U.S. Politics 2017: Yes Virginia, There Is a Santa Claus

[Rorshach]

Very off topic, but Jesus´ brother James is also mentioned in Josephus. 

Not theologically important at all, just mentioning in passing.

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

I like that. Subtle and smart.

Thanks. Trump's victory shows that Republicans are willing to ignore allegations, and even their preferred candidate verbally describing sexual assault.

These allegations against Moore are long past the statute of limitations, and unless new, more recent allegations come out, will never be deliberated in a courtroom.

But, everyone hates child abusers. And now you have Republican supporters of Moore saying, on record, that they'd vote for him even if the allegations were true. If your enemy hands you a weapon, fucking stab them with it.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

19 minutes ago, Ormond said:

Jesus definitely had siblings and this is mentioned in the New Testament more than once. Roman Catholics get around that by either assuming that somehow these brothers and sisters were really cousins, or by assuming they were Joseph's children by an earlier marriage and so were not Mary's kids. 

P.S. I had forgotten until finding the site linked below that there is a verse in the Gospel of Matthew that says Joseph did not have relations with Mary until after Jesus was born. Of course, that verse seems to imply to Protestants that Mary was not a perpetual virgin, but Catholics don't admit that implication.

https://www.thoughtco.com/did-jesus-have-brothers-and-sisters-701981

FYI, Orthodox also say Mary was always a virgin.  The story we're told is that Joseph married Mary more as someone to care for his children, being much older than Mary, than as a new "bride" for himself.

[Fez]

Not a full unendorsement, but it's a start.

Also, this:

makes me hopeful that maybe, just maybe, statutory rape is a bridge too far for Alabama voters. Albeit, it's only one poll, and a poll that was only in the field for one day.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Ormond said:

Jesus definitely had siblings and this is mentioned in the New Testament more than once. Roman Catholics get around that by either assuming that somehow these brothers and sisters were really cousins, or by assuming they were Joseph's children by an earlier marriage and so were not Mary's kids. 

P.S. I had forgotten until finding the site linked below that there is a verse in the Gospel of Matthew that says Joseph did not have relations with Mary until after Jesus was born. Of course, that verse seems to imply to Protestants that Mary was not a perpetual virgin, but Catholics don't admit that implication.

https://www.thoughtco.com/did-jesus-have-brothers-and-sisters-701981

Not trying to start a religious debate, but is it actually possible to say that we “definitely” know aspects of the life of Jesus?

[IheartIheartTesla]

I don't know much about Murkowski, but if she helps Strange do the write-in thing I might just send her a thank-you note and donate to her next campaign (thank you not only for this but also for helping sink the Obamacare repeal).

Same goes for Susan Collins (the Obamacare part).

[Ormond]

47 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

Not trying to start a religious debate, but is it actually possible to say that we “definitely” know aspects of the life of Jesus?

This is getting too far off US Politics so this is the last I will post in this thread on this topic. Please start another thread if you want more--

I was answering a question from the Kitten Guard where he was specifically asking about what the Gospels said about this. You can definitely say that the Gospels mention Jesus had brothers and sisters.

And actually the existence of his most famous sibling, James, who led the church in Jerusalem after Jesus's death, is about as sure as anything you can say about Jesus, because of a mention of him in passing in the works of the Jewish historian Josephus. (There is a longer passage about Jesus in Josephus, but that one has probably been tampered with by later Christian copiers of Josephus's works.) 

https://clas-pages.uncc.edu/james-tabor/ancient-judaism/josephus-james/

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

Devin Nunes! Dana Rohrabacher! COME ON DOWN! You're the next two contestants on The Wheel of Treason!

  https://www.rawstory.com/2017/11/revealed-devin-nunes-attended-mysterious-breakfast-meeting-with-michael-flynn-and-turkeys-foreign-minister/?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=im&utm_tracker=1737131x84899

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mueller-probing-pre-election-flynn-meeting-pro-russia-congressman-n819676?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark

 

/I can smell the MAGA from here

[Mlle. Zabzie]

3 minutes ago, Triskele said:

There does seem to be some great potential there for a split GOP vote that helps Jones win.  Getting a Senate seat in Alabama is such an appealing possibility.  It really is a testament to where the GOP is at today though that something like what Moore is accused of is not a deal-breaker.  There may be no bottom.

Dana has been guilty as Hell all along to the point that Paul Ryan and Kevin McCarthy admitted as much to a room of Republicans when they thought they weren't being recorded.  I sure have wanted to believe that Nunes was guilty of some shit too, but I'd supposed it was possible that he was just being a party shill for Trump.  I sure do hope he's in a ton of trouble over this.  

There is no bottom. This is a case where I'm pretty sure that the polls are under-counting Moore's support.  

And I doubt anything will come of the Nunes stuff.

Damn I'm getting cynical.

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

15 minutes ago, Manhole Eunuchsbane said:

Devin Nunes! Dana Rohrabacher! COME ON DOWN! You're the next two contestants on The Wheel of Treason!

  https://www.rawstory.com/2017/11/revealed-devin-nunes-attended-mysterious-breakfast-meeting-with-michael-flynn-and-turkeys-foreign-minister/?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=im&utm_tracker=1737131x84899

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mueller-probing-pre-election-flynn-meeting-pro-russia-congressman-n819676?utm_source=fark&utm_medium=website&utm_content=link&ICID=ref_fark

 

/I can smell the MAGA from here

The question is will Trump be able to smell what President-Elect The Rock is cooking in three years?

[Manhole Eunuchsbane]

1 minute ago, Tywin et al. said:

The question is will Trump be able to smell what President-Elect The Rock is cooking in three years?

/You tell that Rooty-Poot Jabroni Trump that I'm coming for the weasel that died on top of his 33 pound head!

[Martell Spy]

Quite a class act. He gets permission slips before taking teenage girls on dates. It's all on the up and up. On the one hand, he calls this fake news, but on the other he wants to assure it was all legal, whatever went on.

Roy Moore Says He Didn’t Date Any Girls Without Their Moms’ Permission

https://www.thecut.com/2017/11/roy-moore-i-didnt-date-girls-without-moms-permission.html

Bob Mueller Seems to Be Closing in on Mike Flynn — and the Indictments Could Be Explosive

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/11/bob-mueller-seems-to-be-closing-in-on-mike-flynn.html

[Fragile Bird]

A CNN reporter in Vietnam kept walking up to the Russian billionaire and oligarch Oleg Deripaska and asking if he lent Paul Manafort money and meetings with Trump were offered to cancel the multi-million (19?) dollar debt. Deripaska at  one point just says Get lost please. It's quite funny.

https://www.mediaite.com/online/watch-a-manafort-linked-russian-oligarch-comically-freeze-out-a-relentless-cnn-reporter/

[Fez]

1 hour ago, Triskele said:

There does seem to be some great potentia Getting a Senate seat in Alabama is such an appealing possibility. l there for a split GOP vote that helps Jones win. 

If Jones won, he'd almost certainly go on to lose in 2020 against a "normal" GOP candidate; but just having a two-year rental on an Alabama senate seat would be such an amazing accomplishment for Democrats. It'd mean McConnell can only lose a single vote on anything through the midterms, and it'd dramatically improve the chances that Democrats can hit 51 seats after the midterms.

Which is why the stakes are so high for Republicans; to the point that apparently they are looking into whether state law would allow the Alabama Governor to push back the election date to next year. I don't think they'll actually go that route, but if Moore did win, I could see them voting to expel him (takes 67 votes, so Democrats would need to be on board) and than having another special election.

[Fragile Bird]

An interesting fact just popped up on CNN - Roy Moore's wife is, in fact, 14 years younger than he is. I don't know when he got married, but if he got married just after the time the alleged events occurred, he would have been a 32 year old marrying an 18 year old.

Ah. I see he was married in 1985, so 6 years later, a 38 year old who married a 24 year old.

ETA: some themes coming from Republicans - Moore's accuser wasn't 14, she was actually 17. The 4 women who have spoken up are false accusers paid by liberals. Women who allow evil people continue to do evil things should be prosecuted. Women who are paid to be silent should be prosecuted.

That should be interesting - are Republicans going to ban non-disclosure agreements?

ETA2: The Republican talking heads seem to have been directed to simply talk non-stop and not allow questions to interrupt their monologues.

[SpaceChampion]

An illuminating twitter thread here:

 

[Inigima]

The Flynn-Gulan allegation is bananas. Nothing to do with Trump but holy shit. I'm surprised this isn't getting more attention.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

7 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

An illuminating twitter thread here:

 

My daughter is 14.  If a 30 year old approached her sexually or had the unmitigated gaul to ask me or my wife  if he could "court" her someone would need to call the police because my behavior would become quite uncivil.

[LongRider]

Well, insulting Putin could be really dangerous I suppose.  

Quote

Da Nang, Vietnam (CNN)President Donald Trump suggested on Saturday he's done confronting Russian President Vladimir Putin over his country's election meddling since it's insulting to the Russian leader.

Trump said he took Putin at his word that Russia did not seek to interfere in the US presidential election last year, despite a finding from US intelligence agencies that it did. The fraught relations between the two leaders was underscored anew when Putin's spokesman said election meddling did not come up when they spoke, even though Trump said it did.

And he stressed that bigger issues persist between the United States and Russia that require the two leaders to move on.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/11/11/politics/president-donald-trump-vladimir-putin-election-meddling/index.html

[Ormond]

17 hours ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

There is no bottom. This is a case where I'm pretty sure that the polls are under-counting Moore's support.  

And I doubt anything will come of the Nunes stuff.

Damn I'm getting cynical.

 

I am encouraged by the fact that the day before the Virginia election you were sure that Gillespie would win.