MMA 3:UFC 87 Recap

[GSP]

But of course, I do think BJ GSP 2's a must as well.

I think BJ takes it this weekend in all likelyhood, but that Sherk gives him troubles big time. If five flush knees to the face a la Franka (something like that, I'm guessing the number, seemed to happen about once a round or more for five iirc) didn't knock the pitbull out, even a patented BJ Penn Heavy Hand isn't going to rattle Sherk like it did Stevenson is my guess. Sherk's also very difficult to choke with his inhuman bull kneck and cardio (we've seen lots of dudes gas their arms out trying) which will give BJ fits. He's got incredibly short, muscular arms, which are supposedly the hardest to nail arm bars on, and phenomenal strength to resist locks of any kind to boot. Of course, Penn's game on the ground is just mean enough that I'm sure he could bait Sherk into something that does lock on, I'm just saying I don't expect it to be the walk over for Penn that many on the forums seem to think.

[benderschweiz]

[quote name='GSP' post='1362771' date='May 20 2008, 18.44']But of course, I do think BJ GSP 2's a must as well.

I think BJ takes it this weekend in all likelyhood, but that Sherk gives him troubles big time. If five flush knees to the face a la Franka (something like that, I'm guessing the number, seemed to happen about once a round or more for five iirc) didn't knock the pitbull out, even a patented BJ Penn Heavy Hand isn't going to rattle Sherk like it did Stevenson is my guess. Sherk's also very difficult to choke with his inhuman bull kneck and cardio (we've seen lots of dudes gas their arms out trying) which will give BJ fits. He's got incredibly short, muscular arms, which are supposedly the hardest to nail arm bars on, and phenomenal strength to resist locks of any kind to boot. Of course, Penn's game on the ground is just mean enough that I'm sure he could bait Sherk into something that does lock on, I'm just saying I don't expect it to be the walk over for Penn that many on the forums seem to think.[/quote]

It'll be a great fight no doubt. Those knees Sherk took from Franca were sick...Chances though are if Sherk wins it'll be by decision with his wrestling, and I think BJ will end up catching him during a take down or on the ground.

Affliction just signed A. Rogerio Nogueira and the HW matchups they can put together are probably better than what the UFC can manage, especially if they can sign Arlovski. Hope this show goes well for them and they stick around.

[url="http://www.afflictionbanned.com/"]http://www.afflictionbanned.com/[/url]

[Analu]

[quote name='Barry Emelianenko' post='1361574' date='May 19 2008, 21.50']Re: Monson. His record is chock full of real cans. I can't pull out one decent win on his record.[/quote]
Fujita?

[quote]Monson has to be the most over-rated HW in the world.[/quote]
How can he be the most overrated HW In the world when he's not even rated in the top 20 of most HW lists? In any case, I don't even like Monson very much, so if you think he's a can and overrated, fine with me.


[quote name='benderschweiz' post='1362583' date='May 20 2008, 10.57']UFC 84 Predictions

[b]BJ Penn[/b] vs. Sean Sherk
Wanderlei Silva vs [b]Keith Jardine[/b]
[b]Wilson Gouveia[/b] vs. Goran Reljic
Tito Ortiz vs. [b]Lyoto Machida[/b]
[b]Thiago Silva[/b] vs. Antonio Mendes[/quote]
I'd go with all your picks, except I'm picking Wandy over Jardine.


Just watched the UFC 84 Countdown that I DVR'd from last night. It was awesome. All the segments were entertaining except for Jardines. Seriously, is there [i]any[/i] way to market this guy? He's too nice to play the heel, too rough-looking to play the golden boy, too bland to spark any interest. He's a good, heavy-handed fighter and has vicious leg kicks, but needs to pull something drastic like a Hulk Hogan and dye his beard black and just embrace the dark side.

Machida's segment was sick, with shots of him going thru his Shotokan forms in the moonlight and him talking about trying to be a samurai. He comes across as very humble and likable. I hope he destroys Tito.

Enough's been said about BJ and Sherk, and I'm just ready for them to fight. Sherk actually seems like a decent guy and I kinda wish BJ wouldn't trash on him so hard, but that's BJ for ya. He almost needs to hate his opponent to get up for a fight.

I'd love to see GSP and Anderson, but I'd rather see GSP and BJ redux. I actually think Anderson would beat GSP fairly easily, since much of GSP's edge has always been that he's always been so much bigger than his opponents. And while he does fantastic against wrestlers, strikers seem to give him more problems. Anderson's probably the best striker in MMA right now and would tower over GSP by a good 3-4 inches.

[Oorag]

I missed the Countdown show, which really sucks because I am chomping at the bit to see this fight. I'll be leaving tomorrow night after work, picking up a friend, and then driving out to Vegas that night.

My picks:
[u][b]BJ Penn[/b] vs. Sean Sherk[/u]
I think Penn has the edge standing, be hard to take down, punish Sherk every time he stuffs a takedown, threaten submissions from the bottom, and be hard to keep down. Penn has it in him to beat guys like Hughes when he's in shape, and Sherk is sort of a miniature Hughes.

[u]Wanderlei Silva vs [b]Keith Jardine[/b] [/u]
This one is hard. Maybe I'm just a little over-awed by Jardine's victory over Liddell, but I think Jardine has clicked, and Silva's days as a dominant force are over. I'm doing the lazy thing and expecting history to repeat itself: Silva will come out with the wild brawling style that failed against Liddell, and Jardine will have a cagey gameplan like the one that beat Liddell.
[u]
[b]Wilson Gouveia [/b]vs. Goran Reljic [/u]
As I recall, Gouveia was losing to Lambert in his last fight before getting a highlight reel KO. Reljic also has an impressive record, but this is his first fight in the UFC. I'll take the grizzled survivor over a youngblood.

[u]Tito Ortiz vs. [b]Lyoto Machida[/b][/u]
Tito is going to be hyper-motivated to win this fight. Machida will have to avoid the GnP, but his wrestling is good enough, I think, to do it. He'll nullify Tito's game like he does everyone else's and pick Tito apart with strikes. Putting some money down on this one as well.

[u][b]Thiago Silva[/b] vs. Antonio Mendes[/u]
I'm expecting big things from Thiago, and Mendes is another freshman to the UFC.

[u][b]Rameau Thierry Sokoudjou[/b] vs. Kazuhiro Nakamura[/u]
I'm hoping Sokodjou will not become yet another flash in the pan, but his last loss was to Machida, so that's not such an embarressment. Plus, I've learned to count against any new Japanese fighter coming into the UFC. Only the jobbers seem to come to the UFC, and Nakamura has apparently made a career out of being a punching bag for PRIDE'S big names.

[Ser Barry]

Evans vs Irvin is off. Irvin broke his foot. This frigging card is cursed. I fully expect Hughes to fall pregnant and Bisping to turn in to a chicken in the next couple of weeks.

[benderschweiz]

[quote name='BJ Penn' post='1364657' date='May 21 2008, 16.04']Just watched the UFC 84 Countdown that I DVR'd from last night. It was awesome. All the segments were entertaining except for Jardines. Seriously, is there [i]any[/i] way to market this guy? He's too nice to play the heel, too rough-looking to play the golden boy, too bland to spark any interest. He's a good, heavy-handed fighter and has vicious leg kicks, but needs to pull something drastic like a Hulk Hogan and dye his beard black and just embrace the dark side.[/quote]

He just needs to change his nickname to Technoviking and dance to the cage ala Gono. Another career benefitted by youtube...

[Ken Stone]

I might as well get my picks in for the big show.

BJ Penn vs. [b]Sean Sherk[/b] - This is a hard one to call. Both fighters seem like they have so much to prove and insane motivation to win the fight. In the end though I think Sherk's style will be too much for BJ handle and he will pin and kidney punch his way to victory.

[b]Wanderlei Silva[/b] vs Keith Jardine - This is really an interesting match up and I think, in the end, it will put the nail in the "MMA Math" coffin (you know, fighter A beat fighter B, and fighter B beat fighter C, so fighter A will beat fighter C).

[b]Tito Ortiz[/b] vs. Lyoto Machida - Tito's looked like crap recently and Machida is undefeated. Tito was basically thrown in there to get some publicity for Machida. Every thing about this fight screams upset. I'm going with Tito and I can't wait to see his T-Shirt after the fight.

[b]Thiago Silva[/b] vs. Antonio Mendes - I don't know much about Mendes so I'm going with Silva, since he beat down my boy.

[GSP]

Who's 'your boy' Ken? We talkin Houston Alexander here?

I don't know about the difficulty of marketing Jardine but that's really only a concern for drawing the more casual fans. That mean lookin mutha can fight and that's all I care about at the end of the day. No skin off my sack if they can't throw him down the right marketing pidgeon hole.

Funny thing, I read somewhere that Sherk's fireback at the Penn roid trash talkin is that he's a 'pothead' and also therefore a cheater. With all due respect, while good ol mj is against the rules and will get you banned, it's not like there is even any anectdotal theories out there about how marijuana could be considered 'performance enhanceing' for a cage fighter. For some kind of artist or something, perhaps, but not a fighter. I'm just curious if there's any truth to it, that Bj's a midnight toker or something. Truth be told it'd kind of endear me to him even more. It's wierd, I usually despise the 'arrogant trash talking' type, but I've got a notable exception for BJ (and the Diaz brothers to) in my heart. Besides, if true, I can now throw 'puffin one with the Prodigy' as one of those things I want to do before I die. :smoking:

[Oorag]

Just got a look at Goran Reljic. He's huge, and he's training with Xtreme Couture. I might have to rethink my prediction.

Did anyon catch TUF last night? DB, or whatever his name is, looks like he's got some skills. He reversed Rampage and tapped him in about ten seconds! Excellent fight as well, though the best part of the episode was Gray Maynard obliviously wandering in front of Forrest's net-gun and then darting out of the room.

[GSP]

C.B. Dolloway's that Matt Daemon lookin freaks name, and yeah, he's pretty good. He's one of the bloggers over on MMAJunkie.com.

So, GSP/Fitch is on this summer. Poor Fitch IMHO. GSP's been makin world class wrestlers look silly lately.

[Ser Barry]

Coleman is out of the Lesnar fight with a knee injury. GSP vs Fitch has been added to the August card.


[b]BJ[/b] vs Sherk
BJ is the best fighter on the planet. I don't see this getting out of the 2nd round.


[b]Wandy[/b] vs Jardine
Wandy to start his comeback. Jardine looks good against counter-punchers. His movement is not good enough for him to avoid Wandy's punches.


Gouveia vs [b]Reljic[/b]
I'll go for Reljic just because WG is one f thse fighters I just can't take to.


Ortiz vs [b]Machida[/b]
Closest fight to call for me but I think Machida will be too elusive for Tito.


[b]Silva[/b] vs Mendes
Silva showed improvement last time and I think he takes this fairly early.


On the undercard Judo Terry to pwn Nakamura.

[Cuellar]

To go back to the GSP vs the spider fight... spider would absolutely destroy him. Like BJ said above, GSP relies on his size to win fights, and his speed and strength help him dominate. Against a badass bigger striker with BJJ skills, like the spider, he is going to be beat down pretty easily.

I think BJ will take Sherk. BJ is just far too skilled on the ground, and can take quite a bit of punishment. The only problem I can forsee is if it goes to the cards, I could easily see Sherk winning it. There is no way Sherk is not going to be active throughout the fight, and will definitely be pushing BJ around the whole time.... but all it takes is one mistake and BJ will end the fight.

Wandy? I'd go with Jardine... who has been involved in some serious beatdowns of overrated fighters.

I also have no faith in Ortiz. I think his work ethic has died down, and his main strength is shit talking. Machida on the other hand is displined and is far too hungry. Tito is only interested in a payday before he goes back to banging pornstars.


EDIT: Oh, and I happened to be at teh Affliction press conference this week. Was having lunch at the Century City mall the other day, and they did their thing on the dining terrace. It ws pretty funny... they had the whole press conference and roped off area, while a hundred business people are sitting there trying to have some lunch.

Most of the guys don't look that big (I'm pretty big), besides Tim Silva who is fucking HUGE. He also looks like a retarded putz in shorts, but looks like a tough ass fucking guy when he's wearing jeans and a t-shirt.

[Analu]

[quote name='benderschweiz' post='1365573' date='May 22 2008, 03.16']He just needs to change his nickname to Technoviking and dance to the cage ala Gono. Another career benefitted by youtube...[/quote]
lol. That would be just about the greatest image makeover ever. That youtube clip was epic.


[quote name='Cuellar' post='1368194' date='May 23 2008, 06.15']EDIT: Oh, and I happened to be at teh Affliction press conference this week. Was having lunch at the Century City mall the other day, and they did their thing on the dining terrace. It ws pretty funny... they had the whole press conference and roped off area, while a hundred business people are sitting there trying to have some lunch.

Most of the guys don't look that big (I'm pretty big), besides Tim Silva who is fucking HUGE. He also looks like a retarded putz in shorts, but looks like a tough ass fucking guy when he's wearing jeans and a t-shirt.[/quote]
That's pretty cool. I caught some pics somewhere of that Affliction press conference and it was great seeing Barnett, Fizzo, Fedor, Sylvia and company all in one place. Fedor was working it with that denim jacket/jeans ensemble. Sexy


Just caught the weigh-ins. What a bitch-ass move by Reljic with that light headbutt. Didn't care about him before, but now I hope Gouveia kicks his ass . Tito looked HUGE, way bigger than Machida. And his "Dana is my bitch" shirt was pretty funny. DW was nowhere in sight. BJ looked like he always does before a big fight: like he's on batu. I want to say that BJ's gonna run right over him, but everytime I say shit like that, it bites me in the ass. ie. Crocop vs Napao, Shogun vs Forrest. So this is me shutting up.

Haven't been as pumped before a card in a long, long time. Had a chance to go as a bunch of my buddies bought out a section in the upper rows (section 107, I think) and headed out to Vegas the other day. But I just couldn't make the numbers work on ye ol bank account after paying all the bills, which is a total bummer. Anyone want my daughters? They're well-behaved and don't eat much.

Anyways, I just caught this [url="http://thesportshernia.typepad.com/blog/2008/05/report-tyson-ha.html/"]current picture[/url] taken of Tyson, and he looks about as intimidating as a double cheeseburger, supersize the curly fries. What the hell? Talk about letting yourself go. Anyone still think a Kimbo/Tyson fight is a good idea?

Go BJ!

[Liffguard]

[quote]Tito looked HUGE, way bigger than Machida.[/quote]

Machida's deceptively small. He packs a lot of weight into that frame and has fairly long, lanky limbs. Besides, size difference hasn't stopped him taking apart bigger opponents before.

[quote]Anyone still think a Kimbo/Tyson fight is a good idea?[/quote]

It was never a good idea. It never will be a good idea. It is, in fact, what I would not hesitate to describe as being a very, very [i]bad[/i] idea. Kimbo is barely a legit MMA fighter (though he is working towards more legitimacy) and Tyson is over so many hills he might as well have been hiking through the himalayas. That fight would be nothing more than meaningless spectacle.

[lessthanluke]

Only seen the Sherk/BJ fight so far. That knee was awesome!

[Liffguard]

SPOILER: UFC84

Man, what a disappointing performance from Sherk. I have no clue what his gameplan was supposed to be, but you'd have thought that with his wrestling and his fitness he would have wanted to push the pace and work for the takedown. Also, the commentary for that fight was some of the most inane, pointless chatter ever to come from Goldberg's mouth, and that's saying something.

On the other hand, WAR MACHIDA! Machida is now definitely my favourite fighter in the UFC. That was some beautiful, technical, elusive fighting and it was great to watch Ortiz get more and more frustrated.

And for one final note, WANDY'S BACK BABY!

[GSP]

6 for 6 Barry , pretty damn good! Gotta say, I picked all the same ones when a buddy phoned me to pick my brain and put his money down.

Good for Silva! Fuck me, I was worried for Jardine the way he was twitchin and the length of time he was down. The Athletic Commision will be sure he passes an MRI before he fights again is my guess. I was thinkin exactly what David Spade was thinkin over that one.

[Oorag]

Well, I just got back from Vegas, having attended UFC 84. It was very cool. We saw a whole bunch of fighters in the casinos, including Chuck Liddell, who was sitting in a lounge about six feet from us while we were waiting in line for the Playboy Club. He eventually went into the club ahead of us, but we never saw him again. There were a lot of fighters and a lot of jacked-up fight fans in Affliction shirts. It was a bad weekend to be scrawny in Vegas.

Due to an usher's error, we had FANTASTIC seats for the first four undercard fights, until an extremely well-dressed young Asian couple showed up with $650 tickets for our seats. Our actual $150 seats were about four times farther away, and behind the speakers, so the audio was terrible. Oh well. The place was still only about 25% full by the time we moved. As they sat down, the couple that paid $1,300 for tickets asked if there had been any fights yet. Apparently a lot of people with too much money just don't care about the undercard, so I recommend borrowing their seats for as long as possible if you ever go to a UFC.

Anyway, there were a bunch of great fights. One fight that I see didn't make the telecast was the Jason Tan - Dong Hyun Kim fight. The Korean Kim was booed during the introduction, but the English Jason Tan was given a pass, probably because he's from a foreign country with white people. Kim really won the crowd over, though, dominating Tan from start to finish with some terrific ground-and-pound. He pulled off a spectacular judo-throw as well as a take-down that looked like the UFC's first pile-driver.

The Clementi fight was boring as hell, and the crowd was booing for a good portion of it. He was able to get Etim down, but refused to posture up, and just kept patting Etim in the face with little punches. Etim barely did anything but try to put his hand in between the punches. Every time they got stood up, Clementi would remove his mouthguard to complain. I think Clementi just lost a lot of the fans he gained after his antics with Melvin Guillard.

I had put $100 bets on Machida and Penn. My friend and I were about the only people rooting for Machida in the whole place. I kept cracking jokes about hoping Machida won by boring, three-round decision, and shouting things like, "Inside-leg-kick your way to victory, Lyoto!" during the fight. My friend thought that it was only a matter of time before a Tito fan took exception. Everything went according to plan until Tito's last-second submission attempt. We just stared in silence until Machida slipped out of it. After our glorious victory, I went to the bathroom, and apparently the guy sitting next to me was muttering bitterly about us.

The place went nuts when when Jardine got demolished. Wanderlei has a lot of fans in the US, and apparently he's still got some gas in his tank. I still can't believe how young he actually is. Jardine's kryptonite apparently is aggression. We saw him the next day collecting money from the sportsbook. Of course, this led to jokes about Jardine taking a dive.

During the Penn fight, my friend and I managed joined the rest of the crowd in our support of Penn. A lot of people were shouting "Steroids!" My friend kept insisting that many of them were shouting "Darryl!" as a Simpsons reference. I was not surprised at all that BJ chose to keep standing. I thought that his gameplan would be to try to keep it standing and avoid Sherk's groundgame as much as possible. I was surprised that Sherk barely even attempted any takedowns. That flying knee knockout was beautiful, though. The crowd went berserk, and I left Vegas with $95 of hard-fought winnings.

[Analu]

Nice recap, Oorag. Pretty gutsy putting money on Machida at those odds and leaving Vegas up is always a good thing.

Great card. Would've been one of the best cards ever if the BJ/Sherk fight had lived up to the hype, but aside from one or two takedown attempts, we never got to find out what everyone really wanted to know: how BJ would defend Sherks relentless takedowns and how his otherworldly BJJ skills would play against Sherks muscled up wrestling. Still, it was a good boxing display and that was a devastating knee. Mario Yamasaki is going to get someone killed someday with his late stoppages. I really liked how BJ controlled the entire fight with his deceptively quick jabs.

I was giggling during the Tito fight at how frustrated he was gettting, and started counting how many times Tito swung thru air. It was mostly pro-Machida crowd at the bar, and everyone screamed out a collective "NOOOO!" when he caught him in that triangle. It was crazy. I don't know how he got out of it, as that looked at least as tight as the one that Kang tapped to a couple weeks back.

Aside from BJ's knee, Wanderlei's KO generated the biggest cheers of the night. I'm stoked that Wanderlei won, as a loss would've likely meant a demotion to lesser orgs to get some wins under his belt before getting another shot in the UFC. I hope Jardine's OK. He looked really bad.

I didn't like Reljic's antics at the weigh-ins, but I gotta admit I was impressed. He was snapping those kicks like a young Crocop and the sound they were making upon impact had me oohing and aahing.

Happy that they worked in the Yoshida fight into the PPV. A bunch of guys in the bar were saying he's just another Japanese can the UFC brought in to lose, but I kept telling them no, Yoshida is really good and that they'd see. Glad that he didn't prove me wrong. That was a sick judo throw and anaconda choke.

[Liffguard]

[quote]I was giggling during the Tito fight at how frustrated he was gettting, and started counting how many times Tito swung thru air.[/quote]

Hell, what impressed me was the number of times that Machida made Ortiz actually [i]shoot[/i] on thin air.