robb strategy

[Alex Gu]

you are Robb stark just arriving at moat cailin with almost 20000 troops whats your next step?

 

 

[Lord Wraith]

1 hour ago, Alex Gu said:

you are Robb stark just arriving at moat cailin with almost 20000 troops whats your next step?

 

Keep the strategy he did until the news of Renly's death, then offer a marriage alliance with the Tyrells.

[BericDondarrion]

Continue as normal until Jaime is captured. If Ned's still killed retreat behind Moat Cailin and tell Tywin he must bring Sansa and Arya back in person to retrieve Jaime along with 3 million dragons. Have the meeting spot be in the North. Have the exchange go down and when the Lannister host turns around trap them at the neck and smash them once and for all 

[Shouldve Taken The Black]

4 hours ago, BericDondarrion said:

Continue as normal until Jaime is captured. If Ned's still killed retreat behind Moat Cailin and tell Tywin he must bring Sansa and Arya back in person to retrieve Jaime along with 3 million dragons. Have the meeting spot be in the North. Have the exchange go down and when the Lannister host turns around trap them at the neck and smash them once and for all 

That would leave the Riverlands open to a serious pounding wouldn't it?

[Nowy Tends]

4 hours ago, BericDondarrion said:

Have the exchange go down and when the Lannister host turns around trap them at the neck and smash them once and for all 

It wouldn't be so easy… Tywin is too cautious not to demand (on the honor) guarantees of safe passage, and Rob is too honorable to apply a cheating plan.

[Corvo the Crow]

Once Catelyn arrives with news of Renly's death, immediately send a raven to Tyrells and Stannis both. Offer Tyrells a marriage alliance, lands and titles; Margaery is to marry Robb, Sansa,once rescued, may marry with Loras who will get lands or some suitable heir of a greathouse, Edmure and his unwed vassals will all marry with Tyrell cousins or other prominent ladies of the Reach, Garlan is to have Casterly Rock, but not dominion over Westerlands. Openly acknowledge Stannis as the heir of Robert and the rightful king and promise him support against the Lannisters. He is to know, however, that the North and Riverlands will no longer be subjects of the Iron Throne for suffering twice in less than 20 years, Reach too, if Mace accepts the offer(which he likely would).

Freys would get some compensation for the broken betrothal in the form of lands(landed knight level) granted to several sons in the North, Riverlands and perhaps even Reach and Westerlands.

Westerlands as a power block will cease to be with all the Lannister titles taken and distributed among the younger sons or brothers or cousins of lords who proved themselves and all the western lords now sworn directly to Robb,or better still, given "autonomy" to plunge them into chaos. Hostages will be taken in either case.

Should Mace accepts the offer, Aunt Lysa and all the lords of the vale also get a call to arms, again.

Regardless of Mace accepting the offer or not, Dornish lords also get messages promising to avenge their murdered princess and her children and are asked to help accomplish this task, with a promise of neutrality should they choose to go independent after the war, as long as they stay out of the Reach if Mace took Robb as his king.

 

 

[Roswell]

3 hours ago, Shouldve Taken The Black said:

That would leave the Riverlands open to a serious pounding wouldn't it?

And this is why Robb should have crawled to KL and sworn fealty to Joffrey.  Disgusting as that may sound it would have saved a lot of lives.  Many of those lives being people of the north and the riverlands. 

[James Steller]

Things go as before but instead of Roose Bolton, I give command of my infantry to Halys Hornwood (I leave Daryn Hornwood at the Twins instead of Helman Tallhart to spare him his fate at Whispering Wood). Once Jaime is captured, Riverrun is liberated, and Eddard is executed, I send a message to Stannis Baratheon offering him the North and the Riverlands, humbly suggesting he come to the Riverlands to defeat Tywin and the West once and for all before taking King’s Landing. Before Stannis responds, I ride to the Twins and insist that I keep my oath and wed a Frey girl now. If Walder agrees, I bed her and send her into the North to join Bran, Rickon, and her Frey cousins (I also send Catelyn north  as well). If Walder insists on waiting, I ride west to crush Stafford Lannister. I return to the Riverlands after Oxcross, regain my infantry, and slaughter as many of Tywin’s scouts as I can find while loosely besieging Tywin at Harrenhal. By this point, Stannis will have responded so whatever he decides, I put my forces under his command. Roose Bolton and Theon Greyjoy stay close to me where I can keep an eye on them both. Oh, and I also take Jaime and the other Lannister prisoners and imprison them in White Harbour under escort by Wyman Manderly (if he’s not a prisoner) while Howland Reed closes the Neck to anyone who isn’t a Northman. When word comes of the wildling invasions, I order the remaining lords of the North to send reinforcements to aid the Night’s Watch.

[Angel Eyes]

46 minutes ago, James Steller said:

Things go as before but instead of Roose Bolton, I give command of my infantry to Halys Hornwood (I leave Daryn Hornwood at the Twins instead of Helman Tallhart to spare him his fate at Whispering Wood). Once Jaime is captured, Riverrun is liberated, and Eddard is executed, I send a message to Stannis Baratheon offering him the North and the Riverlands, humbly suggesting he come to the Riverlands to defeat Tywin and the West once and for all before taking King’s Landing. Before Stannis responds, I ride to the Twins and insist that I keep my oath and wed a Frey girl now. If Walder agrees, I bed her and send her into the North to join Bran, Rickon, and her Frey cousins (I also send Catelyn north  as well). If Walder insists on waiting, I ride west to crush Stafford Lannister. I return to the Riverlands after Oxcross, regain my infantry, and slaughter as many of Tywin’s scouts as I can find while loosely besieging Tywin at Harrenhal. By this point, Stannis will have responded so whatever he decides, I put my forces under his command. Roose Bolton and Theon Greyjoy stay close to me where I can keep an eye on them both. Oh, and I also take Jaime and the other Lannister prisoners and imprison them in White Harbour under escort by Wyman Manderly (if he’s not a prisoner) while Howland Reed closes the Neck to anyone who isn’t a Northman. When word comes of the wildling invasions, I order the remaining lords of the North to send reinforcements to aid the Night’s Watch.

I'd also add setting up defenses on the west coast just in case the Ironborn have any ideas. They tend to be active whenever chaos crops up...

[Kandrax]

I would send someone else to Balon.

[Canon Claude]

1 hour ago, Angel Eyes said:

I'd also add setting up defenses on the west coast just in case the Ironborn have any ideas. They tend to be active whenever chaos crops up...

I’m not sure why those don’t exist already, after all those years of Ironborn raids.

[Angel Eyes]

18 minutes ago, Canon Claude said:

I’m not sure why those don’t exist already, after all those years of Ironborn raids.

Maybe they thought they had completely subjugated Balon and that the phrase "what is dead may never die, but rises again harder and stronger" is just talk, that it doesn't apply. 

[the trees have eyes]

Pretty much as it went, except after Whispering Wood and KitN

• don't send Theon to Pyke, send a senior bannerman
• send more than letters to Lysa Arryn, send a senior delgation, probably under the Blackfish.  It won't succeed but at worst it makes it clear no help will come, at best several Houses peel off from Lysa and send support

Robb's strategy wasn't really flawed: Balon may have struck anyway, Renly + Margaery was always a better option for both Houses than Renly + Sansa/Arya (should they have been available and they weren't) or Robb + Margaery, after Renly's death Joffrey + Margaery was a better option for the Tyrells than Robb + Margaery, Stannis and Renly were always going to fight and saw Robb as a rebellious subject not a partner agasint the Lannisters and the BotB gave the military advantage to the Lannister-Tyrell alliance.

Not telling Edmure of his plan to fight Tywin in the west so that Edmure repulsed Tywin was a mistake but a tactical / communication error not a strategic one.

[Canon Claude]

Why would anyone bother sending someone to Balon at all? If we’re going in with the knowledge we have, we know that Balon is going to strike no matter what because he’s crippled by his own battered pride. And anyone who’s sent over to the Iron islands is a dead man. Only reason Theon survived is cause he turned back to the Ironborn cause.

[Canon Claude]

Also, forgot to actually provide my own choice of direction.

Steller raised some great points, especially leaving Daryn Hornwood at the Twins instead of Lord Tallhart. Glorified garrison duty would be better for a young lordling rather than the experienced head of a noble house. But instead of Halys Hornwood, I put Rickard Karstark in charge of the infantry. The man’s a proven warrior and commander. I’ll only need to remind him to be cautious and fight a defensive battle against Tywin. Roose Bolton and his cavalry division stays with me and fights on the front lines. Maybe he dies in battle if I’m lucky.

When I find out that the Lannisters executed my father, I’ll secretly send Stevron Frey, Wendel Manderly, Robin Flint, and Helman Tallhart to Dragonstone to pledge my allegiance to Stannis. As a sign of good faith, I secretly give him Jaime Lannister in chains, along with all my other captives. Catelyn is free to stay in Riverrun or go back to Winterfell, as I win the battle at Oxcross. I’ll let Roose Bolton and Greatjon Umber raid the Westerlands with small forces and reunite my main cavalry with my infantry. We help the Riverlands get fortified and wait for the peace envoy to Stannis to return, with his answer. I send a letter to Balon Greyjoy, telling him that the Westerlands are his for the taking, while I send word north to prepare for any Ironborn in case they strike. And since I’ve got book knowledge, I send secret orders for Rodrik to keep a close eye on Ramsay Snow’s activities and find any excuse to arrest him and sentence him to death if the crime fits. If Halys dies, I summon Daryn Hornwood from the Twins, replace him with Wendel Manderly, and send him north with the wounded to confirm his lordship, marry Alys Karstark, and later lead the northern reinforcements to the Wall when the Watch calls for aid.

[Floki of the Ironborn]

Knowing what we know, in Robb’s body, he should have gone for the snake’s true head. 

Assuming Robb’s position, I would have left Jaime alone at Riverrun and taken my forces, plus the Freys, down to the Green Fork and destroyed Tywin in a pitched battle. And one way or another, Tywin Lannister would die. Either in battle, or else I would execute him when I find out about Ned’s execution. This means the Lannisters are doomed. Tyrion would be my captive, and neither Jaime or Cersei have Tywin’s cunning or diplomacy.

After my victory in Green Fork, I take my cavalry and race to Riverrun to attack Jaime’s army. Even if he escapes, I free Edmure and the other captives and do serious damage to their army. This cripples the Lannisters permanently, allowing Stannis to kill Renly and take his army to King’s Landing. The Tyrells are in a conflicted position, as many of their own bannermen joined Stannis, while I hold the Riverlands and North. When Stannis wins, I send ambassadors to swear fealty and reclaim my relations and family sword. If the Ironborn or the wildlings strike, I eventually return north and defeat them. I also wed Roslin Frey and return to Winterfell in triumph.

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

12 hours ago, The Transporter said:

And this is why Robb should have crawled to KL and sworn fealty to Joffrey.  Disgusting as that may sound it would have saved a lot of lives.  Many of those lives being people of the north and the riverlands. 

Considering how Joffrey feels about Robb , he would be killed .

[the trees have eyes]

19 hours ago, Canon Claude said:

Why would anyone bother sending someone to Balon at all? If we’re going in with the knowledge we have, we know that Balon is going to strike no matter what because he’s crippled by his own battered pride. And anyone who’s sent over to the Iron islands is a dead man. Only reason Theon survived is cause he turned back to the Ironborn cause.

Everyone in story assumes Balon wants his heir back and Balon does not in fact strike until after Theon is returned so it's quite reasonable to assume Balon would assist Robb if Theon remained as a hostage / leverage.  Balon is being invited to do what he wants to do in reaving and plundering but unlike his abortive attempt a decade ago he has a potential ally this time rather than striking out on his own.  And there is no reason for him to kill a high ranking bannerman sent to the Iron Islands to negotiate, at the worst they would remain a valuable hostage, at best they would conclude an alliance.

The knowledge we have begins when Theon arrives at Pyke and we see all Robb's plans crumble, it's not clear beforehand.

[newbieone]

I agree Robb's strategy isn't necessarily flawed — other than his marriage blunder — but there's little he could have done with the resources available and in the circumstances that there were.

Still:

• Not trusting Lord Bolton if there's any knowledge in Stark court about what's going on in Bolton family and lands, even rumours. It's one thing to punish a man based on rumour, a different one to avoid giving important commands to reputed sadists and other degenerates.
• Not executing Lord Karstark, I think (the Wall, anybody?).
• Not falling in love and certainly not sleeping with Jeyne Westerling.
• Cosying up to the Renly camp after Renly's death.
• Possibly declaring for Stannis rather claiming Kingdom in the North. Even after that, there are still precendents for surrendering the crown without the head, including Stannis's own ancestor Lyonel Baratheon. Even if Stannis didn't want to leave Robb with the King title but as a vassal (similarly to the Prince of Dorne) in the end result, I'm sure he would understand the necessity and expediency of e.g. using the title as opposed to bending the knee in the middle of the war and risking a more drop. Or it could be played out as Robb complying with his father's (newly discovered) wishes and Stannis taking care not ho humiliate Robb.
• That said, Stannis has fewer resources than Robb and not necessarily more skill or better commanders, so yielding control before the end of the war could be catastrophic. Thus perhaps a more equal alliance could be better or even playing the same role the Tyrells did with Renly.
• That said, Melisandre would probably not have been acceptable with her barbaric sorcery, and her religious war with burning septs and weirwoods would be too destabilizing. Thus perhaps no chance of alliance with Stannis.
• For Lannisters: Getting rid of Tywin and preferably Jaime. Peace with Kevan or Tyrion. Pretty much all non-Lannisters want the Lannisters out of the way, so it would make sense to set up a temporary truce among the other parties or even get the Reach to invade simultaneously from the other side without getting in each other's way but without a formal alliance either.
• Vale: More intense attempts to get it moving. If not Lisa or her regent, then her vassals at least.
• With the Vale, the Starks would have three of the Seven Kingdoms in their camp with Dorne not participating and the rest not being united. Hence they should have enough leverage to either secede or force a Great Council. In theory. In practice the Tyrells have the largest army, the Lannisters aren't out of the picture yet, and the Ironborn hold the North. So… nope. Tough luck.
• Stannis has ships so alliance with Stannis could make it possible to take out the Ironborn by striking at Pyke.

[Kandrax]

23 hours ago, Canon Claude said:

Why would anyone bother sending someone to Balon at all? If we’re going in with the knowledge we have, we know that Balon is going to strike no matter what because he’s crippled by his own battered pride. And anyone who’s sent over to the Iron islands is a dead man. Only reason Theon survived is cause he turned back to the Ironborn cause.

Without Theon, Winterfell would never fall and Bran and Rickon wouldn't be 'dead'. If Stevron was drowned by Ironborns, i think that Walder would want to commit genocide on them.