U.S Politics; The Price of Steele

[Bonnot OG]

Trump deserves zero credit lol.

[Fragile Bird]

2 hours ago, Fragile Bird said:

I just watched a CNBC interview with Larry Kudlow, not a person I'm crazy about, but he is appalled at the idea of broad tariffs that hit allies. Canada buys 50% of our steel!!!!

But I was appalled at one of the traders in the interview, who said, "Look at the Art of the Deal, it hasn't changed in 30 years, you start negotiations with a punch in the face". .

Maybe it's just me, not being a male person, but Trump is greeting the Swedish PM. Sweden is spending over $3 B on a missile defence system, among other things. And was crucial in freeing that unfortunate young man in North Korea.Trump started with saying his daughter really enjoyed watching the US playing Sweden in curling at the Olympics. (Where the US beat Sweden). 

Now, I know many of you will just say this is just friendly razzing, but the difference, to me, is the fact that almost every single press conference Trump has with a foreign leader starts with a put-down of some kind.

And now Trump is complaining that the US has an $800 B trade deficit with the world. Once again, he doesn't mention 4% of the world's population uses 25% of the world's resources, which always puzzles me how the US can not have trade deficits with the rest of the world.

Trump also just said he would put a 25% tariff on European cars, because the EU has a tariff on US cars. Once again, he does not mention the US put a 25% tariff on European trucks and the 10% was negotiated through the WTO.

He also said "we lose $800 B in trade". Stop buying stuff then, you idiot. See how Americans like that.

[Zorral]

I heard an interview on ATC just now with the president of the United Steel Workers union.  What a stubbornly ignorant of everything idiot he is.  All he could answer to every question and every fact in rebuttal that tariffs are good was, "We got to stop the countries that cheat."  He couldn't name a cheating country or how anything hey did constituted cheating.  Evidently he didn't even HEAR someone else mention that the cheap, subsidized steel produced by China, made steel prices here much cheaper for the industries such as the aeronautical ones, and who employ many people in their factories, more than evened out the problem.  In response to the observation of the nations who are to be 'punished' would raise tariffs of their own on US produced goods -- "Who said that? Nobody's going to do that.  We're just going to stop the cheaters."

Which, this cheating thing that the orange soda jerk so efficiently glommed on, really resonates with these white guys who insist everythiing wrong in their lives is due to other people cheating them.  But somehow they never think to include those like the Jerk and his cronies who really are cheating them.

 

[A Horse Named Stranger]

In other news. Are House Republicans now really trying to officially shut down their Russia investigation?

[DMC]

It's sometimes fascinating how topics emerge around here.  For the record, I don't actually hold ill-will towards Boomers, I just enjoy teasing my parents about two of their presidents and their (fairly well-earned) reputation and poor record that's been detailed above.  Incidentally, my parents whole-heartedly agree.  My biggest gripe with Boomers is it's time the political leadership in this country stops being dominated by their cohort.  2016 was the first election when Millennials and Gen-Xers (just barely) outvoted Boomers and the Silent generation.  It's time this is reflected in the key decision-makers we elect.  But this is a criticism about Boomers, not at them - it's incumbent on younger generations to seize power and elect representatives that reflect the demography.

4 hours ago, Ormond said:

Boomers are less Republican than the Silents, especially the first two thirds of the Boomers. Boomers are those born between 1946 and 1964. Boomers born before 1960 tend to have about the same % of Republicans and Democrats as the electorate as a whole, if anything slightly swinging toward the Democrats. Those born in the 1960s are more Republican, having come of political age under the late Carter and early Reagan years.

Where is there data that separates early from late Boomers (sometimes called "Generation Jones")?  That'd be very interesting to look at.  In general, it's true that the Silents are more Republican than Boomers, but the difference between the two is substantially less than the difference between Boomers and younger generations.  Further, as mentioned in that PEW study, Boomers are becoming more conservative - while, interestingly, Gen Xers identified as liberal Democrats in 2016 at their highest rate since 2000.  However, it's important to emphasize this is largely driven by the demographic makeup of each generation, namely ethnicity and education:

Quote

The Democratic leaning young adult vote is now driven by racial minorities who made up 37 percent of voters under age 30 in the 2016 election. In contrast, whites constituted 78 percent of the voters over age 45 and 87 percent of those over age 65. On Nov. 8, whites in these age groups showed the strongest support for Donald Trump in almost every swing state that he won.

The educational profile of these older whites is notable—65 percent are not college graduates. These so called “non college whites” were the major engine for Trump’s surge with high turnout and strong voting preferences. Non college whites comprised 34 percent of all voters and favored Trump over Clinton by more than 2 to 1.

 

4 hours ago, Ormond said:

The paradox with that is the percentage who say they are "Independents" rather than Democrats or Republicans is way up -- but a lot of those young Independents seem to be identifying as "Conservatives" with a llibertarian bent.

This is an interesting paradox, and as you suggest I think it's a reflection of the times.  Not just polarization, but one of the main causes of polarization - the increasing lack of trust in government and delegitimization of our institutions.  What is encouraging is Millennials - in spite of having good reason to be more cynical than previous young people - have more trust in, and are less angry at, government than older generations (at least they were in 2011, sorry couldn't quickly find a more recent link).  Another important aspect to emphasize is that in spite of comparatively high rates of identifying as conservative, Millennials have supported Democrats at higher rates than the young cohort since at least McGovern (at least in presidential cycles).  You could chalk this up to Obama, but the young/old gap remains considerably higher than almost every election since McGovern for Kerry and Hillary as well.

[DanteGabriel]

41 minutes ago, Notone said:

In other news. Are House Republicans now really trying to officially shut down their Russia investigation?

What's the point of it, except for Nunes to use it to toady up to Trump and abuse his power? The House investigation has done more harm than good because it allowed Nunes to invent some bullshit scandals to muddy the waters.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

Cohn to resign:

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/gary-cohn-plans-to-resign-as-trumps-top-economic-advisor-new-york-times.html

ETA:

FB got 'd! 

[Fragile Bird]

Gary Cohn, Trump's top economic adviser, is going to resign. The NYT says it's for many reasons, but the imposition of tariffs on steel and aluminum and the threat to start a trade war seems to have been the last straw.

CNBC flashed a warning sign that the futures on the Dow just opened, and indicate a drop of 300 points for the open.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

I heard an interview on ATC just now with the president of the United Steel Workers union.  What a stubbornly ignorant of everything idiot he is.  All he could answer to every question and every fact in rebuttal that tariffs are good was, "We got to stop the countries that cheat."  He couldn't name a cheating country or how anything hey did constituted cheating.  Evidently he didn't even HEAR someone else mention that the cheap, subsidized steel produced by China, made steel prices here much cheaper for the industries such as the aeronautical ones, and who employ many people in their factories, more than evened out the problem.  In response to the observation of the nations who are to be 'punished' would raise tariffs of their own on US produced goods -- "Who said that? Nobody's going to do that.  We're just going to stop the cheaters."

Which, this cheating thing that the orange soda jerk so efficiently glommed on, really resonates with these white guys who insist everythiing wrong in their lives is due to other people cheating them.  But somehow they never think to include those like the Jerk and his cronies who really are cheating them.

 

That would be Leo Gerard. I heard the same interview, as well as a few others he did on NPR and other sites today and I think it's clear that he's being delusional and overly simplistic. He rejects that automation is a major factor in manufacturing job losses, which it is,  and he has no comprehension about the externalities of these tariffs. He didn't even seem to understand that other countries would retaliate. And he cannot see the big picture on how this would be a net loss for many Americans. He only cares about the short term needs of his workers.

[Fragile Bird]

16 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

That would be Leo Gerard. I heard the same interview, as well as a few others he did on NPR and other sites today and I think it's clear that he's being delusional and overly simplistic. He rejects that automation is a major factor in manufacturing job losses, which it is,  and he has no comprehension about the externalities of these tariffs. He didn't even seem to understand that other countries would retaliate. And he cannot see the big picture on how this would be a net loss for many Americans. He only cares about the short term needs of his workers.

I don't understand what the hell is going on with Leo. He's a Canadian, was head of the equivalent union up here in Canada. Smart, aggressive guy. Has he been warped in America? He certainly understands trade issues.

I remember meeting him at a seminar organized by the outside law firm we used. They did this massive client-only labour and employment law seminar, and Gerard came in to talk about management-labour relations. He told us about going to a new plant tour in British Columbia, of, I believe, a new Alcan smelter. The plant opening had been seriously delayed because after the equipment was first installed, at a billion dollar cost, it was discovered the equipment didn't work. Gerard asked them how many people had been fired, and the management team expressed great surprise at the question. It wasn't the fault of the plant design team, they said. A billion dollars this cost, said Gerard, and no one has been fired? One of our union truck drivers backed up too closely to the loading dock last week, he said, and broke the rear lights and tailpipes. and he's been suspended five days without pay.

Think about that, he said, when you wonder what's going wrong in your union-management relations.

[GAROVORKIN]

What about the controversies surrounding the Trump Dossier and how and why by whom it was complied ?

[Darth Richard II]

It's like if you created a 32 player game of Civilization with all AI opponents then left it on for like a year, and somewhere half way through the memory all went bad so you come back to see whats going on and its like WTF.

[Jace, Extat]

Just now, Darth Richard II said:

It's like if you created a 32 player game of Civilization with all AI opponents then left it on for like a year, and somewhere half way through the memory all went bad so you come back to see whats going on and its like WTF.

Some mods weren't meant to be played.     

[Zorral]

6 minutes ago, GAROVORKIN said:

What about the controversies surrounding the Trump Dossier and how and why by whom it was complied ?

Read the NYer article, señor troll.

[GAROVORKIN]

19 minutes ago, Zorral said:

Read the NYer article, señor troll.

Im not a troll nor am I trying to be one.

[Xray the Enforcer]

34 minutes ago, GAROVORKIN said:

What about the controversies surrounding the Trump Dossier and how and why by whom it was complied ?

This is amply covered in the New Yorker article that was published the other day. According to all legitimate sources (ie not partisan hacks), the Steele dossier is credible and most of it has been independently corroborated. 

[all swedes are racist]

been saying it all along: the pee tape is real (and it is strong, and it is my friend)

[DMC]

17 minutes ago, unpaid comintern said:

the pee tape is real (and it is strong, and it is my friend)

You need better friends.

[Yukle]

1 hour ago, Xray the Enforcer said:

This is amply covered in the New Yorker article that was published the other day. According to all legitimate sources (ie not partisan hacks), the Steele dossier is credible and most of it has been independently corroborated. 

 

48 minutes ago, unpaid comintern said:

been saying it all along: the pee tape is real (and it is strong, and it is my friend)

I've read the document, after it was published on Buzzfeed. Steele did explicitly mention when something was hearsay, and also mentioned confidence (or lack thereof) in the various points. It makes sense, he compiled a fair bit and not all of it would be worth pursuing.

The infamous tape is something where he states that Trump was threatened with its existence, but as for the tape itself it's hard to say if it actually exists, as such.

Unless the alleged tape includes somebody underage, or it is homosexual, then I can't see it harming Trump much with his base. They'll all probably just admit that they all do it and the Democrats and liberal media are being hypocrites, because what's a little sex between consenting adults?

Actually, on the point of underage, I take that back, since Trump has already been accused of paedophilia, and it didn't make any difference.

[TheKitttenGuard]

Apparently the Stable Genius, who is like so smart, did not sign the NDA. The Return of Stormy Daniels:

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/stormy-daniels-sues-trump-says-hush-agreement-invalid-because-he-n854246

Do not know how it will be tawdry. High Intrigue is giving the man far too much credit.