’s Fault

Lets Generalise About Men

 

well that was very difficult :( I changed it at least four times :P 

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On 4/4/2018 at 3:07 AM, Lady Olenna said:

Binged and finished :) 

I’m not as smitten as others but I like it. Trent seriously makes me want to turn the mute on during any of his scenes (yes I know it’s meant to but dang). 

Trent is hilarious every time he appears slightly more.

7 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Ok going to try and do this too. Top 3 per season:

Season 1:

I Gave You a UTI

After Everything I’ve Done for You

Oh My God I Think I like You

Wait, no You Ruined Everything, You Stupid Bitch? :o No original West Covina, Califooooorniaaaa? What about Settle For Me?

OMG I Think I Like You is a good pick. Good song. The one that comes closest to being unironical love song about feelings.

7 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Season 2:

Math of Love Triangles

Friendtopia

It was a Shitshow

And where is We Tapped That Ass? I also cherish Rebecca's Reprise and Patrick highly.

7 hours ago, HelenaExMachina said:

Season 3:

End of the Movie

Nothing is Ever Anyone’s Fault

Lets Generalise About Men

That comes closest to what I would pick, but still ...

This is hard, it has sooo many great songs that narrowing it down to "best of" must necessarily leave out some great stuff.

I mean, I am sure nobody misses Makeover or Having A Few People Over, but still ...

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