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The Prince

Westeros M2:TW mod- Suggestions

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Ok, I posted this elswhere but I'll post here as well... The task you guys have set for yourselves is a monumental one, and I appreciate that. However, I have an idea that I'd like to share with you. If you find that it would not be possible, then i ask that maybe I could use your mod as a basis for a project of my own (this). Obviously, for someone who has no experience in modding whatsoever, this would be difficult, but I can understand that you may not want to further burden yourselves.

In my opinion, to really give the game longevity I'm thinking you could have a mode where you create your own character(if possible), and start off on the map as a sort of neutral character.

Now the game would play out just like the regular game, meaning you're neutral and you need to ally yourself with a side. You could start off with around 100-200 men (merc soldiers), and you could actually go to one of the Lords, whether it be Lannister or a Stark, and offer up your service. You could be sent on missions (need to be a big improvement over the crappy missions you're normally given) and could even ordered to participate in large scale battles, supporting the rest of the army. (the army would be ai controlled aside from your own unit of men.)

As you carry out missions and advance in rank you could be granted a knighthood or even a lorship, given your own castle and the ability to produce your own units, etc.

I was also thinking maybe developing some kind of rating system, not just for how certain factions view you but how certain hero characters view you. So say Jaime's army is being beseiged and you arrive to his aid. His respect for you would go up. I'm also thinking maybe have like a talking minigame...kind of like in some rpgs...I've always thought the diplomacy shallow because you could choose to declare war and all, but you couldn't actually have your leader say it face to face to his the other one. And likewise, the way you speak to/treat the characters in the game could have an effect on the way they view you... So if there comes a time when you are in trouble yourself, you might be glad you saved Jaime or were always courteous to Robb or whatnot.

Furthermore, I also think it would be very interesting to give you some moral choices. For example, if you let your men pillage and rape at will, their morale would be higher...but you would have to deal with a loss of standing with Lords like Edmure Tully and the like. Lower standing with an enemy could mean that your antagonist would chase you around the map in order to get his hands on you, and make every attempt to ambush or kill you, while higher standing could mean him coming up to you before the battle to ask for a surrender, or possibly even letting you escape if you were captured in the battle. (I figure instead of having your general die, he could get wounded and captured since he's your main character.) Also, different actions would have different impacts on different men. For example, if you often go into battle outnumbered, and come out victorious, then Jaime might take a liking to you, but his father might be the opposite, believing you to be reckless. However, if you are careful enough to not fight a losing battle, but ready to strike the moment an enemy slips up, then you might gain Lord Tywin's respect...etc.

I also think that the importance of the major characters in the game and the dialogue that you can have with them CANNOT be overlooked. Martin's series is as good as it is because of its characters. Without them the mod would simply give Medieval 2 a new coat of paint. The characters are the reason that Martin's world comes alive, the reason that I personally can hardly put the books down, and I think that if we really want to do the mod right, we should hold true to that.

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P.S. You guys have so many forums I don't know where to post lol...

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Prince -

It's an interesting idea... however, the mod tools that have been released for M2TW are fairly limited. There's surprisingly little customization that can be done. If you are familiar with the game, you'll notice that the changes you're suggesting (i.e. beginning as a faction without territory) are rather extreme. They would require a complete overhaul of the system... which, unfortunately, is not possible in the current state of affairs.

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I'd also suggest that, for this sub-forum, at least, we keep the new threads to a minimum... it'd make it too hard to keep track of changes if the threads proliferate too much. That said, there is a need for a thread regarding suggestions/ideas for the mod. Might I suggest renaming the thread to "Westeros M2:TW mod- Suggestions"? This would keep in line with the general format being used, and open up the thread to further use. Thanks!

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sure that would be fine. I guess we could maybe have you choose which Lord you want to serve right at the begining, and you would be provided with a bit of land and some very very basic base. So that would eliminate the no territory problem, and it could probably be pretty readily implemented (you would basically be a vassal that gradually grows in power as you carry out missions, etc.

Also, please realize I'm not try to replace the grand campaign with this mode, I'm just thinking of it as something in addition to the grand campaign. Like I told someone else involved with the mod at one of your other forums (lol) I think the importance of characters can't be overlooked. They are what makes the books special. Without them, all our changes would be superficial. Our mod needs a soul! Lol, ok, from now on I'll tone down the melodrama...I'm done..

EDIT:

Also, I apologize if some of the changes seem way out there... I love the game but I have no idea how to mod. Willing to learn though, if you guys need help.

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Also, I apologize if some of the changes seem way out there... I love the game but I have no idea how to mod. Willing to learn though, if you guys need help.

The guy to contact is Marcus... he's the ringmaster here. Send him a PM, and volunteer your services.

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thankyou. I sent him a pm. I hope he can find something for me to do.

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Which other forum were you posting at? And what you're suggesting is impossible. All named characters must be assigned a faction, so unless you're proposing this character to have its own faction and then ally as one sees fit...Which, to me, seems little different than any regular campaign. The M2TW: Kingdoms expansion seems to allow certain named characters to have unique effects, however if this is moddable is yet to be seen. The Kingdoms expansion tentative release is August...

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yes, that's basically what I mean. A sort of custom faction for the player, and when he allies he enters into a sort of vassalship with one of the greater lords, and eventually gains more power and control, etc. Just to sort of give it the feel that you are a general fighting for a lord, who worked his way up, not some omnipotent being that can control an entire country at will. :P Though I must admit that is fun as well. Also, it would provide a way/means to logically interact with the ingame characters. I look forward to the kingdoms release and hopefully, it will make all this a little more feasible. I realize this may not be possible nor practical for you at this point, but I just wanted to let you know what I was thinking.

The other 2 places I posted at were...

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=68676

and

http://asoif.jamesgoodwin.ca/forums/

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Sadly the system itself allows little for more character interactions. Even if we did add some dialogue window for major characters it'll still wear old after a few inevitable repetitions.

That said, I like to roleplay M2:TW too, and I'd love to play the minor feudal lord who'll have to work his way up in his faction. Say in this mode you start out with only 1 or 2 settlements, and you're a custom faction tied with your default liege in vassalage. You can choose to serve your master or yourself by carving out your own lands, but you shouldn't go against a major faction on your own or you'll get squashed. Utilize diplomacy and politics and a great deal of imagination and this might work.

This is more of an extended idea than a suggestion for Westeros:TW...Actually I think this is fairly moddable even in vanilla, though changing the host faction might be abit tedious. The biggest problem is that the AI controlled host faction is too unpredictable(ie, it's usually too dumb). But this we'll have to count on the patch and the AI mod guys...

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hmmm yea I see what you mean. If only we could find a way to make the character interactions work...

And yes, that was basically what i was thinking.

As for the host faction...would it be too much for the ai to actually come up with rudimentary plans/strategies? For example, if the ai wants to capture a city, could it figure out to lead one army to up around to distract any enemy armies in the vicinity, and a second smaller force to actually take the city with? Because if it came up with simply plans a few at a time like that, and attatched you to some of them, I think that would work quite well. Although again, I don't know if that's plausible.

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When M2:K comes out, we can have some territorial campaigns

Dany's campaign in the East

Maybe the conquest of the Rhoynar (Rhoynar vs Andals (or was it first men?))

Appearance of the Dothraki (just after the doom vs the free cities and dragonstone maybe?)

And historical battles

-A HB campaign a la Alexander (if it's possible) of Robert-s Rebellion

- Battle of the Bells

- Ambush at Summerhall

- Ruby Ford

- Sacking of King's Landing (easy!)

- Relief of Storm's End (what if? scenario)

-Redgrass Fields

-The 3000 Unsullied of Qohor

-WotFK

-Battle in the Golden Tooth (riverlords vs Jaime)

-Siege of Rivverun

-The green Fork

-Dondarrion's ambushed (can't remember the name)

-Battle of the Camps

-Battle of King's Landing

-Battle of the Fords (Edmure vs Lannister)

-Duskendale (Tarly vs Glover)

-The Shield Islands (Ironborn vs Tyrell on maybe one of the shields?)

EDIT: @ Aeleron the 1.2 patch AI is much better. it's not really that passive, and on VH/VH vanilla, it is still quite a powerful enemy... it's stil not nearly as good as a human though

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So I've heard, but I'm accustomed to playing mods and most of them are waiting for the official one to start working with 1.2, so I'm waiting too. But damn CA, been saying that since the start of April...one of these days I'll just impulse download the thing and get over with it:P

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Go for it. Someone on twcenter.net (can't remember who) found out how to access hotseat mode (H)

EDIT: aaw, MSN smily shortcuts aren't the same here

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All good ideas, but you must realise how much you're asking for. Currently it's a team of two... you'll be lucky if we hammer out one campaign, let alone..three extras and about twenty historicals...

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Can't you recruit more? I'm sure people here would be glad to learn how to mod, and those interested in on in TWCenter.net. Still the old skinner/graphic artist problem eh?

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There aren't any. We've been looking for people for two years between TWC and STC. When we finally get one, they never stay for long.

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Westeros has officially required the use of the BBB mod. However pnut recommends we wait and use the 1.2 version upon its release.

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While everyone is wrestling the 1.2 patch, let's proceed to discuss the traits and retinues. Vanilla and BBB offered alot of the generalistic ones already, we should concentrate on thinking up specific Westeros-related ones IMO.

BTW, the BBB mod is available at

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=84493

It's small and txt-based, very mod-friendly and even a good read if you've too much time.

Here's a list of what I've thought up until now:

Traits:

Major Bloodlines

Kingslayer

Kinslayer

Warg

Dwarf (traits can "title" the character, so we get Tyrion "the Dwarf", Jon "the Warg" etc

Secretly Female -for generals like Dacey

Other magical effects for Melisandre, Thoros and Stannis

Ancilliaries:

Heraldry(for all settlements, or at least the bigger ones)

Lord of Winterfell, Lord of Lannisport, King of the Iron Throne, etc

Offices

Hand of the King

master of law

master of coin-reserved for littlefinger?

master of ships

master of horse

(master of whisperers?)-I've envisioned Varys as a retinue you get when you hold Kingslanding.

(Commander of City Watch?)

Commander of Kingsguard

Grandmaester Pycelle -same with Varys

-Aside from Varys and Py, these offices will be granted to generals that stay in the crownlands. We can set different conditions for each, like you get master of horse when you stay in a castle with stables and so on.

Castellan

Steward

-These are basic offices for every major house.

MaestersThis is mere reference, I'd content with just a "Maester" retinue for every lord

Ballabar - Redwyne

Qyburn - chainless

Luwin - stark

Creylen - Lannister

Colemon - Arryn

Vyman - Tully

Lomys - Tyrell

Caleotte - Martell

Pylos or Cressen - Baratheon

Wendamyr - greyjoy

Aemon - Nightswatch

Magic wielders

Melisandre

Thoros of Myr

Wildling Wargs

Pyromancers?

Soldiers

Vargo Hoat

Salladhor Saan

Bronn

Timett and other Clan heads, or maybe merge them into one "Clan Captains" retinue

Areo Hotah

Espionage

we can just rename the existing ones to fit our setting. Spies =>little birds/outriders etc

Fools

Butterbumps - Tyrell

Jinglebell - Frey

patchface - Baratheon

Moon boy - Kingslanding

Bards and Singers

Marillion

others

Special individuals

Hodor

Left and Right

Syrio Forel?

Mord?

Special items & creatures

the direwolves

ravens

Valyrian swords

magic items?

I say let's nail the list first and figure out their effects later. We need ideas!

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