Relic Posted October 22, 2017 Author Share Posted October 22, 2017 47 minutes ago, briantw said: I don't think Calderon specifically had anything to do with that loss. It seemed like your standard no effort regular season Cavs loss. Lord knows I've seen entirely too many of those fucking things since LeBron came back. The Cavs really need to move Wade to the bench, though. The spacing with him and Rose just doesn't work. I think JR should probably be starting on this team. Wade definitely needs to come off the bench. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 10 hours ago, briantw said: The Cavs really need to move Wade to the bench, though. The spacing with him and Rose just doesn't work. A problem that looks like it will quickly resolve itself as Rose is already injured after two games. Speaking of injured players, one should hope that this video of Kahwi Leonard's shambling up a a flight of stairs is staged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
briantw Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 7 minutes ago, Calibandar said: A problem that looks like it will quickly resolve itself as Rose is already injured after two games. Speaking of injured players, one should hope that this video of Kahwi Leonard's shambling up a a flight of stairs is staged. I read that he had his knee wrapped in ice (post-practice I believe) when this was shot and thus couldn't bend it. So it looked much worse than it actually was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 That sounds much more plausible to me than the idea that this was a practical joke by Kahwi Leonard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/21/2017 at 5:27 PM, Relic said: As a Knick fan I'd trade Porzingis for Tatum and Smart in a nanosecond. WHAT???? I don't think Tatum will be bad or anything. I think he's a high floor, low ceiling guy with fringe all-star potential. Like a David Lee type. I just think this was a great draft and that's not going to crack the top 5. The idea of trading him for Porzingis is also insane. Porzingis is a 7'3" rim protector with 3 point range. He is already playing at a level higher than Tatum's ceiling, and has significantly more growth potential. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share Posted October 23, 2017 1 hour ago, sperry said: WHAT???? I don't think Tatum will be bad or anything. I think he's a high floor, low ceiling guy with fringe all-star potential. Like a David Lee type. I just think this was a great draft and that's not going to crack the top 5. The idea of trading him for Porzingis is also insane. Porzingis is a 7'3" rim protector with 3 point range. He is already playing at a level higher than Tatum's ceiling, and has significantly more growth potential. First of all, Tatum is on a long term contract, and Smart is on a value contract. Second, I value Tatum more than you, and value Porzingis less. Yeah he can shoot the 3, and yeah he blocks some shots, but the dude can't stay out of foul trouble, and his defense is over rated. He also rebounds at the rate of a shooting guard, which isn't a great sign. Besides, after next year he's likely moving on to greener pastures (pun intended). FWIW, I'm a life long Knick fan and we are probably the most pessimistic fans in all of sports. So maybe my vision is a bit clouded on this topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, Relic said: First of all, Tatum and Smart are both on long term contracts. Second, I value Tatum more than you, and value Porzingis less. Yeah he can shoot the 3, and yeah he blocks some shots, but the dude can't stay out of foul trouble, and his defense is over rated. Besides, after next year he's likely moving on to greener pastures (pun intended). Knicks have Porzingis for at least 2 more years after this one guaranteed, and that's assuming Porzingis is wililng to take a HUGE paycut to not sign the max deal the Knicks will offer him. Also, Smart isn't on a long term contract. This is a contract year for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share Posted October 23, 2017 1 hour ago, sperry said: Knicks have Porzingis for at least 2 more years after this one guaranteed, and that's assuming Porzingis is wililng to take a HUGE paycut to not sign the max deal the Knicks will offer him. Also, Smart isn't on a long term contract. This is a contract year for him. Opps, i misread Smart's contract deets. Ok, fuck him, I'll take Tatum and some future picks from the Celtics. Zingis has 2 years left, you're right. Not sure why i thought rookies got 4 year deals. Anyway, im not willing to die on this hill, but im nowhere near as high on Zingis as a lot of other people. I think he's a great fit in a good system, but he's not a #1 guy, and likely never will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 6 minutes ago, Relic said: Opps, i misread Smart's contract deets. Ok, fuck him, I'll take Tatum and some future picks from the Celtics. Zingis has 2 years left, you're right. Not sure why i thought rookies got 4 year deals. Anyway, im not willing to die on this hill, but im nowhere near as high on Zingis as a lot of other people. I think he's a great fit in a good system, but he's not a #1 guy, and likely never will be. He's definitely got a ways to go to getting to #1 status. I just see low (relatively) low ceiling with Tatum. I think that's okay with the Celtics who have a lot of good players already, but I do not think he's close to a build around guy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 The Wolves-Thunder game yesterday was a lot of fun, and Wiggins game winning shot was insane. Both of these teams are going to be must watch all season. As far as KP goes, I wouldn’t trade him for Tatum, but I also don’t think you can build a team around him. He has to be your third best player if you want to build a championship quality team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 20 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: The Wolves-Thunder game yesterday was a lot of fun, and Wiggins game winning shot was insane. Both of these teams are going to be must watch all season. As far as KP goes, I wouldn’t trade him for Tatum, but I also don’t think you can build a team around him. He has to be your third best player if you want to build a championship quality team. This is insane to me. http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/3102531/kristaps-porzingis , who happens to be 22 years old, needs to be the third best player on your team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Also, I'm looking for a decent website to get stats and box scores. I used to use ESPN, but the autoplay videos on every page are a dealbreaker for me. What does everyone use? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 22 minutes ago, sperry said: This is insane to me. http://www.espn.com/nba/player/_/id/3102531/kristaps-porzingis , who happens to be 22 years old, needs to be the third best player on your team? That’s an incredibly small and thus meaningless sample size. I’m looking at the totality of what I’ve seen out of him. I think at his peak he’ll average 22-24ppg, 8rpg and 2bpg. That’s nothing to scoff at, but it’s also not enough in the modern NBA to be your best player and contend for anything, especially when you consider some of his other limitations. Also, try basketball reference. https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/porzikr01.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share Posted October 23, 2017 13 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: That’s an incredibly small and thus meaningless sample size. I’m looking at the totality of what I’ve seen out of him. I think at his peak he’ll average 22-24ppg, 8rpg and 2bpg. That’s nothing to scoff at, but it’s also not enough in the modern NBA to be your best player and contend for anything, especially when you consider some of his other limitations. Also, try basketball reference. https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/porzikr01.html Let's play the trading game. Who could the Knicks deal with? Zingis and the loser they draft in July for Anthony Davis? To the Cavs for Love and the BK pick? Nuggets for a few dudes and a pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 42 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said: That’s an incredibly small and thus meaningless sample size. I’m looking at the totality of what I’ve seen out of him. I think at his peak he’ll average 22-24ppg, 8rpg and 2bpg. That’s nothing to scoff at, but it’s also not enough in the modern NBA to be your best player and contend for anything, especially when you consider some of his other limitations. Also, try basketball reference. https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/porzikr01.html I'm interested in why you think he'll peak at that? For what it's worth, you're probably right on rebounds and blocks, but those numbers show that he's got high 20s, 30 ppg potential. That's with range beyond the arc and quality defense. That's an elite NBA player. He's not guaranteed to get there, as I'm concerned about injuries, but still. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 47 minutes ago, Relic said: Let's play the trading game. Who could the Knicks deal with? Zingis and the loser they draft in July for Anthony Davis? To the Cavs for Love and the BK pick? Nuggets for a few dudes and a pick? Trade value in the NBA is tricky to gauge. Just look at the Kyrie and Butler trades. I think it’s safe to say that Butler is the better player and yet the Cavs got a lot more in return for Kyrie (assuming IT is right come playoff time). And I have no idea what KP’s trade value is. Two top 10 picks? A top 5 pick and another lottery pick and a player? I honestly don’t know, but I don’t believe any of the trades you listed would happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share Posted October 23, 2017 7 minutes ago, sperry said: I'm interested in why you think he'll peak at that? For what it's worth, you're probably right on rebounds and blocks, but those numbers show that he's got high 20s, 30 ppg potential. That's with range beyond the arc and quality defense. That's an elite NBA player. He's not guaranteed to get there, as I'm concerned about injuries, but still. Something about him doesn't pass my "eye test". Totally subjective, obviously. His foul rate is waaaaaay too high, his rebounding way too low, and his low post game is poop at this point. He's got a lot of potential but the Knicks will ruin him. He needs to go to a good system, like the Celtics, Spurs, Rockets, Miami... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weeping Sore Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 In other news Giannis Antetokounpo seems to have taken a big step forward scoring 37, 34, & 44 in his first three games. Literally hard to believe your eyes seeing a seven footer move like that. Best Milwaukee Buck since Lew Alcindor? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Chatywin et al. Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 20 minutes ago, sperry said: I'm interested in why you think he'll peak at that? For what it's worth, you're probably right on rebounds and blocks, but those numbers show that he's got high 20s, 30 ppg potential. That's with range beyond the arc and quality defense. That's an elite NBA player. He's not guaranteed to get there, as I'm concerned about injuries, but still. That’s just two games though. His career average over 140 games is 16.3ppg. I’d trust that number more. Now obviously it will go up with time, but I can’t see him realistically averaging 30ppg for an entire season. And the main reason besides injuries is his height and frame. I’m not sure he’ll ever be strong enough to play consistently in the post and that will lead to him getting beat up over the course of a season. And look, I’m not trying to say that he’s bad by any means, just that he and his skills get over hyped because he plays for the Knicks. Casual fans wouldn’t know about him if he played on the Suns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Relic Posted October 23, 2017 Author Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, Weeping Sore said: In other news Giannis Antetokounpo seems to have taken a big step forward scoring 37, 34, & 44 in his first three games. Literally hard to believe your eyes seeing a seven footer move like that. Best Milwaukee Buck since Lew Alcindor? More incredibly his leap forward this year was the second easiest prediction to make before the season began. Dude is a straight up beast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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