AO, M, PG or R

[The Anti-Targ]

Having seen a few comments here and there about sex scenes, and disrobing etc (especially with the younger characters) I wanted to float this subject for people's thoughts.

The books are firmly in the R category, some might even say (for you state-siders) NC-17. But is that the right level to pitch the TV series?

I'm thinking teens are a key demographic in any fantasy series (unlike Rome, which the key demographic I'm guessing was 18-40), including this one. I can personally live with them pulling some of the sex and violence punches to garner a wider audience.

I dont know how the TV rating system works in this series' primary market (USA of course). But here, on our cable and satellite networks the TV companies are required to allocate a rating (up to R18 (~NC-17)), to allow parental control on what shows can be accessed unrestricted by the kids.

If this sort of parental control is in place for US cable broadcasts I imagine it is a factor in need of serious consideration as to whether the show will attract the sort of rating that will go above the restricted level set in many homes across the USA. It could have a dampening effect on viewership I reckon.

So, would you be too upset if the series was pitched at the top end of the unrestricted ratings spectrum? Probably means little or no nudity. No "camels c#nts" or "F@&k your ar%e bloody with a pitchfork" (or however it goes) and other such rich and colourful language.

Do you think it will be pitched at such a low level, or will it go for a restricted rating? Albeit not for the very top restricted rating (I don't think you're gonna hear the word "c#nt" in any context on this show).

[King Nobody]

HBO is a subscription only network, that's why it can get away with so much, i can't think of a single HBO show where they haven't taken advantage of this fact. If a TV show is on HBO that means its almost expected to be full of violence, sex and language. IMO the chances that this show is not going to be on par with the content of other HBO shows is very unlikely, and i am very happy for it.

[Rinso]

Judging from "Rome", HBO can get away with pretty colorful violence, so that won't be a problem.

The sex can be somewhat reduced to be less explicit and pornographic, but it shouldn't be cut out completely. It's important part of many characters' lives.

The cursing should be left as it is. Cut out the constant swearing from Sandor, for example, and his cool factor is gonna be seriously crippled.

Overall, I think that R is about right for ASoIaF. It's not NC-17.

[Brude]

It will be an R-level show mostly, with maybe occasional moments of NC-17 levels of violence - Rome hit that level a couple of times, like the Gladiator scene which was pretty extreme.

[Ran]

Benioff has mentioned in interviews comparing it to the Sopranos. They're not going to be bowdlerizing it.

GRRM's always said HBO is really the only way to go with the material, both because the story is complex and can't be compressed into a film, and because the tone of it is quite dependent on the bloody violence, the language, the sex, etc. which would not survive an adaption to network television.

So, yeah, as far as rating goes, it'll be the equivalent of an R.

[Stark Raving Mad Wolf]

Definitely R.

Sopranos and Entourage are R and garner a wide audience.

Dont forget - apart from subscriptions/ratings - HBO will make money of DVD as well.

[Naknakkus]

There's also the fact that each episode will have a varying level of adult content, are episodes individually approved for broadcast, or is the series meant to be rated as a whole?

[The Anti-Targ]

Over here each episode of a series is rated for the purposes of parental controls.

[Brude]

[quote name='Naknakkus' post='1594966' date='Nov 20 2008, 04.44']There's also the fact that each episode will have a varying level of adult content, are episodes individually approved for broadcast, or is the series meant to be rated as a whole?[/quote]
HBO doesn't really cut anything, though they won't show hard-core porn, I don't think, though they certainly go the NC-17 route in late night with some of their sex-oriented shows. They have their own rating system that describes what sort of content is in a show (language, violence, sex, etc.) that they flash just before it airs and they tell the audience what a movie is rated, but a the American movie rating system doesn't apply because it's not a movie, it's a TV show. The show will be at an R-level at least and at times could easily go the NC-17 route for both sex and violence if the producers want to go there, but none of that will face any resistance from the HBO brass, I should think. Both Rome and Deadwood flirted with NC-17 levels at times. The Wire was easily a hard-R at it's most intense, as was The Sopranos.

[Naknakkus]

Thanks for the clarification. The only HBO show I watched was 6ft Under, and that is hardly an R, and definitely not NC-17.

[phoenix_rising]

THE FOLLOWING PRESENTATION CONTAINS:

STRONG SEXUAL SITUATIONS

STRONG ADULT LANGUAGE

VIOLENT SITUATIONS

RAPE

AWESOME SHOW

[Naknakkus]

SASSY DWARF

LOTS OF INCEST

ANIMAL CRUELTY

[necron9dee9]

I can't see them holding back on the language either.

Hell... every other word on Deadwood was either c***sucker or c**t, hehe.

[King Nobody]

I don't think some of you people know what NC-17 is and how hard it is to get that rating. Asoiaf as a TV series will almost definitely be nowhere close to NC-17. And no, Rome wasn't anywhere close to NC-17, i can't speak for deadwood because I never watched it. NC 17 is usually reserved for more sadistic, torture style violence, like saw, (Which was originally NC-17 but got changed to R without any edits) not for medieval style violence like 300, or for explicit sexual content that happens throughout, pretty much the whole premise of the movie needs to be based around sex.

[cybroleach]

I'm pretty sure only the graphic stuff will be cut so lots of sexual content and violence but unfortunately for the ladies we probably wold get to see Tyrion's vainy bulbous member or Sam's fat pink mast.

[Tyro Lannister]

[quote name='cybroleach' post='1595778' date='Nov 21 2008, 13.21']I'm pretty sure only the graphic stuff will be cut so lots of sexual content and violence but unfortunately for the ladies we probably wold get to see Tyrion's vainy bulbous member or Sam's fat pink mast.[/quote]
The more we talk about what we think might get cut, the more likely some snippets here and there will be cut, and I know I don't want that, I think the violence should be portrayed exactly as it is in the books, if someone gets an axe in the face, I want to see an axe in the face, I think the sex scenes should also be treated that way, except genitalia of course [u]will not[/u] be shown, and the sex scenes were never really too erotic in the book IMO, they were always brief and to the point, described enough to give us an image and then it moves on, sexual yet not something I would say was very arousing. I cannot think of anything off hand in ASoIaF that would be on a different level to what we saw in Rome, IMO Rome is ASoIaF.

[feyrband]

TV shows dont get MPAA ratings they get Parental Guideline ratings by the FCC.

Most likely the show will be TV-MA LSV, Mature with Language, Sex and Violence advisories, maybe not so much the language, but thats an easy one to get.

[Padraig]

[quote name='Tyro Lannister' post='1595900' date='Nov 21 2008, 02.52']I think the violence should be portrayed exactly as it is in the books, if someone gets an axe in the face, I want to see an axe in the face[/quote]
Exactly? That's high expectations.

[Brude]

[quote name='King Nobody' post='1595747' date='Nov 20 2008, 18.51']I don't think some of you people know what NC-17 is and how hard it is to get that rating. Asoiaf as a TV series will almost definitely be nowhere close to NC-17. And no, Rome wasn't anywhere close to NC-17, i can't speak for deadwood because I never watched it. NC 17 is usually reserved for more sadistic, torture style violence, like saw, (Which was originally NC-17 but got changed to R without any edits) not for medieval style violence like 300, or for explicit sexual content that happens throughout, pretty much the whole premise of the movie needs to be based around sex.[/quote]
It's not as hard as you think, especially in the current climate for such things. The MPAA is also often incredibly arbitrary in how they dole out their ratings when it comes to the line between NC-17 and a hard-R. Many movies have been been forced to make mild cuts to avoid an NC-17, or like Bertolucci's THE DREAMERS, were released uncut to art-house theaters, while mainstream theaters took a different R-rated cut of the film.

Rome was mostly not an NC-17 level show, but at a few moments it did touch that level, mainly in terms of violence. Deadwood more for general situations and a couple of instances of fairly extreme violence, but again that was mostly a hard-R. Probably the most shocking thing in that show was actually the language and the sheer number of times the word "cocksucker" is used in the script.

[King Nobody]

[quote name='Brudewollen' post='1596667' date='Nov 21 2008, 14.19']It's not as hard as you think, especially in the current climate for such things. The MPAA is also often incredibly arbitrary in how they dole out their ratings when it comes to the line between NC-17 and a hard-R. Many movies have been been forced to make mild cuts to avoid an NC-17, or like Bertolucci's THE DREAMERS, were released uncut to art-house theaters, while mainstream theaters took a different R-rated cut of the film.

Rome was mostly not an NC-17 level show, but at a few moments it did touch that level, mainly in terms of violence. Deadwood more for general situations and a couple of instances of fairly extreme violence, but again that was mostly a hard-R. Probably the most shocking thing in that show was actually the language and the sheer number of times the word "cocksucker" is used in the script.[/quote]Also, many NC-17 movies of the past have been re rated R without edits. The Dreamers was NC-17 because the whole basis of the movie was based around sex, specifically incest. I'm still not convinced Rome was anywhere close to NC-17, the arena scene, which was by far the most violent, was nowhere near the levels of violence of a show like 300. If you'll look at movies it is extremely hard to get an NC-17 based on violence, even if the whole premise of the movie is based around violence. Most NC-17 movies are rated as such based on extreme amounts of sex, like i mentioned earlier, or situations (such as an independent film dealing with pedophilia that never actually had any sex).