Sansa retakes the North

[Stormking902]

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

[Bowen Marsh]

Sansa has no background in ruling.  Having her in control of North is guaranteed that all would turn for the worse.  I do not see any development in Sansa's character that tells me that she would actually have any competence at ruling, leadership, or governing.  Given the opportunity, Sansa would take Rickon's inheritance.  Because she's selfish.  That's the Sansa in the books.  

[Nevets]

1 hour ago, Stormking902 said:

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

While I have serious doubts any of this will happen (I don't see the Vale Knights willing to fight to put her into Winterfell, plus I think the Others will attack soon), I'll give it a go.

She will be perfectly happy to let Rickon rule.  She has no interest at this point in power, at least for its own sake, and I don't see that changing.  The only problem would be if she feels that Rickon is controlled by the Manderlys, or has problems from his time in Skagos.  But I only see her supplanting him if she perceives him as a threat to the North, and given his age, I don't see that as likely.

As to the Dreadfort, it needs somebody, who can be trusted and is strong enough to hold it.  Right now, I think that would be Robett Glover.  He's clearly loyal to the Starks, and his house is one of the strongest in the North.  I don't think razing it is an option.  It's designed to resist destruction, and the ruins could become an outlaw center.

[Kandrax]

2 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

Given that she is currently 14, she can't be anyone regent, unless they change law.

[Stormking902]

42 minutes ago, Nevets said:

While I have serious doubts any of this will happen (I don't see the Vale Knights willing to fight to put her into Winterfell, plus I think the Others will attack soon), I'll give it a go.

She will be perfectly happy to let Rickon rule.  She has no interest at this point in power, at least for its own sake, and I don't see that changing.  The only problem would be if she feels that Rickon is controlled by the Manderlys, or has problems from his time in Skagos.  But I only see her supplanting him if she perceives him as a threat to the North, and given his age, I don't see that as likely.

As to the Dreadfort, it needs somebody, who can be trusted and is strong enough to hold it.  Right now, I think that would be Robett Glover.  He's clearly loyal to the Starks, and his house is one of the strongest in the North.  I don't think razing it is an option.  It's designed to resist destruction, and the ruins could become an outlaw center.

I agree the Dreadfort needs someone strong enough to hold it and perhaps Robett is that man but the Glovers are a weak house in the North and not even lords because they are a masterly house, you are correct that he is loyal so he might be a good fit but the lords of the North would def be mad the Glovers made such an advancement when the Mormonts, Reeds, Manderlys, Umbers were all equally as loyal. 

[BRANDON GREYSTARK]

3 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

That is a lot of stuff to put aside . Sansa cannot hold the north if Rickon is alive his claim is stronger . Even though the Vale lords loved Ned I seriously doubt they would invade the north for Sansa . OK outside of a political marriage ? The only way I can see this happening is Sansa declaring herself Queen in the North , Vale and the Riverlands .You punish the Freys ,Boltons and the Karstarks . You reward the Vale lords ,North Mountain clans ,Manderleys , Umbers, Flints ,Skaggosi clans . Lockes and the Glovers , loyalty must be rewarded . Dreadfort raised to the ground or given to any valeman . mountain clan or wildling that showed the most loyalty .As the Queen of the Three Kingdoms she can give the lordship to Rickon .

[The Mother of The Others]

Go with what you've got.  That's how i view the sansa arc. Use your strengths.  I feel her true preference for a warmer climate was on display in book 1.  The wolf got the message, the readership didn't.   I doubt she goes back home to realize that the cold is what truly makes her happy.  If she's to develop, it isn't by being at winterfell on the front lines vs. magical creatures, because she chose to be a non magical player- - in the mundane world of.... people.    Are there people left at Stark town?  Really?  ..sansa'd be good for the broken souls who remain at winterfell....  She wouldn't accomplish much with them aside from therapy sessions; it'd be the end of the dream of seeing her arrive as a player.   

Stark castle is effed up at present,  unbefitting a 'martha stewart living' style of overseer like Sansa.  She'd have to roll up her sleaves and rebuild the outhouses.  Get the walls where they should be.  Sounds more like a Bran thing.  He had all those bricks memorized.  I say move him to the winterfell weir and plug him in there so he can direct the reconstruction while tripping balls ethereally.  .

....Let someone colder take the north back from bolton.  It's already in progress, by the way.  Then, maybe nobody lives there in that rubble.  (We may be holding the chronicle of the end of the stark era, as it's seemed all along.  In that case, the fight against the others won't be to return to the status quo of "there must always be a stark in WF."     The fight will be to end the need for such constant vigilance.  To end the millennia long stalemate and reach a resolution to this unfinished bizness the cold seems to have.

There is some interesting tour of duty awaiting the vale army.  Couldn't say what, tho.   Operating from a safer distance , Sansa could orchestrate humanitarian efforts when the Others sweep southward, in the process making her a shoe- in for Queen of the Survivors.

 

[Lollygag]

1 hour ago, The Mother of The Others said:

I feel her true preference for a warmer climate was on display in book 1.  The wolf got the message, the readership didn't.   I doubt she goes back home to realize that the cold is what truly makes her happy. 

Gotta admit, I don't follow how one comes to this line of thinking. Sansa has been increasingly drawn to cold. Almost as if it's compulsion. Not sure how it'd work out, but her arc looks headed North.

ASOS Sansa VII

I am not going back to sleep, Sansa realized. My head is all a tumult. She pushed her pillow away reluctantly, threw back the blankets, went to her window, and opened the shutters.

Snow was falling on the Eyrie.

Outside the flakes drifted down as soft and silent as memory. Was this what woke me? Already the snowfall lay thick upon the garden below, blanketing the grass, dusting the shrubs and statues with white and weighing down the branches of the trees. The sight took Sansa back to cold nights long ago, in the long summer of her childhood.

She had last seen snow the day she'd left Winterfell. That was a lighter fall than this, she remembered. Robb had melting flakes in his hair when he hugged me, and the snowball Arya tried to make kept coming apart in her hands. It hurt to remember how happy she had been that morning. Hullen had helped her mount, and she'd ridden out with the snowflakes swirling around her, off to see the great wide world. I thought my song was beginning that day, but it was almost done.

Sansa left the shutters open as she dressed. It would be cold, she knew, though the Eyrie's towers encircled the garden and protected it from the worst of the mountain winds. She donned silken smallclothes and a linen shift, and over that a warm dress of blue lambswool. Two pairs of hose for her legs, boots that laced up to her knees, heavy leather gloves, and finally a hooded cloak of soft white fox fur.

Her maid rolled herself more tightly in her blanket as the snow began to drift in the window. Sansa eased open the door, and made her way down the winding stair. When she opened the door to the garden, it was so lovely that she held her breath, unwilling to disturb such perfect beauty. The snow drifted down and down, all in ghostly silence, and lay thick and unbroken on the ground. All color had fled the world outside. It was a place of whites and blacks and greys. White towers and white snow and white statues, black shadows and black trees, the dark grey sky above. A pure world, Sansa thought. I do not belong here.

…

She wondered where this courage had come from, to speak to him so frankly. From Winterfell, she thought. I am stronger within the walls of Winterfell.

...

He walked along outside the walls. "I used to dream of it, in those years after Cat went north with Eddard Stark. In my dreams it was ever a dark place, and cold."

"No. It was always warm, even when it snowed. Water from the hot springs is piped through the walls to warm them, and inside the glass gardens it was always like the hottest day of summer." She stood, towering over the great white castle. "I can't think how to do the glass roof over the gardens."

 

 

Link below is TWOW Alayne spoilers.

http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?/topic/127485-twow-spoilers-alayne-i-v-3/&do=findComment&comment=7895665

 

[Lollygag]

22 hours ago, Stormking902 said:

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

When a thread excludes so many relevant factors (Stannis isn't even mentioned, nor is Tyrion), it really becomes a "what if" thread.

I don't see any way Sansa would be accepted as leader of the Vale. LF is bs-ing her on this. I think the north is quite hard to predict right now. Rickon being the real heir of Winterfell is highly debatable as all of the Starks have compelling pro's and con's. This is also based on ignoring Sansa's recent character developments: she was all about a child's fairytale in AGOT and as of AFFC, is living happily as a bastard and just wants to go home.

[Morgana Lannister]

Okay, I believe the Boltons will be crashed by Stannis but I don't expect Stannis to live long after.  Alas, I will try to answer your question in the scenario you propose.

If her engagement to Harry the Heir holds, and we know the guy is ambitious, he would be glad to back her to take WF from whoever, especially until he learns that Rickon and Bran are alive lol  At that point, and I believe he will win wings and will be unable to marry for 3 years (because I believe serves the plot).  If I were her I would play along with the engagement (provided it doesn't mean the imminent poisoning of Robert Arryn) and ensure those knights would win me back WF.

A lot of people seem to assume that the Starks would be happy to bend the knee to Stannis.  Has just been re-reading and okay, although dead or undead now, Cat did not like what she saw.  Granted others like Jon or Sansa haven't but I am not convinced that the Starks as a whole would back Stannis especially with Mel and her tendency to burn other peoples' gods lol  So it is feasible, that after the WF battle some Starks still want to see the back of Stannis in their castle.

As for Rickon, okay, I am bias in that I don't like the sound of him or the situation.  He has reasons for being a bit of a beast in the making and I know I am being unkind given his age lol but so did LF (he was shammed for being low nobility etc) and yet... if Rickon seems like a reasonable child, were I Sansa, I would have no choice but acknowledging that WF is his if Bran abdicates....  Personally, I would much rather have Bran but, as I said I am bias against non point of view characters... (cannot help it!)  Now, Rickon is going to be manipulated by the Manderleys for sure.  Elsewise they would not be on that rescue mission.  Yes, there may be Stark loyalty in them but Lord Too Fat To Sit  a Horse wants him for one of his grand-daughters.  Nothing wrong with that though...

Now, I do like Sansa despite her naivety and sheer stupidity in the beginning but I think she is learning a hell of a lot.  She is in an internship Westeros style just like Arya is or Jon has been even...  This will count for something.  She may well put the "Martha Stewart" touch to her feasts but she is training to be a devious politician at best...

Okay, if I were her, I would keep my options open.  Stringing Harry alone may get her the knights to take WF from Stannis.  If he proves false and wants to kill Robin openly, I would spill the beans and let him hang, that would give me Robert's support... which she kind of has anyway.  Also, she is married to Tyrion.  I would not act on it.  Once he is with Dany (which he will be) news will reach her as everyone will know.  Tyrion wasn't bad to her but she may fear that he is angry with her for buggering off "at the right time."  LF wronged them both badly and if they team up and bring him down (not necessarily death but imprisonment and destitution...) and all she has to do is share info with Tyrion.  Then she gets the Targ Queen on her side too lol  Tyrion is like to ask her, when it is that they meet, if she wants an annulment.  If it were me, I would go for "wait and see."  "Not now, my Lord, unless you intend to marry yourself..." "this keeps unwanted suitors at bay ;)!

If everything failed I would marry Robert Arryn.  Easy enough for her to control and with Sansa behind he may even grow into a decent Lord.

If Sansa was a true, true bitch, which I do not think she is, she would allow Robin to be murdered, allow LF to murder Harry in turn and jump on Tyrion's wagon when Dany invades lol.  If Edmure and his child die she could end up with WF, Riverlands and Casterly!

Okay, Jon is the beneficiary of Robb's Will but Jon will surely have bigger fish to fry... I think she would not fight her brothers unless she has a logical justification but I do believe if she doesn't get either WF or CR or the Eyrie or the Tully seat she will be pissed, but wouldn't anyone???  I only say this because I think she is going to do a hell of a lot more than knitting.  Nothing wrong with knitting but she is being trained as a politician; she is married to a politician and the apprentice of the most devious politician yet and still people see her only organising a charity gala lol  Charity galas may come about in the restoration period (epilogue and beyond) but she has a role to play which is not fundraising by way of baking cakes lol

As for rewards, okay, I know you said ignore WWs for now okay then the obvious, reward the ones who fought for you, punish the others.  Still, short-sighted.  If she has any incline (even by way of strong rumours) of what is ahead, keep them all alive to fight a better day for humanity.  Personally, I wouldn't punish harshly a family who fought for say, Rickon, provided they weren't calling all the shots against me.  I would be merciful.  I would have other ways of ensuring their allegiance... dragons is one...Jon could be another...  I would cut very few heads but make them all understand what defiance could mean for us all.  Quoting both Varys and Tyrion "Power resides where people believes it resides,"  "No, death is too extreme, fear of death on the other hand...";)

 

[Clegane'sPup]

Sansa Stark Lannister storyline is a problem for me. She is married to Tyrion. Both she and Tyrion are being hunted because they are believed to be the ones who killed King Joff. Until Cersei and Tommen Lannister Baratheon are removed from the Iron Throne, Sansa is dependent on LF to keep her safe. Another problem Sansa has is the lords of the Vale aren’t all that pleased with LF, who gets his prestige from the Lannister Baratheon rule of the IT.

Most people believe Sansa is the last of the Stark line. It is her claim to WF that is important. Sansa Stark Lannister is basically powerless and in my opinion LF is feeding Sansa a bunch of horse pucky.

Blending the story, in the Vale people are preparing for a tourney. In the north there is a blizzard going on with Stannis wanting to take WF and a bunch of northmen holed up inside WF. Some of those northmen are right angry with Bolton and some of the northmen know that pethaps both Bran & Rickon are alive.  Stannis, LC Snow and the free folk know about the Other threat. The people south of the neck don’t seem concerned about wildlings and grumpkins.

In the south the Golden Company with Ageon has arrived. JonCon sent a letter to Prince Doran of Dorne.  Doran has sent an emissary to a meet and greet. The Ironborn are harassing the coast in and around the area of Old Town. I’m not sure what is going on at Dragonstone. Dragonstone is an important deterrent against an invading fleet attacking KL.

Let me not forget to mention the impending Dragon Queen invasion.

 

Where does Sansa and the Vale fit into this free for all?

 

The Vale lords didn’t participate in the recent war. They are a strong force. The riverlands are under Lannister/Baratheon control. Westerlands are under Lannister control and support the IT. The Reach has thrown in with the IT.  The Ironborn are attacking. The Golden Company is attacking. Dorne is aloof and may throw in with Aegon. The north is snow bound.

There are posters who are very knowledgeable about the Vale situation. I am not one of them though. Winter is coming and I have a difficult time seeing the Vale lords marching through the snow to WF unless it is to help defeat the Others.

I think something harsh is going to take place in the Vale if Robert Arryn dies while he is under LF’s protection. Sansa participated in the lie about how Lysa died. .Sansa because she is a fugitive, is in a perilous predicament. If Robert Arryn dies or if Sansa spills the beans of what she knows, are the Vale lords going to be supportive or are they going to get angry?

Here’s another what if --- Robert Arryn does not die, LF does marry his false daughter to Harry without revealing his false daughter is Sansa Stark Lannister ---- what can 14 year old Sansa do? I still do not see the force of the Vale tramping through the snow to WF. Maybe come Spring they will.

[Morgana Lannister]

34 minutes ago, Clegane'sPup said:

Sansa Stark Lannister storyline is a problem for me. She is married to Tyrion. Both she and Tyrion are being hunted because they are believed to be the ones who killed King Joff. Until Cersei and Tommen Lannister Baratheon are removed from the Iron Throne, Sansa is dependent on LF to keep her safe. Another problem Sansa has is the lords of the Vale aren’t all that pleased with LF, who gets his prestige from the Lannister Baratheon rule of the IT.

Most people believe Sansa is the last of the Stark line. It is her claim to WF that is important. Sansa Stark Lannister is basically powerless and in my opinion LF is feeding Sansa a bunch of horse pucky.

Blending the story, in the Vale people are preparing for a tourney. In the north there is a blizzard going on with Stannis wanting to take WF and a bunch of northmen holed up inside WF. Some of those northmen are right angry with Bolton and some of the northmen know that pethaps both Bran & Rickon are alive.  Stannis, LC Snow and the free folk know about the Other threat. The people south of the neck don’t seem concerned about wildlings and grumpkins.

In the south the Golden Company with Ageon has arrived. JonCon sent a letter to Prince Doran of Dorne.  Doran has sent an emissary to a meet and greet. The Ironborn are harassing the coast in and around the area of Old Town. I’m not sure what is going on at Dragonstone. Dragonstone is an important deterrent against an invading fleet attacking KL.

Let me not forget to mention the impending Dragon Queen invasion.

 

Where does Sansa and the Vale fit into this free for all?

 

The Vale lords didn’t participate in the recent war. They are a strong force. The riverlands are under Lannister/Baratheon control. Westerlands are under Lannister control and support the IT. The Reach has thrown in with the IT.  The Ironborn are attacking. The Golden Company is attacking. Dorne is aloof and may throw in with Aegon. The north is snow bound.

There are posters who are very knowledgeable about the Vale situation. I am not one of them though. Winter is coming and I have a difficult time seeing the Vale lords marching through the snow to WF unless it is to help defeat the Others.

I think something harsh is going to take place in the Vale if Robert Arryn dies while he is under LF’s protection. Sansa participated in the lie about how Lysa died. .Sansa because she is a fugitive, is in a perilous predicament. If Robert Arryn dies or if Sansa spills the beans of what she knows, are the Vale lords going to be supportive or are they going to get angry?

Here’s another what if --- Robert Arryn does not die, LF does marry his false daughter to Harry without revealing his false daughter is Sansa Stark Lannister ---- what can 14 year old Sansa do? I still do not see the force of the Vale tramping through the snow to WF. Maybe come Spring they will.

Well, her story-line has to be there for a reason.  I agree with you that much and more is happening without her storyline.  Still George has dedicated time to it both in ADWD and in the preview chapter and they both point at her indirectly creating an army in the Vale....

I agree with you that her marriage to Tyrion is unresolved and we are to see more on this but mayhaps not until the end of TWOW or even the final book.

lol yes,  I am one of the ones that loves the Vale plot (hated the Ramsay/Sansa one in the show).  Tyrion and Sansa are married for a reason (speaking of narrative) and I cannot see two characters with more reason to want to bring LF down lol.  In the show it was done with Arya, and although I do not doubt Arya would be sympathetic, LF is not so directly in her arc.

I reckon almost everyone will end up converging in WF anyway but even before then, there is some built up with Myranda Royce (friend or foe as she may be) and Ser Sadrich the Mad Mouse so something is brewing with Sansa for sure that will have an impact in the overall story.  My wild guesses above lol

[Clegane'sPup]

3 hours ago, Morgana Lannister said:

Well, her story-line has to be there for a reason.  I agree with you that much and more is happening without her storyline.  Still George has dedicated time to it both in ADWD and in the preview chapter and they both point at her indirectly creating an army in the Vale....

I'm not sure how to approach this without offending Sansa fans.  Combining what I posted earlier with this thought:

Sansa has suffered. She has no one to help her. When she trusts people it turns out badly. She believes her family dead. She witnessed her father’s death. Joff mentally tortured her and his guard physically beat her..

Martin seems to have put Sansa in a perilous situation. As much as I would like to see her outsmart LF I am no longer sure she can and I ‘m not so sure that the Vale lords would be willing to support her, especially if Robert Arryn dies.

As to the army part, there is already an army in the Vale. Sansa has nothing to do with creating an army. The Vale lords are not happy with LF and they show up.

A Feast for Crows - Alayne I     Young Lord Hunter and his levies had joined the others two days past. Nestor Royce had closed the Gates against them, but he had fewer than three hundred men in his garrison. Each of the Lords Declarant had brought a thousand, and there were six of them. Alayne knew their names as well as her own. Benedar Belmore, Lord of Strongsong. Symond Templeton, the Knight of Ninestars. Horton Redfort, Lord of Redfort. Anya Waynwood, Lady of Ironoaks. Gilwood Hunter, called Young Lord Hunter by all and sundry, Lord of Longbow Hall. And Yohn Royce, mightiest of them all, the redoubtable Bronze Yohn, Lord of Runestone, Nestor's cousin and the chief of the senior branch of House Royce. The six had gathered at Runestone after Lysa Arryn's fall, and there made a pact together, vowing to defend Lord Robert, the Vale, and one another. Their declaration made no mention of the Lord Protector, but spoke of "misrule" that must be ended, and of "false friends and evil counselors" as well.

In that same chapter:

A Feast for Crows - Alayne I     Lady Waynwood sighed. "Lord Petyr, if you think to set us one against the other, you may spare yourself the effort. We speak with one voice here. Runestone suits us all. Lord Yohn raised three fine sons of his own, there is no man more fit to foster his young lordship. Maester Helliweg is a good deal older and more experienced than your own Maester Colemon, and better suited to treat Lord Robert's frailties. In Runestone the boy will learn the arts of war from Strong Sam Stone. No man could hope for a finer master-at-arms. Septon Lucos will instruct him in matters of the spirit. At Runestone he will also find other boys his own age, more suitable companions than the old women and sellswords that presently surround him."

I do not see the Vale lords traveling to WF except maybe in Spring.

 

 

[Ralphis Baratheon]

I believe eventually Strong Robin will be declared King of Mountain and Vale and possibly the King of the Trident. Through his marriage with Sansa he'll have a claim to the North and maybe he'll decide to save it after she persuades him too. So I can see Sansa being Queen of the Vale, Riverlands and North with Robert Arryn being her King. The Vale has one of the largest remaining armies that hasn't been bled by war and also seems to have a good amount of food reserves as well.

[Corvo the Crow]

I marry Ramsay so I am one step closer to making the eight. I let him kill Rickon so he won't get in the way of my ascend but mostly because even Brandon the Broken is a better runner and he was a cripple too craven to take his own life.

I let my husband and my half brother who is actually my cousin fight over the North with all the remaining Northman and all the wildlings this side of the wall, once the battle becomes bloody enough with high casualties I use knights of the vale to win the fight so in the end no Northman is powerful enough to oppose me.

Feed Ramsay to the hounds for fun I also give Baelish the middle finger and kill him so I am the only one able to manipulate my sweet cousin Robyn "weekseed" Arryn.

Robyn becomes my ward to keep him in the North with his foreign army to back me. 

I am now the most powerful person in the North. I am the rightful ruler since I am the Ned's girl so no Northman should oppose me, not that any single house has the strength left anyway and if they decide to band up my sweet cousin will crush them for me with his big army. If my cousin becomes a problem, well, my Northman are honor bound to help Ned's little girl save the North from the invading southerners.

 

Sound familiar so far?

I also marry my cousin Jon, so I have a strong man beside me and to merge the two branches and consolidate my rule... at least thats what I say to people but real reason is deep down I want to be a Targ and what better way to go Targ while still keeping it Stark than to marry my half brother who was actually my cousin?

[Ghost+Nymeria4Eva]

On 4/1/2018 at 1:39 AM, Stormking902 said:

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

I think you are just giving Sansa too much credit. She's always been a kind of an airhead, kind of selfish and definitely not nearly as sharp or observant as her sister Arya. Of course, her story has evolved since GoT, but how much has Sansa changed? It's worthwhile asking if she would actually want to rule or take over. Sansa has always just wanted to be a lady, married to a handsome knight.

I think she would want some vengeance against Cersi and Littlefinger. Right now, I think her arc focuses on Littlefinger. He thinks Sansa is malleable, like Lysa, but with Cat's looks. But from GoT we know that's not really her. She can lie when she wants to get what she wants, as seen with the case with Lady. When Lady is set to be killed, she doesn't come forward and admit to the lie. She just lets Lady die. I think LF is severely underestimating Sansa here. She will probably be the end of him, and afterwards, maybe Sansa would be a lady as she wants to. but the problem is, if LF is gone, who's going to believe her when she says she's a Stark? 

[goldenmaps]

On 4/1/2018 at 11:51 AM, Lollygag said:

I am not going back to sleep, Sansa realized. My head is all a tumult. She pushed her pillow away reluctantly, threw back the blankets, went to her window, and opened the shutters.

I don't know if this is relevant but in the first book, after Ned and Cat was intimate, Ned went to the window and opened it.  It was told in a Cat POV.

Do we know if Arya or Bran likes the cold? 

[Lollygag]

9 minutes ago, goldenmaps said:

I don't know if this is relevant but in the first book, after Ned and Cat was intimate, Ned went to the window and opened it.  It was told in a Cat POV.

Do we know if Arya or Bran likes the cold? 

You're thinking along the same lines I am.

I haven't reread Catelyn recently, but I think I recall increasing associations with Robb and cold, too. I don't recall anything like this with Bran or Arya, but I'm likely not remembering them if they're there as I've only recently noted this.

[Clegane'sPup]

On 3/31/2018 at 4:09 PM, Stormking902 said:

Lets say Sansa rallys the knights of the Vale to retake WF and the North and they succeed in doing so and destroy Roose and Ramsey in the process, lets also assume that Rickon is found and returned to WF by Wylis Manderly since his father dies from his neck wound.

Lets put the WW invasion on the backburner just for this topics sake, as Sansa Stark how do you solidify your hold on the North?. Who do you reward, who do you punish? What happens to the Dreadfort? Does Sansa allow Rickon his birthright and she stay his Regent or does she steal WF?. 

Let’s say we try this again. Sansa is preparing for a tourney in the Vale.

While Stannis is snow bound and hunkered down at a crofter’s village near WF. He has Karstark. He has Theon, Jeyne who is fArya, and he has Asha, who is Theon’s sister.

Sansa is preparing for a tourney in the Vale at the foot of Eyrie, better known as the Bloody Gate.

Sansa Stark Lannister has no hold on the north because Sansa Stark Lannister is planning a tourney at the foot of the Eyrie better known as the Bloody Gate.

FFS. What? People dunna know the difference betwixt the book saga and da tv show.?

[The Mother of The Others]

That was incredibly hard, Corvo.    When times get tough she may fall back on the lessons learned from Cersei.    When you know the song, and you know what part Cersei will be singing, that allows you to match Cersei note for note should you choose, yes, but it also gives you the option to innovate, to sing a harmony part over the top of cersei.  Applying the same physics of power, but applying them differently, with feeling.   A more beautiful song from a more prettier wolf queen come to huff and puff and blow the door down.   

Vale don't like Lannisters?     Aegon don't like Lannisters.     

 Sansa went to the school of hard knocks where her major was in political science?   - ->  Team up with Aegon's posse and you can play politics.   Bring more army to his army.  More nobles.   Winning the recruiting war.   While advising the Aegon camp as a Cersei expert.    But to get her payback she gots to go back, south.   

Sansa got hurt so bad she just wants to go home?   Feels stronger while pretending to stand there?   - ->    Home is where the heart is.   There is no home to go back to.   Not if the realm is lost, especially.    A crown army will come for the traitor North, unless that army isn't sent because Sansa played offense at or around KL to give WF its best defense.   Vale gets happy happy win win job of liberating Riverlands, payback on Casterly with help from Tyrion.   Pick yur heart up off the floor and get back in the game.

And when Deanerys lands and has that awkward as all fuck staredown with Aegon, it's Sansa and Tyrion who could wave at each other from opposite sides and break the ice for the two Targs, offering to take them out on a double date while vouching for their fav Targ and promising that the Targs are gonna like each other if they'd just sniff one another's....fire. 

That whole secret Blackfyre thang?  That's just The Man telling you to turn against each other, man.  You don't have to listen to the war drums of the past.  You can overlook the Blackfyre schism , treat it like the bygone that it is.  Just hump it out , Targs.  And focus on saving the world from the Walking Whites.