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Ser_ Felipe Dayne

Jon is one Wight?

22 posts in this topic

On 3.12.2017 at 6:59 PM, BalerionTheCat said:

GRRM interview was in the context of the TV show. He then speaks of Jon as if he was like Beric and Stoneheart. So far, AFAIK, GRRM never confirmed Jon was dead in the books or what would happen next. AFAIK he never revealed anything useful in advance of his books. Just that show and book are different things now. So, I keep the speculation of 'fire with' for the show.

Except that it does not make sense. Here is this particular answer from the interview:

Time: "And Jon Snow, too, is drained by the experience of coming back from the dead on the show."

GRRM: "Right. And poor Beric Dondarrion, who was set up as the foreshadowing of all this, every time he’s a little less Beric. His memories are fading, he’s got all these scars, he’s becoming more and more physically hideous, because he’s not a living human being anymore. His heart isn’t beating, his blood isn’t flowing in his veins, he’s a wight, but a wight animated by fire instead of by ice, now we’re getting back to the whole fire and ice thing."

The interviewer states that Jon is resurrected in the show. But then imidiatly GRRM drifts into the books. This is not show-Beric, this is book-Beric. In the show, there is no scene or text that shows that Beric is loosing his Identity. This makes clear that George was talking about the books, not the show. Before this answer he was  talking about Lady Stoneheart, a character that does not exist in GoT. 

"That’s, in some ways, me talking to Tolkien in the dialogue, saying, “Yeah, if someone comes back from being dead, especially if they suffer a violent, traumatic death, they’re not going to come back as nice as ever.” That’s what I was trying to do, and am still trying to do, with the Lady Stoneheart character."

I don't get why it is persitantly stated here in this forum, that this is something from the show, while we all know that those elements are not part of the GoT universe. 

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23 minutes ago, Dragonsbone said:

 

"That’s, in some ways, me talking to Tolkien in the dialogue, saying, “Yeah, if someone comes back from being dead, especially if they suffer a violent, traumatic death, they’re not going to come back as nice as ever.” That’s what I was trying to do, and am still trying to do, with the Lady Stoneheart character."

 

There’s a reason for that in Tolkien. Elves have an afterlife, where some (if they choose) are reincarnated. Gandalf is of an entirely different plane of being; he’s a Maia, an powerful spirit on par with angels in Christian tradition. He comes back to Middle-Earth with his mind intact because 1. He’s made of stronger stuff and 2. He has a purpose (something I never found with FrankenCat). Beren is the only known person to have come back from the dead since Men (that includes women) are not supposed to be reincarnated and go to another afterlife with Eru and there are cosmic forces behind Beren’s return, plus at least one catch.

The point is: In Tolkien, there are explicit forces behind such events as reincarnation. 

Edited by Angel Eyes

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