lAPPYc

Is Jon Snow Going to Get a Dragon?

49 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, zandru said:

I recall Tormund laughing at Jon regarding this big impressive horn, saying it was just an old giant's horn they had found - that the Horn of Jorumun was elsewhere. (I suspect the modest old horn that Samwell Tarly took with him to Oldtown.) Plus - did the first men - sorry, "First Men" - even know about dragons? I thought the FM (not "faceless", I mean First) arrived in Westeros long before the Valyrian Freehold had ever bred dragons from fyrewyrms.

So I'm skeptical about dragonbinding horns at the Wall. Euron says he has one, and very well might.

At this point, dragonriding is moot for Jon Snow, since he's apparently (still) dead.

The description of the horn that Mance claim is Joramun's Horn is very similar to Dragonbinder except it's much larger and is only banded and runed in gold.  This is not something that giants would make given that their technology is limited wood mauls and such.  Perhaps the 'giant' is something else but it does raise the question about it being a dragon binding horn.  That would imply that at sometime in the past there was a dragon north of the Wall.  This might be one reason that Melisandre says that the Wall is as much her place and it is Jon's.  

I'm not sure that Jon will ride a dragon either.  Whether he or Bran will control one might be another question.    

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3 hours ago, divica said:

that horn was broken and jon (or someone else) tried to use it and ir didn t make a sound.

Perhaps it works like a dog whistle, i.e. ultrasound? :D

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7 hours ago, Lucius Lovejoy said:

By the time Jon and Danerys finally meet I believe Danerys will have had at least Viserion stolen (then killed by her and Drogon) by Vic or Euron or Aegon and Rhaegal killed in battle. 

I doubt that Vic needs to steal a dragon. He will take Viserion and go find Dany in the Dothraki Sea and save her from the Dothraki(remember, she can't control Drogon that much). In gratitude, she will marry him - finally a worthy westerosi hubby who will accompany her home(The Grayjoys never really fought in Robert's Rebellion, and when they did, it was like an afterthought that cost them the life of Quellon Grayjoy, Balon's father, so Dany shouldn't have much of a problem with Vic. She will only realize how stupid he is after they are married, and by then it will be too late). And if Aegon/Euron steal a dragon and become the NK, Dany and Vic will assist Jon Snow Kanobi in hunting him down. Then they will rule Westeros wisely (that is to say, with a great tax policy).

But anyway, I don't think the dragons will die in the time-span of ASoIaF. Westeros is gonna be so weak by the time the Dawn comes, it will need some fearless weapon to deter some Essosi to come and conquer them all.

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16 hours ago, Lost Melnibonean said:

Yeap. The black one. The winged shadow. Balerion come again. A flaming sword above the world.

When I had realized that I was posting on the wrong forum, @Lost Melnibonean, I was going to repost it here and refer in some way at least to what you had said. Sorry, it completely fled my mind.

In the previous post, @Lost Melnibonean had pointed out the following:

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The dragons could be the lightbringer themselves...

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Xaro went on, "... When your dragons were small they were a wonder. Grown, they are death and devastation, a flaming sword above the world."

Daenerys III, Dance 16

The mother of dragons will die, and Jon will ride Balerion come again...

Quote

 

Robb looked relieved. ... "The next time I see you, you'll be all in black."

Jon forced himself to smile back. "It was always my color."

 

Jon II, Game 10

 

 

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16 hours ago, Ygrain said:

A good point, but don't forget the story was written by a man who thinks that you can draw a greatsword over your shoulder.

You don't draw a greatsword over your shoulder? Oh man, I have always imagined them doing that, they used to look spectacular...

But you know, everybody agrees that GRRM has great military knowledge. In one of the chapters, the Greatjon is discussing how hard or soft the ground will be at a certain place should they choose to do battle there, and if it will be appropriate for their cavalry. In the TWoW sample chapter of Tyrion, Inkpots complains of how the Yunkaii' wanted the Second Sons, which is basically about 500 horse, to defend one of the catapults:

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"Crossbows is how you hold the Wicked Sister," Inkpots said. "Scorpions. Mangonels. That's what's needed. You do not use mounted men to defend a fixed position. Does the girl mean for us to dismount? If so, why not use her spears or slingers?"

It was in an article discussing this sample chapter that I read the phrase that went something like "GRRM again shows off his knowledge of military tactics". So I don't know...

That Jon cannot use his burning sword from the back of a dragon may come to GRRM out of common sense only, as it did to me when I was thinking about it.

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13 hours ago, wolfmaid7 said:

If something supernatural occurs he may be able to mess with a dragon mind or so,something temporary but him getting one

If a dragon is meant to be warged, I think that Bran is the one to do it. He is on the path of being a three eyed raven. So instead he will become the three headed dragon by taking all three dragons into his pack and prove all the seven+ years of discussions wrong.

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2 hours ago, lAPPYc said:

I doubt that Vic needs to steal a dragon. He will take Viserion and go find Dany in the Dothraki Sea and save her from the Dothraki(remember, she can't control Drogon that much). In gratitude, she will marry him - finally a worthy westerosi hubby who will accompany her home(The Grayjoys never really fought in Robert's Rebellion, and when they did, it was like an afterthought that cost them the life of Quellon Grayjoy, Balon's father, so Dany shouldn't have much of a problem with Vic. She will only realize how stupid he is after they are married, and by then it will be too late). And if Aegon/Euron steal a dragon and become the NK, Dany and Vic will assist Jon Snow Kanobi in hunting him down. Then they will rule Westeros wisely (that is to say, with a great tax policy).

But anyway, I don't think the dragons will die in the time-span of ASoIaF. Westeros is gonna be so weak by the time the Dawn comes, it will need some fearless weapon to deter some Essosi to come and conquer them all.

Victarion is so bad ass, he'd tame any one of those dragonlets just by staring it down into submission. 

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10 hours ago, LynnS said:

I'm not sure that Jon will ride a dragon either.  Whether he or Bran will control one might be another question.    

I forgot about Bran warging one as a possibility, good call.  I don't think it will happen, in part because I really don't want it to, but I definitely see the possibility.  Bran's arc potentially involves a lot more magic/time travel/super powers than anything else and could be a lazy way to move the plot (lazy relative to most of the political/war/magic mysteries aspects of the story) in my opinion, so the less Bran the better.

@lAPPYc I had not thought of Vic being given a dragon freely, or of him rescuing Danerys (she doesn't seem the type to need rescuing) but you put forward a plausible theory.  Perhaps he uses the dragonhorn to take a dragon in his efforts to break the seige of Meereen and when Danerys returns she is grateful for him and marries him then.

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@lAPPYc your first question was “will Jon get a dragon?”. I think what @LynnS was suggesting was, if the dragon binding horn was last at the wall then the plot would be foreshadowing that someone at the wall may have the means to get a dragon. But of course as I said above that horn was a fake (maybe) and it was a fake joramuns horn and it was destroyed (maybe). Victarion has the dragon horn and sam probably has the real Joramuns horn.

On 12/01/2018 at 4:39 PM, lAPPYc said:

 

Where is the dragon binding horn and joramun's horn discussion coming from, @LynnS and @Nezza86? I am confused.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, Nezza86 said:

@lAPPYc your first question was “will Jon get a dragon?”. I think what @LynnS was suggesting was, if the dragon binding horn was last at the wall then the plot would be foreshadowing that someone at the wall may have the means to get a dragon. But of course as I said above that horn was a fake (maybe) and it was a fake joramuns horn and it was destroyed (maybe). Victarion has the dragon horn and sam probably has the real Joramuns horn.

 

There are two horns.  I'm in favor of the small horn being the actual horn of Joramun.  The other horn seems like a different kind of found object..  By description, it's very similar to a dragonbinding horn.   If that's the case, then it could foreshadowing.

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58 minutes ago, LynnS said:

The other horn seems like a different kind of found object..  By description, it's very similar to a dragonbinding horn.

But remember, the horn Euron gives Victarion was an actual horn from a dragon. No indication that the big northern horn was. Surely this would have been mentioned.

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13 minutes ago, zandru said:

But remember, the horn Euron gives Victarion was an actual horn from a dragon. No indication that the big northern horn was. Surely this would have been mentioned.

The big horn is black and 3 feet longer than Dragonbinder.  Not sure what beast has a horn that long unless it's a dragon.  To paraphrase Martin - he does't tell you, he shows you.

Edited by LynnS

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14 minutes ago, LynnS said:

The big horn is black and 3 feet longer than Dragonbinder.  Not sure what beast has a horn that long unless it's a dragon.  To paraphrase Martin - he does't tell you, he shows you.

What about mamoths or Giants? Or maybe other ancient creatures?

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5 minutes ago, divica said:

What about mamoths or Giants? Or maybe other ancient creatures?

Giant's don't make sophisticated items or work gold or write in runes.  Mammoth ivory is usually white sometime brown but not black.  Dragons have black bones, black teeth and black horns.  I daresay, the bigger the dragon, the bigger the horn. 

 

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1 minute ago, LynnS said:

Giant's don't make sophisticated items or work gold or write in runes.  Mammoth ivory is usually white sometime brown but not black.  Dragons have black bones, black teeth and black horns.  I daresay, the bigger the dragon, the bigger the horn. 

 

I meant a horn made of giant bone. Besides can t bones be treated to have diferent colours?

But as we had the hardhome tragedy that involved lots of fire 600 years ago so maybe dragons did exist in the north...

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5 minutes ago, divica said:

I meant a horn made of giant bone. Besides can t bones be treated to have diferent colours?

But as we had the hardhome tragedy that involved lots of fire 600 years ago so maybe dragons did exist in the north...

A giant's bone made into a curving horn?  I kind of doubt it.  A dragon-binding horn buried beneath a glacier doesn't imply that dragons were natural to the area.  Only that someone may have brought a dragon beyond the Wall sometime in the past.  Since it was found buried beneath a glacier; quite a long time ago and probably long forgotten.

Edited by LynnS

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I really hope not. I don't like Jon but I love Dany.  I don't want anyone else to have dragons except for Dany.  She is the only one that should get to have that kind of power and privilege. 

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Jon will mount a dragon once. Dany will die and enter a second life within the remnants of Drogon with Drogo and Rhaego. When she does what will emerge is a dragon similar to Balerion. Jon will mount this dragon and ride it into battle against a literal ice dragon. The ice dragon will be defeated, the Balerion dragon will fly away under great duress, riderless. Jon will be lost, presumed dead. Very few people will have seen him mount the dragon and no living human will see him again after he does. He will not ride a dragon in any capacity before this final fight for the dawn.

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Some pretty crazy answers in here haha. Love it. 

Here’s mine, bran will have to warg drogon after Jon kills dany to ignite lightbringer, so that Jon can ride bran/drogon (Brangon). When someone kills a dragon rider I don’t think the dragon would ever trust the killer so hence brangon. Bloodraven did tell Bran that he’ll never walk but he will fly. I think Bran will have to stay Brangon for too long until Bran dies and he permanently becomes Brangon. Please no ice dragons, that book is a kids book and isn’t even set In the same world.

so nobody thinks Tyrion will make it across the battlefield and blow Vics horn to claim a dragon?

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