Details, details, details part III

[supercait]

I noticed this last night while reading the Dany chapter in AGOT where they are in Vaes Dothrak and Viserys has just rejected Dany's gift of Dothraki attire. She's curling up for a nap and asks one of her handmaids to bring her a dragon's egg and the quote is "just being close to them made her feel stronger, as if somehow she were drawing strength from the stone dragons locked inside."

Relating to Melisandre's prophecy of Azor Ahai being reborn amidst salt and smoke and waking a stone dragon, I've seen people suggest there may be a dragon raised from Winterfell or Dragonstone and this will be the stone dragon. I think the quote supports Dany's dragons being the stone dragons.

[Raven Queen]

Sometimes she felt as though her heart had turned to stone;

That's a GREAT catch. Very nice.

[Sarella]

For all those who doubt that Jaime is the volonqar because you can't strangle someone with one hand...

Jaime, in the first chapter after losing his hand:

When I reach King's Landing I'll have a new hand forged, a golden hand, and one day I'll use it to rip out Vargo Hoat's throat.

And Davos, a few chapters later, when considering Melisandre:

Gone now, he remembered, and the ends of all four fingers as well. But his hands were still long enough to wrap about a woman's throat, he thought, especially a slender throat like hers.

[Ski the Swift]

For all those who doubt that Jaime is the volonqar because you can't strangle someone with one hand...

Jaime, in the first chapter after losing his hand:

When I reach King's Landing I'll have a new hand forged, a golden hand, and one day I'll use it to rip out Vargo Hoat's throat.

And Davos, a few chapters later, when considering Melisandre:

Gone now, he remembered, and the ends of all four fingers as well. But his hands were still long enough to wrap about a woman's throat, he thought, especially a slender throat like hers.

Yeah, I have to disagree with people who think you cannot strangle the life from soneone with one hand. It might be because you all have small hands? But it's very physically possible to strangle someone, especially if that person is a woman with a slender throat.

Thanks for pointing that out Sarella

[Guest Other-in-law]

The proposal to trade Sansa for Jaime has an element of a game of 'telephone' to it...with Cleos Frey as the weak link. Tyrion makes some proposals with no real expectation of their being accepted. Cleos relays this:

"...Lannister will exchange Arya and Sansa for his brother?"

"Yes. He sat on the Iron Throne and swore it."

"Before witnesses?"

"Before all the court, My lady. And the gods as well."

Cat makes more and more of this 'swearing in the sight of gods and men' and comes to consider it as a binding contract, though her side never actually corroborated that they had accepted it (which in fact, they technically didn't). When she hears that Tyrion wed Sansa she says:

"He swore to trade her for her brother. Sansa and Arya both. We would have them back if we returned his precious Jaime, he swore it before the whole court. How could he marry her, after saying that in the sight of gods and men?."

"He's the Kingslayer's brother. Oathbreaking runs in their blood."

But this "oath" didn't exist. Tyrion never swore anything.

[Michael Jon Snow]

Sometimes I wonder how many of these details are intentional, and how many are simply the by product of good writing.

[Angus Niven]

One from The Hedge Knight that I noticed a while back (I presume spoilers from it are allowed here?): as Dunk is preparing for his Trial of Seven, Prince Baelor says he will keep the Kingsguard busy, as their oaths forbid them to do more than defend themselves against him. One of his men asks if that's chivalrous, and he replies "If not, the gods will let us know."

Apparently, they did.

[Lann_Boys'Girl]

noooo, that's SO sad. Baelorrrrrr!!!!!!

[Sarella]

When the comet appears in the sky, some claim it is King Joffrey's comet, others claim it is King Stannis's.

However we, the reader, know it is Dany's. Yet I never noticed this before...

ACOK Tyrion I: Varys and Tyrion are talking.

"Have you seen the comet?"

"I'm short, not blind"

"They say it comes as a herald before a king, to warn of fire and blood to follow."

All the more amusing because Varys knows exactly what he is saying .

ACOK Bran I: Bran remembering a conversation with Osha.

And when he asked what the comet meant, she answered, "Blood and fire, boy, and nothing sweet."

[The Prince]

In response to the whole Jaime being tthe valonqar, I was thinking he might be too. Plus, doesn't Jaime also tell Qyburn that if he amputates his arm he might as well amuptate the other one or he'd strangle him with it? In addition, he doesn't have to strangle her with his hand, if he wrapped his arm around from behind then it be fairly plausible I'd say. But do we know who came out first?

[Ski the Swift]

Cersei definatly came out first.

[Sarella]

Plus, doesn't Jaime also tell Qyburn that if he amputates his arm he might as well amuptate the other one or he'd strangle him with it?

The Prince, you are right!

"Take any part of my arm, and you'd best chop off the other one as well, or I'll stangle you with it afterward"

I am now completely convinced that Jaime is the volanqar.

[RedSock in Westeros]

Cersei came out first. Jaime was holding her foot. It's been suggested by someone here (don't remember who) that it's quite possible that the hand that was holding Cersei's foot at birth is the hand that was cut off. Pretty neat symbolism there if that's actually the case.

[Guest Other-in-law]

The Prince, you are right!

"Take any part of my arm, and you'd best chop off the other one as well, or I'll stangle you with it afterward"

I am now completely convinced that Jaime is the volanqar.

Yeah, that was a good catch!

[lumer]

As I am rereading AGOT, I find Ned Stark to have quite a sharp tongue, whenever he is in a dark enough mood:

"At last we've found something you agree on." - On Sansa and Arya's complaints about leaving King's Landing

"Sleep is the great healer."

"I had hoped that was you."

- With GM Pycelle, about his leg.

After Cersei slapps him in the godswood:

"I shall wear that as a badge of honor"

And many more which I have forgotten...

Another little thing I noticed: We all know and love the ToJ scene, that ended with the words:

"And now it begins,"

"No, Now it ends."

And after Tyrion's trial by combat at the Eyrie, Catelyn's thoughts to Robert's "Is it over?" are:

No, it's only now beginning

notice that both chapters are one right after the other. A nice parallelism, methinks

[Piper]

After Cersei slapps him in the godswood:

"I shall wear that as a badge of honor"

And many more which I have forgotten...

Another little thing I noticed: We all know and love the ToJ scene, that ended with the words:

"And now it begins,"

"No, Now it ends."

And after Tyrion's trial by combat at the Eyrie, Catelyn's thoughts to Robert's "Is it over?" are:

No, it's only now beginning

notice that both chapters are one right after the other. A nice parallelism, methinks

Isn't the "wear it as a badge of honor" what Cersei says after Robert slaps her?

I love the catch on the now it ends/only now beginning

[Mad Monkey]

I think someone might have already mentioned this, but what the heck:

"Keep your mouth shut and do as I tell you, and maybe we'll even be in time for your uncle's bloody wedding

Sandor Clegane said that. Now, I don't think that he actually knew about the Red Wedding, but I just thought that was a cool bit of intentional foreshadowing.

[lumer]

Isn't the "wear it as a badge of honor" what Cersei says after Robert slaps her?

That's the beauty of it. Ned is obviously referencing it, to further annoy Cersei.

[Raven Queen]

I actually thought that Ned throwing that line back in her face was a little out-of-character, given that he was so clearly appalled when Robert back-handed Cersei. It seemed OOC that Ned would come back with something so bitchy, but then again, she did slap him.

[lumer]

I actually thought that Ned throwing that line back in her face was a little out-of-character, given that he was so clearly appalled when Robert back-handed Cersei. It seemed OOC that Ned would come back with something so bitchy, but then again, she did slap him.

Well I don't think it was out of character. Ned knows how to be sarcastic when he is in the correct mood. And remember why she slapped him - Cersei hints at sexual favors towards Ned in order to make him forget the whole deal, and he asks her if she made the same offer to Jon Arryn.

And the whole scene at the godswood is very sincere on both parts. Ned knows the king and queen hate each other, and he is given an honest answer. It was a place of no pretenses (perhaps one of the only truly open convetsations in the series, I think)