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How is Littlefinger able to broker a marriage between Harry Hardyng and Alayne Stone?


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16 hours ago, Nevets said:

 

Harry has nothing to do with my suggestion of taking troops North.  I was suggesting that they would go on their own initiative, at Sansa's request.  And Harry is nobody until and unless Sweetrobin dies, and I have a feeling that won't be for a while, if ever.

Taking the Vale armies north during winter just seems way to risky to attempt , i can see them maybe heading to the Riverlands instead . 

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1 hour ago, Blackfish Tully said:

i can't believe that i completely forgot that Cat was in the Vale in the books , how did that slip my mind ? But it does not mean that people who saw her at 40 for that little amount of time are going to be automatically recognizing Sansa at 14 or 15 as her daughter . Maybe a few people would be able to put it together but the fact that Littlefinger would brazenly parade Sansa Stark out there like that would be hard for anybody to believe considering how badly Cersei wants her . 

As Varys told Tyrion in Tyrion III, Clash 15, "Men see what they expect to see." ...

Quote

They followed the sounds around a lazy bend of the road and saw them; a column of armed men noisily fording a swollen stream. Catelyn reined up to let them pass. The banner in the hand of the foremost rider hung sodden and limp, but the guardsmen wore indigo cloaks and on their shoulders flew the silver eagle of Seagard. "Mallisters," Ser Rodrik whispered to her, as if she had not known. "My lady, best pull up your hood."

Catelyn made no move. Lord Jason Mallisterhimself rode with them, surrounded by his knights, his son Patrek by his side and their squires close behind. They were riding for King's Landing and the Hand's tourney, she knew. For the past week, the travelers had been thick as flies upon thekingsroad; knights and freeriders, singers with their harps and drums, heavy wagons laden with hops or corn or casks of honey, traders and craftsmen and whores, and all of them moving south.

She studied Lord Jason boldly. The last time she had seen him he had been jesting with her uncle at her wedding feast; the Mallisters stood bannermen to the Tullys, and his gifts had been lavish. His brown hair was salted with white now, his face chiseled gaunt by time, yet the years had not touched his pride. He rode like a man who feared nothing. Catelyn envied him that; she had come to fear so much. As the riders passed, Lord Jason nodded a curt greeting, but it was only a high lord's courtesy to strangers chance met on the road. There was no recognition in those fierce eyes, and his son did not even waste a look.

"He did not know you," Ser Rodrik said after, wondering.

"He saw a pair of mud-spattered travelers by the side of the road, wet and tired. It would never occur to him to suspect that one of them was the daughter of his liege lord. I think we shall be safe enough at the inn, Ser Rodrik."

Catelyn V, Game 28

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On 3/15/2018 at 0:59 PM, Shouldve Taken The Black said:

I hadn't thought about this until now, but wouldn't that make LF and the Queen of Thorn's plot much more difficult? LF would have to give her a very exact description of the hairnet and where the poison was placed in it. QoT would then have to do a much more difficult slight of hand. Much easier just to make every stone poison. 

Unless of course she has the correct description, i.e. the furthest to the left or  something like that, provided the hairnet is not so symmetrical that it can be worn either way.  However, having poison in all the stones would have been riskier as there would have been evidence if this hairnet was intercepted somehow and had gotten tracked back to Ser Dontos... which once intercepted it would have been relatively easy.

Okay a bit of a stretch here but given Sansa's track record, for instance, say when she told Cersei (in what in her mind was desperation) of Ned's plan, it was lucky for LF and Olenna that she didn't somehow got suspicious of Dontos' intentions (and let's face it the guy was very vague re who was the friend of her family who wanted to help) or felt guilty, or dutiful or something and told Tyrion that he had been meeting him in the godswood etc.  Furthermore, it was also lucky for them that Tyrion (who shared chambers with her) didn't spotted  a hairnet she hadn't worn before.  I think, if by some kind of chance he had questioned her about it, she would not have lied well, or would have just told him how she came by it.  I am sure Tyrion is not the kind of guy to be overly interested in his wife's jewelry but they took chances there.  For one thing, he was trying super hard to be at least her friend and could have, say, bought her something himself to wear at the royal wedding, or even come up with something from Joanna or whatever and, at the very least, she would have been unable to wear Dontos' "family heirloom."  At worse for LF and Olenna, she may have said something like "Oh, that is so very kind of you, Tyrion, but I did promised Ser Dontos blah..." and he would have suspected something straight away.  Then again, all LF's plots so far had counted upon the fact that things would turn out as planned.  This guy not only underestimates people but, although he adapts well enough given some sort of notice, he also seems to discount even things that may happen by pure chance; she could have had mislaid the thing, have it stolen or something.  Okay, remote possibility but when you are thinking about killing the king... with the penalty being death...

Now, okay we may be departing a bit from the topic here, but it is interesting that they used that hairnet.  It would have been a hell of a lot simpler for Olenna to carry the poison herself.  I reckon the only explanation for that is that they not only wanted to kill Joffrey but also to ensure Sansa (and Tyrion) would "carry the can" but that of course would have involved the hairnet being examined afterwards or something.  We know that LF took measures to ensure that Tyrion was well pissed off during the event but if it hadn't been for Joffrey's behaviour (and Joff could have chosen to pick on someone else that day lol), if they wanted to frame them they would have had to bring the hairnet up as evidence.  Of course, her disappearing looked terrible for her but may not necessarily have proven anything against Tyrion, say, and if he had found the necklace and had it examined I am sure she would have confessed and hell no-one would have believed that Dontos was acting alone or had the means to do so...

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2 hours ago, Blackfish Tully said:

i can't believe that i completely forgot that Cat was in the Vale in the books , how did that slip my mind ? But it does not mean that people who saw her at 40 for that little amount of time are going to be automatically recognizing Sansa at 14 or 15 as her daughter . Maybe a few people would be able to put it together but the fact that Littlefinger would brazenly parade Sansa Stark out there like that would be hard for anybody to believe considering how badly Cersei wants her . 

:DTo be honest I had to double check that she was in the Vale as well because I wasn't sure if I was remembering correctly.  I don't think it's really a question of "automatic recognition" so much as like reasonable suspicion, you know? I definitely think the fact that "Alayne" bears some resemblance at least to Catelyn would add to the questions people should be having about her, and for example Bronze Yohn does do a bit of a double take when he first sees "Alayne" asking if he knows her.  When you add up all the factors like LF's close relationship to Catelyn, Lysa being Sansa's aunt, LF suddenly showing up with this girl who bears some resemblance to Catelyn...again I think it's a wonder more people don't know.  

I give the Mad Mouse a lot of credit, he seems to be the only one operating with a brain in terms of looking for Sansa, because of course she would go to the Vale.  And I think that bears out with what we will see, because I do expect that it will be revealed that Bronze Yohn and Myranda both already know Alayne is Sansa and there may be even more.  Perhaps Lady Waynwood as well who comments on "Alayne" being "gently bred."

 

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18 minutes ago, Tagganaro said:

:DTo be honest I had to double check that she was in the Vale as well because I wasn't sure if I was remembering correctly.  I don't think it's really a question of "automatic recognition" so much as like reasonable suspicion, you know? I definitely think the fact that "Alayne" bears some resemblance at least to Catelyn would add to the questions people should be having about her, and for example Bronze Yohn does do a bit of a double take when he first sees "Alayne" asking if he knows her.  When you add up all the factors like LF's close relationship to Catelyn, Lysa being Sansa's aunt, LF suddenly showing up with this girl who bears some resemblance to Catelyn...again I think it's a wonder more people don't know.  

I give the Mad Mouse a lot of credit, he seems to be the only one operating with a brain in terms of looking for Sansa, because of course she would go to the Vale.  And I think that bears out with what we will see, because I do expect that it will be revealed that Bronze Yohn and Myranda both already know Alayne is Sansa and there may be even more.  Perhaps Lady Waynwood as well who comments on "Alayne" being "gently bred."

 

Getting slightly more speculative,but there does seem to be a lot of evidence that connects the Mad Mouse to being Howland Reed.

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On 3/15/2018 at 5:23 PM, Lollygag said:

It could have been more difficult depending on the style of the hairnet. Olenna could have been told something like "choose the stone over her left ear" or something like that. The description of the hairnet and the scene doesn't really give us much detail either way.

I just think it's worth considering as LF leaving with Sansa with a stockpile of poison seems a rather odd choice. I can't think what his reasoning would be there and I doubt he just forgot.

Sorry, I think I miss your post somehow and I replied to this but I agree with you.  Now, the only reason (other than pure convenience which I am kind of discounting) for them to have poison in various sockets would be to present the hairnet as a later stage as proof against her.  Now, whereas Olenna may not mind one way or the other, LF has other plans for her.  However, let's remember than married and flowered or whatever, she is still 12 and married to the Imp no less.  She is framing her to get at him and hey LF was possibly counting on a Court to take pity on a 12 year old but not on her "scheming husband." He is so sure of himself, I wouldn't put him past it (LF) to be certain that Sansa would confess against Tyrion just so that she didn't have to share his bed anymore or something lol.

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On 3/15/2018 at 0:53 PM, Lollygag said:

I'm not that convinced the hairnet will be proof of anything just because laws and courts don't seem to be much of a thing in the series. KL looks to be a mess with Aegon, Euron, Cersei, the High Sparrow, the Tyrells, Martells, and later Dany with Dragons (am I forgetting someone?) all going at each other. I just don't see a place for Sansa amongst all of that plus her arc really seems directed North.

I'm not sure that Tywin trusted much of anyone except maybe Kevan, but trust or no, he can't do everything on his own. LF seems to have positioned himself into a place of (grudging) trust here:

ASOS Tyrion III

Ser Kevan cleared his throat. "I would sooner have Petyr Baelish ruling the Eyrie than any of Lady Lysa's other suitors. Yohn Royce, Lyn Corbray, Horton Redfort . . . these are dangerous men, each in his own way. And proud. Littlefinger may be clever, but he has neither high birth nor skill at arms. The lords of the Vale will never accept such as their liege." He looked to his brother. When Lord Tywin nodded, he continued. "And there is this—Lord Petyr continues to demonstrate his loyalty. Only yesterday he brought us word of a Tyrell plot to spirit Sansa Stark off to Highgarden for a 'visit,' and there marry her to Lord Mace's eldest son, Willas."

"Littlefinger brought you word?" Tyrion leaned against the table. "Not our master of whisperers? How interesting."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You may very well be right.  Now, hell yes, at present there are so many powers competing for KL (even internally; i.e. Lannister -v- Tyrell) that it beggars belief lol  Yet again, someone must prevail.  My guess is Aegon first with Adrianne as his queen (which I can trust as I can throw as well, but that is another matter lol) and likely Dany afterwards.  I think both would be keen on being seen as "fair" and besides they will probably be grateful (without being able to say so) that someone got rid of Joffrey lol.  If it is in whoever is the monarch's interest to have Tyrion and Winterfell on board, having them "cleared of that charge" could be a smart political move.  

Hell yes, trials in ASOIAF had been a joke at best but Tyrion's for instance took a lot of pages, so I don't discount the possibility of another high profile trial.

Sorry, I went totally off topic with Tywin/Shae.  I honestly don't think she had anything to do with it.  Sansa had the hairnet and a reason to wear it.  Shae's intervention wasn't necessary.

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50 minutes ago, Tagganaro said:

:DTo be honest I had to double check that she was in the Vale as well because I wasn't sure if I was remembering correctly.  I don't think it's really a question of "automatic recognition" so much as like reasonable suspicion, you know? I definitely think the fact that "Alayne" bears some resemblance at least to Catelyn would add to the questions people should be having about her, and for example Bronze Yohn does do a bit of a double take when he first sees "Alayne" asking if he knows her.  When you add up all the factors like LF's close relationship to Catelyn, Lysa being Sansa's aunt, LF suddenly showing up with this girl who bears some resemblance to Catelyn...again I think it's a wonder more people don't know.  

I give the Mad Mouse a lot of credit, he seems to be the only one operating with a brain in terms of looking for Sansa, because of course she would go to the Vale.  And I think that bears out with what we will see, because I do expect that it will be revealed that Bronze Yohn and Myranda both already know Alayne is Sansa and there may be even more.  Perhaps Lady Waynwood as well who comments on "Alayne" being "gently bred."

 

I totally agree with your first paragraph.  Okay, say she has very Tully eyes, say.  A lot of people in the region probably will do too because genetic traits do go a long way.  Still, as you pointed out, it all depends on whether someone is looking for something "fishy" or even someone is super-observant.   I am absolutely hopeless at that sort of thing for instance, yet,  I have a good friend IRL who used to be in the police but has also an engineering degree and he can spot things that amaze me... from a wall that is not perfectly straight lol (I notice colour more but not so much symmetry or whatever) but also stuff like why should someone had left a window open or whatever.  Okay, just silly examples but, in a large community like the Vale (I include nobles and servants alike here) some people are bound to be like that lol  Even if it is one of the kitchen servants, rumours tend to spread like wildfire lol

I reckon LF expects for that to happen though.  I am not saying he is necessarily encouraging in with the whole population but has a plan B, for when it happens.

The Royces, both Yohn and Nestor plus daughter and Lady Waynwood know.  Ten gold dragons on it!!!!  It just suits her to play along for now...

As for Shadrich, I will give him credit if he has figured it out for himself.  I could well be wrong but I think he told the truth about being Varys' man but I think he was also trying to enlist Brienne in a way that was so blatant that she would dismiss it, until she decided to follow his trail... If he does work for Varys, I am sure he knows about his "friendship" with Jaime.  Those last two are in a huge deal of trouble (and cliffhanger) at the moment but their arcs aren't done so they are both surviving for now (my humble opinion) and they may pick up that lead...  Again, you may be right and me wrong, but lol waiting for this book is driving us to theorise wildly (certainly it does make me do that lol).

It will be a lot of fun to reflect on what we got wrong and right or neither when we have the full series lol but I guess, also, that we will feel sad that we cannot longer speculate and tinfoil.  I certainly will be pleased and sad! ;)

By the way, guys, my apologies if I had been so active in this thread that I have sort of taken over, not my intention at all.  The Vale plot is my current favourite, as well as the fate of Jaime/Brie so I just find it hard to resist :)

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1 hour ago, Morgana Lannister said:

Sorry, I think I miss your post somehow and I replied to this but I agree with you.  Now, the only reason (other than pure convenience which I am kind of discounting) for them to have poison in various sockets would be to present the hairnet as a later stage as proof against her.  Now, whereas Olenna may not mind one way or the other, LF has other plans for her.  However, let's remember than married and flowered or whatever, she is still 12 and married to the Imp no less.  She is framing her to get at him and hey LF was possibly counting on a Court to take pity on a 12 year old but not on her "scheming husband." He is so sure of himself, I wouldn't put him past it (LF) to be certain that Sansa would confess against Tyrion just so that she didn't have to share his bed anymore or something lol.

To be honest, I've not really thought about this much. I think Westeros is going to become very chaotic soon due to wars, ice zombies, dragons, famine, etc, so I think a lot of the more civilized aspects of Westeros will collapse or become irrelevant. 

 

1 hour ago, Morgana Lannister said:

You may very well be right.  Now, hell yes, at present there are so many powers competing for KL (even internally; i.e. Lannister -v- Tyrell) that it beggars belief lol  Yet again, someone must prevail.  My guess is Aegon first with Adrianne as his queen (which I can trust as I can throw as well, but that is another matter lol) and likely Dany afterwards.  I think both would be keen on being seen as "fair" and besides they will probably be grateful (without being able to say so) that someone got rid of Joffrey lol.  If it is in whoever is the monarch's interest to have Tyrion and Winterfell on board, having them "cleared of that charge" could be a smart political move.  

Hell yes, trials in ASOIAF had been a joke at best but Tyrion's for instance took a lot of pages, so I don't discount the possibility of another high profile trial.

Sorry, I went totally off topic with Tywin/Shae.  I honestly don't think she had anything to do with it.  Sansa had the hairnet and a reason to wear it.  Shae's intervention wasn't necessary.

Same answer as above. Someone will win KL, but with so many threatening in only 2 books lefts and I believe GRRM said a lot of people would sit the IT before the end, I just don't see there being much room for civilization in general. :dunno:

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2 hours ago, Lollygag said:

Same answer as above. Someone will win KL, but with so many threatening in only 2 books lefts and I believe GRRM said a lot of people would sit the IT before the end, I just don't see there being much room for civilization in general. :dunno:

I think Kings Landing gets blown up (a popular theory in the fandom) when Dany arrives to confront Aegon (the mummers dragon) and Arianne.  The wildfire caches under the city are such a huge Chekov's Gun that they have to go off sooner or later, and it makes perfect sense that Dany will arrive with fire and blood, and accidentally set them off

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23 hours ago, Morgana Lannister said:

Of course he has been bought, either with gold (suggested by payment by LF of some noble people's debts) and also either by the huge dowry he has offered for Sansa and possibly by the promise of WF.

Of course the guy is a bit of a young Robert in that regard lol but that is not a central point in my opinion.  Sansa used to dream of gallant, handsome princes but no more.  I think she would settle, if she has to marry at all, for someone who does his own thing and lets her be too.  Okay, yes, she would have to do her duty and have kids but I really don't see Sansa being in love with him.  In the sample chapter she is pretty mad at him one minute and then determined to "play" at winning him over the next.  I think 2 things are possible a) she is still hurt by his rude comments and hey what better satisfaction than make him eat his words than by making him fall for her (and a boost to her teenage ego) plus she cannot afford to antagonise LF just yet or b ) she knows he is likely to know who she is (his reaction, his rudeness in public, to me, gave it away) and she really is playing...

In any event, I expect many medieval ladies did not expect their husbands to stick with one woman and it probably wasn't even the norm that they did.  I think one of the issues with Cersei, for instance, apart from the obvious humiliation when Robert kept calling her "Lyanna" in his cups is that she was humiliated.  Had he been more discreet and not go fondling servants at feasts she may have been contented shagging Jaime discreetly also.   Okay, not our idea of modern romance and I am sure some couples did made the best of their political marriages and grew to love each other but I think, in the context, unfaithful but discreet would be tolerable in a political marriage.  Of course, someone should clip Harry around the ear and make him discreet lol

  Harry Hardyng just wants to get in her pants and test drive her for a while.  

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1 hour ago, 867-5309 said:

  Harry Hardyng just wants to get in her pants and test drive her for a while.  

there is a hell more in life than sex lol; i.e. ,her" territories!

If you cannot see what marriage was like upon the nobility in those days, I guess nothing I could say would convince you...

Just curiousity, how would you feel if she were to cheat on him (with his consent mayhaps, but provided discreed lol)  Would that be fair if they both played the same game? ;)

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22 hours ago, Morgana Lannister said:

By the way, not just with you, but I love the Vale plot and it is a pleasure and a privilege to argue, agree and all the rest lol :)

Aw, thanks!

The first thing to remember about the vale storyline is that it is, first and foremost, Sansa's story.  She is the main player there, and its importance lies in the fact that she is there.  I think her story is (like that of Bran and Arya) a coming-of-age tale.  Her coming of age will, I think, involve becoming an actual player in the events of Westeros.  So, a few thoughts.

Marriage - I really don't see her marrying Harry or Aegon.  She has no interest at this time, and has a current marriage to use as a blocking method.  Also, I don't see Aegon lasting long enough.  I also think her story is going to be one of being able to get stuff done on her own, without having to go through anyone like a husband or guardian.  

Armies to the North - I think the Others are going to attack before too long; most likely by the middle of TWOW.  If that is indeed the case, I can envision Sansa rallying support for the fight against them - starting in the Vale.  I think this is the most likely reason to go North.  I'm not sure they would be willing to go just to put her in charge of Winterfell.  Side note: All roads to Winterfell (real and metaphorical) go through White Harbour.  Any contestant will need the Manderly's on their side.

Jeyne Poole - GRRM gave her whip marks for a reason ("Checkov's whip-marks", you might say).  They are going to have an effect in the future.  I am convinced of it, and Littlefinger is the only character I can think of that it would be likely to effect.  

Mad Mouse - I think he is what he appears: a free-lance looking for a payday.  Although I would be surprised if Varys doesn't have somebody keeping an eye on Littlefinger, if only to avoid nasty surprises.  

Sansa's disguise - Her disguise is a pretty thin one.  The convenient arrival of a natural daughter at the same time as the disappearance of Sansa Stark, whose description she somewhat matches, is going to be suspicious.  Myranda certainly knows, and I have my suspicions about Nestor, Bronze Yohn, and Lady Waynwood.

Hairnet - I doubt it will reappear, unless it is used to poison someone.  Producing it would implicate those who produce it, whether Sansa or Littlefinger.  Also, I doubt it would help Tyrion.  The fact that his wife took poison into the wedding only makes Tyrion look more guilty than he already does.  Side note: I expect that the Tyrells are under the impression that Sansa was an active member of the conspiracy.  I wonder how that will play out.

 

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1 hour ago, cpg2016 said:

I think Kings Landing gets blown up (a popular theory in the fandom) when Dany arrives to confront Aegon (the mummers dragon) and Arianne.  The wildfire caches under the city are such a huge Chekov's Gun that they have to go off sooner or later, and it makes perfect sense that Dany will arrive with fire and blood, and accidentally set them off

Love the idea but way too simple.  If that was done in the show, say, I would had thought they had run out of budget lol!

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54 minutes ago, Nevets said:

Aw, thanks!

The first thing to remember about the vale storyline is that it is, first and foremost, Sansa's story.  She is the main player there, and its importance lies in the fact that she is there.  I think her story is (like that of Bran and Arya) a coming-of-age tale.  Her coming of age will, I think, involve becoming an actual player in the events of Westeros.  So, a few thoughts.

Marriage - I really don't see her marrying Harry or Aegon.  She has no interest at this time, and has a current marriage to use as a blocking method.  Also, I don't see Aegon lasting long enough.  I also think her story is going to be one of being able to get stuff done on her own, without having to go through anyone like a husband or guardian.  

Armies to the North - I think the Others are going to attack before too long; most likely by the middle of TWOW.  If that is indeed the case, I can envision Sansa rallying support for the fight against them - starting in the Vale.  I think this is the most likely reason to go North.  I'm not sure they would be willing to go just to put her in charge of Winterfell.  Side note: All roads to Winterfell (real and metaphorical) go through White Harbour.  Any contestant will need the Manderly's on their side.

Jeyne Poole - GRRM gave her whip marks for a reason ("Checkov's whip-marks", you might say).  They are going to have an effect in the future.  I am convinced of it, and Littlefinger is the only character I can think of that it would be likely to effect.  

Mad Mouse - I think he is what he appears: a free-lance looking for a payday.  Although I would be surprised if Varys doesn't have somebody keeping an eye on Littlefinger, if only to avoid nasty surprises.  

Sansa's disguise - Her disguise is a pretty thin one.  The convenient arrival of a natural daughter at the same time as the disappearance of Sansa Stark, whose description she somewhat matches, is going to be suspicious.  Myranda certainly knows, and I have my suspicions about Nestor, Bronze Yohn, and Lady Waynwood.

Hairnet - I doubt it will reappear, unless it is used to poison someone.  Producing it would implicate those who produce it, whether Sansa or Littlefinger.  Also, I doubt it would help Tyrion.  The fact that his wife took poison into the wedding only makes Tyrion look more guilty than he already does.  Side note: I expect that the Tyrells are under the impression that Sansa was an active member of the conspiracy.  I wonder how that will play out.

 

Very tired now but great points and I will answer tomorrow for sure ;)

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2 hours ago, 867-5309 said:

  Harry Hardyng just wants to get in her pants and test drive her for a while.  

Yes, we are in agreement there; but is that the most horrible thing someone "in that era" could do?   Would that seriously impact in a political agreement,even with her consent???

Taking into account that the victim may be well aware that a marriage to him means his death, who do you think has more agency there???

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13 minutes ago, The Fattest Leech said:

As far as Sansa’s “Alayna” disguise is going, she is still dying her hair black, even on the TWOW spoiler chapter, correct? 

AFFC Alayne I

 

This morning her eye was caught by a parti-colored gown of Tully red and blue, lined with vair. Gretchel helped her slide her arms into the belled sleeves and laced her back, then brushed and pinned her hair. Alayne had darkened it again last night before she went to bed. The wash her aunt had given her changed her own rich auburn into Alayne's burnt brown, but it was seldom long before the red began creeping back at the roots. And what must I do when the dye runs out? The wash had come from Tyrosh, across the narrow sea.

TWOW Alayne spoilers

Spoiler

"Oh, I think you do," said Littlefinger, with one of those smiles that did not reach his eyes. "You will be the most beautiful woman in the hall tonight, as lovely as your lady mother at your age. I cannot seat you on the dais, but you'll have a place of honor above the salt and underneath a wall sconce. The fire will be shining in your hair, so everyone will see how fair of face you are. Keep a good long spoon on hand to beat the squires off, sweetling. You will not want green boys underfoot when the knights come round to beg you for your favor."

 

So some speculate that Sansa is out of dye or running short of it and at least some of her true color must be showing for fire to be shining in her hair.

 

 

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3 hours ago, cpg2016 said:

I think Kings Landing gets blown up (a popular theory in the fandom) when Dany arrives to confront Aegon (the mummers dragon) and Arianne.  The wildfire caches under the city are such a huge Chekov's Gun that they have to go off sooner or later, and it makes perfect sense that Dany will arrive with fire and blood, and accidentally set them off

I think this is entirely possible. I suspect that Westeros will go a bit Wildling as GRRM seems to gravitate to more complicated scenarios and the Dance with Dragons story (can never remember the name!) goes into detail about how when the oldest, legitimate, reasonably competent male heir is taken out the equation, anything goes and people will follow strength or if playing the Game of Thrones, will follow those who are most likely to benefit them politically or financially. 

KL blowing up as a result of Dany's dragons would certainly fit in with the message that magic is a sword without a hilt as wildfire is a Targ thing taken to another level by Cersei and Tyrion. 

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11 minutes ago, Lollygag said:

AFFC Alayne I

 

This morning her eye was caught by a parti-colored gown of Tully red and blue, lined with vair. Gretchel helped her slide her arms into the belled sleeves and laced her back, then brushed and pinned her hair. Alayne had darkened it again last night before she went to bed. The wash her aunt had given her changed her own rich auburn into Alayne's burnt brown, but it was seldom long before the red began creeping back at the roots. And what must I do when the dye runs out? The wash had come from Tyrosh, across the narrow sea.

TWOW Alayne spoilers

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"Oh, I think you do," said Littlefinger, with one of those smiles that did not reach his eyes. "You will be the most beautiful woman in the hall tonight, as lovely as your lady mother at your age. I cannot seat you on the dais, but you'll have a place of honor above the salt and underneath a wall sconce. The fire will be shining in your hair, so everyone will see how fair of face you are. Keep a good long spoon on hand to beat the squires off, sweetling. You will not want green boys underfoot when the knights come round to beg you for your favor."

 

So some speculate that Sansa is out of dye or running short of it and at least some of her true color must be showing for fire to be shining in her hair.

 

 

Ah, thank you.

Yeah, that TWOW Alayne quote I sorta remembered, but I couldn't place the correct chapter.

And very interesting about the note you mentioned. :blink:

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