U.S. Politics: The Ideas of Mueller

[Cas Stark]

I've read several people here saying that cyber attacks=declaration of war, one can only hope  that John Bolton doesn't subscribe to this belief.

[IamMe90]

4 minutes ago, Cas Stark said:

I've read several people here saying that cyber attacks=declaration of war, one can only hope  that John Bolton doesn't subscribe to this belief.

I think the alignment in timing of Bolton's appointment and the Iran indictments clearly indicates some sort of military intervention wrt Iran is on the horizon. Whether that manifests in a full-scale war or not is an open question, but I'm not optimistic, given the administration we're working with.

[lokisnow]

8 hours ago, Pecan said:

We're truly entering unprecedented territory now. Frankly, I blame the Democrats. I don't care as much that Putin & co. may have greased the way for Trump. Sure, that's a problem. But, the Democrats screwed this up by allowing Hillary to hijack the party. To be clear, I wasn't any sort of Bernie supporter, and I'm still not, though I do admire him. The problem is this: where were all the other candidates? Why was the field so limited following a successful presidency without an incumbent vice president in the running? 

The fix we're in now is pretty bad. Rules of decency are being thrown out the window and now we have John Bolton to add to the mix. 

By one perspective, Hillary clinton is the second most popular politician of all time, earning more votes for president than all but one other person. She earned the democrat nomination in the primaries by winning far more votes from far more cohorts of her parties coalition than anyone else. 

Fundamentally, she was the party’s nominee because she was extraordinarily popular within the party. Was she the most popular candidate ever? No. Was she a perfect candidate? No. But she very much did years of hard labor to secure the nomination and earn the support of millions within her party. She wasn’t handed it, she went out and earned it. 

But fo say that democrats are to blame for trump because some people didn’t like clinton is absolutely absurd.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

2 hours ago, IamMe90 said:

I think the alignment in timing of Bolton's appointment and the Iran indictments clearly indicates some sort of military intervention wrt Iran is on the horizon. Whether that manifests in a full-scale war or not is an open question, but I'm not optimistic, given the administration we're working with.

I wonder what the response from Europe would be if we preemptively attacked Iran. They’ve been fighting hard to keep the agreement in place, and it’s my understanding that their companies have already begun heavy expansion in the country. A war with Iran will be bad for the markets, and worse, bad for our alliances. Trump may leave us with no friends but the ones you can’t trust by the time he leaves office.

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

40 minutes ago, lokisnow said:

By one perspective, Hillary clinton is the second most popular politician of all time, earning more votes for president than all but one other person. She earned the democrat nomination in the primaries by winning far more votes from far more cohorts of her parties coalition than anyone else. 

Fundamentally, she was the party’s nominee because she was extraordinarily popular within the party. Was she the most popular candidate ever? No. Was she a perfect candidate? No. But she very much did years of hard labor to secure the nomination and earn the support of millions within her party. She wasn’t handed it, she went out and earned it. 

But fo say that democrats are to blame for trump because some people didn’t like clinton is absolutely absurd.

Where is loki and what in god’s name have you done with him?

[lokisnow]

I have long hated a lot of the dccc type leadership of the party because they flushed the state and federal parties down the toilet with their “don’t try to win strategy” after obama was elected. but I recall being a fairly steady supporter of clinton all through 2015 and 2016. In 15 I did really want Biden to run, but clinton was my second choice. 

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

4 hours ago, The Great Unwashed said:

This morning, Trump threatened to veto the omnibus spending bill just passed by Congress after indications from the White House last night that he'd sign it.

Most Congress-critters have already left Washington for recess, so if he follows through with his threat, we will definitely be looking at a multi-day shutdown for at least as long as it takes to corral members of Congress to come back to Washington and re-negotiate an amended bill.

The way Trump has been pushing back against the "adults-in-the-room", or ASITRS as I like to call them, I wouldn't be surprised if he actually follows through with his threat.

He’s signed it. I honestly meant to come in here and comment earlier that Congress should just call his bluff, because the backlash would fall entirely on him. Trump seems like the type that will always fold when push comes to shove.

[Zorral]

6 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

He’s signed it. I honestly meant to come in here and comment earlier that Congress should just call his bluff, because the backlash would fall entirely on him. Trump seems like the type that will always fold when push comes to shove.

He's also the type who at the last moment will always say he's not going to do what people want / expect / need, or at the last moment say is he is going to do what people DON'T want / expect / need, because it makes him think he's the center of the universe as everyone wrings their hands and howls that's he's disrupted everything yet again.  He thinks this is deal-making.  He adores this, adores this, adores this, lives for this.  Thinks it makes him look big and strong and powerful, not noticing it makes him look small and stupid and weak, creating ever yet more contempt and dislike for him.

[Wethers]

4 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

I've read several people here saying that cyber attacks=declaration of war, one can only hope  that John Bolton doesn't subscribe to this belief.

Why not?  Don't you think US should try to defend itself from cyber attacks?  Doesn't mean we have to try to bomb Moscow.  Cyber-defense - and a proportional defensive response.

But of course Bolton (and more importantly Trump) have no incentive for any such defense.  Just the opposite.

They might want to start wars elsewhere to rally election support, and that might involve bombs.  But certainly not with Russia (thankfully).  It's gotta be somewhere with brown people.

[lokisnow]

Dow dropped another 425 today.

[Martell Spy]

21 minutes ago, Zorral said:

He's also the type who at the last moment will always say he's not going to do what people want / expect / need, or at the last moment say is he is going to do what people DON'T want / expect / need, because it makes him think he's the center of the universe as everyone wrings their hands and howls that's he's disrupted everything yet again.  He thinks this is deal-making.  He adores this, adores this, adores this, lives for this.  Thinks it makes him look big and strong and powerful, not noticing it makes him look small and stupid and weak, creating ever yet more contempt and dislike for him.

There is that element to this. I heard on the radio though that conservatives on TV we're complaining on TV about the bill and Trump saw it.

[Shryke]

42 minutes ago, Tywin et al. said:

He’s signed it. I honestly meant to come in here and comment earlier that Congress should just call his bluff, because the backlash would fall entirely on him. Trump seems like the type that will always fold when push comes to shove.

It's more that he's a reality TV star. That's all he cares about. He doesn't do this because he changes his mind, he does it to build hype for the reveal after the next commercial break.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

21 minutes ago, lokisnow said:

Dow dropped another 425 today.

Yup.  We are in for a roller coaster for a while, but this bull is long in the tooth already and it's not like current government policies are exactly reassuring.

[Gone and Quite Forgotten]

5 hours ago, Cas Stark said:

I've read several people here saying that cyber attacks=declaration of war, one can only hope  that John Bolton doesn't subscribe to this belief.

Cyber attacks merit a proportionate response. I haven't seen anybody here argue for an armed response to the Russian cyber attacks.

[denstorebog]

Reading the Breitbarts comments sections today is fun, fun, fun.

[Jace, Extat]

17 minutes ago, denstorebog said:

Reading the Breitbarts comments sections today is fun, fun, fun.

Don't tease a bitch. What's the action?

[Zorral]

1 hour ago, Martell Spy said:

There is that element to this. I heard on the radio though that conservatives on TV we're complaining on TV about the bill and Trump saw it.

I heard that too.  I also heard at one point, but only one, that he'd ALREADY signed it when he said he wasn't going to sign it.  No matter how it went down though, that anyone was surprised that he said he wasn't going to sign it is what surprised me, considering how consistent this is with his standard operating procedure.

It hasn't been that unusual for White House officials to end up with a gig in the media.  But is this the first time that people from tv end up as White House officials?

 

[Cas Stark]

I would assume Trump's supporters are unhappy that he signed the spending bill.  

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Zorral said:

He's also the type who at the last moment will always say he's not going to do what people want / expect / need, or at the last moment say is he is going to do what people DON'T want / expect / need, because it makes him think he's the center of the universe as everyone wrings their hands and howls that's he's disrupted everything yet again.  He thinks this is deal-making.  He adores this, adores this, adores this, lives for this.  Thinks it makes him look big and strong and powerful, not noticing it makes him look small and stupid and weak, creating ever yet more contempt and dislike for him.

Totally agree, and it also leads into this:

1 hour ago, Shryke said:

It's more that he's a reality TV star. That's all he cares about. He doesn't do this because he changes his mind, he does it to build hype for the reveal after the next commercial break.

I agree with the reality TV star angle, though I wouldn't go so far as to say that's all he cares about, and I disagree that he doesn't change his mind on a whim. That's what appears to have happened here. I've seen it reported from a few sources that nobody was aware that he was going to announce his veto threat. It sounds like his entire staff found out via push notices on their phones. He tweeted it during his "executive time" after something on Fox made him mad.

7 minutes ago, Pony Queen Jace said:

Don't tease a bitch. What's the action?

Don't worry Jace, your boy's got your fix:

 

[Mr. Chatywin et al.]

1 hour ago, Mlle. Zabzie said:

Yup.  We are in for a roller coaster for a while, but this bull is long in the tooth already and it's not like current government policies are exactly reassuring.

I found this to be telling:

Quote

From its high on Jan. 26 at 26,616.71, the benchmark index has declined more than 3,000 points or 11.6 percent through Friday's close at 23,533.2.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/23/heres-how-much-the-stock-market-is-still-up-since-donald-trump-took-office.html

I wouldn't be shocked if it keeps trending downwards over the next few months, especially if Trump proposes more tariffs that have teeth which will lead to a number of retaliations.