Battlestar Galactica: This Thread has Happened Before and Will Happen Again

[Crazydog7]

I know I missed something but how did Gaeta lose his leg?

[Edward the Great]

What I like about the end of the story:

Important people might actually start dying. Sure, the plot is whacked but it's so much more exciting when things can actually have consequences.

[Ran]

Crazydog,

It was the result of Anders shooting him in said leg when to prevent him from taking the [i]Demetrius[/i] back to the fleet, after most of the crew turned on Starbuck. They kept searching for Earth, and the delay led to the leg growing infected or something such, requiring its amputation.

Gaeta is not a fan of either of them. ;)

[TrackerNeil]

[quote name='Ran' post='1662406' date='Jan 26 2009, 03.32']Crazydog,

It was the result of Anders shooting him in said leg when to prevent him from taking the [i]Demetrius[/i] back to the fleet, after most of the crew turned on Starbuck. They kept searching for Earth, and the delay led to the leg growing infected or something such, requiring its amputation.[/quote]

And you'll notice that, true to form, Adama did nothing about any of this. No trials, no inquiry. Nothing at all.
.
.
.
Cain was more right than people admit.

[Lord O' Bones]

[quote name='Ran' post='1662406' date='Jan 26 2009, 00.32']It was the result of Anders shooting him in said leg when to prevent him from taking the [i]Demetrius[/i] back to the fleet, after most of the crew turned on Starbuck. They kept searching for Earth, and the delay led to the leg growing infected or something such, requiring its amputation.[/quote]
This continues to bug the shit out of me. From gunshot to Doc Cottle something like 14 hours had passed. His leg is so frakked up that it needs to be amputated!? In 14 frakking hours!? Was it some ultra-super-badass infection previously unknown to man? Don't try to sell me Civil War era medicine on a frakking starship godsdamnit!

[Wouter]

One other thing that was disappointing in this latest episode is that we see no reaction whatsoever to what is known about the origins of the Cylons now; there is reaction to "Earth" being a wasteland, yes, but the people who know what the 13th was about (which includes the rebel Cylons, the penultimate four and at least some high-up colonials) don't seem to be perplexed by this discovery. It seems not even worth mentioning.

[Swordfish]

[quote name='Lord O' Bones' post='1663332' date='Jan 26 2009, 15.27']This continues to bug the shit out of me. From gunshot to Doc Cottle something like 14 hours had passed. His leg is so frakked up that it needs to be amputated!? In 14 frakking hours!? Was it some ultra-super-badass infection previously unknown to man? Don't try to sell me Civil War era medicine on a frakking starship godsdamnit![/quote]


I was under the impression that they had to do some form of tourniquet.

So it was lack of bloodflow.

But I could be completely making that up.

My memory for these things is notoriously bad.

Did we ever catually get confirmation that it was infection?

[Werthead]

[quote name='TrackerNeil' post='1663027' date='Jan 26 2009, 20.21']And you'll notice that, true to form, Adama did nothing about any of this. No trials, no inquiry. Nothing at all.
.
.
.
Cain was more right than people admit.[/quote]

But didn't Lee's big speech at the end of Season 3 basically confirm the situation that they're no longer a civilisation, just a big gang flying through space and they can't kill or even lock up for long periods people who have skills useful to the Fleet? Athena got off very lightly after murdering Natalie for spurious reasons.

That said, I believe it was addressed at the time (podcast?) by the writers pointing out that Gaeta was supporting an illegal mutiny and any actions Anders took in putting it down were justified. And given that Starbuck was proven right, I'm guessing Anders got a free pass on the situation, although now it's know he's a Cylon that's put a different complexion on events (as revisited this week).

[Lord O' Bones]

[quote name='Swordfish' post='1663410' date='Jan 26 2009, 16.43']I was under the impression that they had to do some form of tourniquet.

So it was lack of bloodflow.[/quote]
That could be what happened, and I don't remember infection (or anything else) ever being mentioned. If that's the case, they all need remedial first aid training. Where he was shot the main arteries and veins are relatively small, and there are two apiece. You'd probably have to sever [i]both[/i] arteries to cause enough blood loss to the extremity (I don't think the veins would matter as much) and even if all four were cut, you wouldn't need a tourniquet to keep him from bleeding out. You maybe tourniquet the leg only long enough to clean the wound, set a break, and apply a bandage, but only if you had to.

I need to watch that scene again. /nitpick

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Tracker,

[quote name='TrackerNeil' post='1663027' date='Jan 26 2009, 15.21']And you'll notice that, true to form, Adama did nothing about any of this. No trials, no inquiry. Nothing at all.
.
.
.
Cain was more right than people admit.[/quote]

Yes, she just shoots her XO in CIC for refusing an insane order and orders families of non-military personel to be shot when they refuse to leave their families to die. Her way is much more just.

LoB,

Also, I got the impression they were running very low on Antibiotics.

[Lord of Oop North]

[quote name='Ser Scot A Ellison' post='1663773' date='Jan 27 2009, 07.34']Also, I got the impression they were running very low on Antibiotics.[/quote]
Someone should tell that to Roslin. She dumped a fortune's worth of pills in the last episode.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

LotN,

[quote name='Lord of the North' post='1663779' date='Jan 27 2009, 07.45']Someone should tell that to Roslin. She dumped a fortune's worth of pills in the last episode.[/quote]

I think that was cancer meds. Not Antibotics.

[TrackerNeil]

[quote name='Ser Scot A Ellison' post='1663773' date='Jan 27 2009, 07.34']Tracker,

Yes, she just shoots her XO in CIC for refusing an insane order and orders families of non-military personel to be shot when they refuse to leave their families to die. Her way is much more just.[/quote]

Meow, pussycat! I think I struck a nerve. ;)

I'm not saying Cain was right in everything she did, nor that she was a leader everyone should emulate. Although one can kinda-sorta justify her shooting Belzen, there's no excuse for the Scylla. She went off the rails, no question. That being said, she was right on target when she told Adama that he was too close to his crew, and it prevented him from seeing their flaws.

Take the instance Tyrol and Helo killing Thorne. Now, Thorne was no happy fun guy, but he [i]was [/i]acting under Admiral Cain's orders, and Helo and Tyrol attacked him. They didn't appeal to Tigh or Adama, or even try to follow the chain of command; they simply reacted. Cain was unwise to decide to execute them (the fleet needs them), but there was a path between summary execution and [i]completely ignoring their actions[/i], which is what Adama did. It's understandable, because Adama tends to react without thinking, as he did when he overthrew the civilian government in Season 1, but it's not right.

And it doesn't stop there. Helo impregnates a Cylon? Have at it! Tigh precipitates a massacre on [i]Gideon[/i]? No problem! Lee pulls a gun on the XO? Who cares! It's crazy, and when [i]Pegasus [/i]joins the fleet Cain very justifiably says, "What the hell is going on here?" And I found myself answering, "Uhh...I don't know."

Small wonder Lee Adama thinks they're a gang.

[Lord of Oop North]

[quote name='Ser Scot A Ellison' post='1663796' date='Jan 27 2009, 08.02']I think that was cancer meds. Not Antibotics.[/quote]
Yes, that's true ... but they probably aren't easy to come by either, is what I meant.

[mcbigski]

[quote name='Werthead' post='1660883' date='Jan 24 2009, 11.58']According to the podcast, RDM really wanted Nicky's real father to have been Figurski, but the other writers thought that was just wrong :D[/quote]

That would be have been just right I think. And since I think Figurski is a way better background character than Hot Dog, I'd rather have Hot Dog in the infirmary for the rest of the series. If part of the revelation was to make Tyrol feel disassociated from humanity, then having Nicky be Figurski's son would be even better. Tyrol could understand a lot easier why Cally would hook up with a young pilot instead of a middle aged deckhand, which makes it more of a mind blower.

[Kalbear]

Cally's retcon was just horribly poor. Really, really poor. If they didn't want to deal with Tyrol being a cylon and having a kid, they should have just killed the kid.

This is, of course, the flaw in writing as you go along without a plan; occasionally you have to change things in a really sloppy way.

In general I didn't get this ep. I didn't feel like having cylon jump technology was worth the push that they were forcing on it. What does it really matter? They're still going to have to go places to fuel and get food, and it wasn't a problem to do it before; it's just artifice that it would be now. Hell, they can just go back the way they came and be fine, right? Since they got here, they should be able to come back.

And uniting with the cylons seems, well, really shortsighted given the personal view of the humans and their own duplicity. Weren't they the ones that kidnapped the president and held her hostage until their demands were met? I think it's up to the cylons to show their good intentions at this point.

[Ran]

I'd suppose going backwards risks the Cylons (who, after all, trailed them most of the way), and given that RDM has emphasized he wants BSG looking like it's gone through hell, the idea is that the fleet is on its last legs -- it has a limited way to go before systems and ships start breaking down for good. Anything that lets them cover more ground in that time frame seems essential if they're now going on the long shot of finding a habitable planet somewhere out there by randomly checking suitables tars.

Possibly future episodes will actually emphasize this in the show, but I'll buy it. Without advanced facilities for repair and maintenance, they've been bodging and elbow-greasing a lot of stuff for a long time, and it has to catch up with them eventually.

[Colder Hands]

[quote name='Ser Scot A Ellison' post='1663796' date='Jan 27 2009, 08.02']LotN,



I think that was cancer meds. Not Antibotics.[/quote]

when i saw adama taking the pain meds for his hang over the other episode i thought "where do they keep coming up with meds?"

i loved this series here and there, but i am ready for it to wrap up.

[TrackerNeil]

[quote name='Ran' post='1664205' date='Jan 27 2009, 13.15']I'd suppose going backwards risks the Cylons (who, after all, trailed them most of the way), and given that RDM has emphasized he wants BSG looking like it's gone through hell, the idea is that the fleet is on its last legs -- it has a limited way to go before systems and ships start breaking down for good. Anything that lets them cover more ground in that time frame seems essential if they're now going on the long shot of finding a habitable planet somewhere out there by randomly checking suitables tars.[/quote]

And this is where Roslin, were she engaged in her job, would be invaluable. The prospect of a Cylon alliance should not be approached with, "Let's do it!" or "No way!" but, "Well, let's talk about what it would look like." But of course Adama is a bad politician and Zarek is a bit corrupt, so...

[Wouter]

[quote name='Werthead' post='1663467' date='Jan 27 2009, 02.39']That said, I believe it was addressed at the time (podcast?) by the writers pointing out that Gaeta was supporting an illegal mutiny and any actions Anders took in putting it down were justified. And given that Starbuck was proven right, I'm guessing Anders got a free pass on the situation, although now it's know he's a Cylon that's put a different complexion on events (as revisited this week).[/quote]
The writers may have said that in the podcast, but what I saw in the actual series doesn't agree with them. Any mutiny is "illegal", I suppose, but Gaeta, Helo and the others were more than justified in stopping Kara, who was acting irrationally, becoming crazier and crazier and still suspected of being a Cylon. Arguably, it is another point to justify mutine against Adama now, as it was his bad judgement that put her in command (for which she was totally unsuited)- Helo in command would have been a much better arrangement, as he would be fair to both sides. It's also not very clear it was mutiny, in the sense that Helo quoted regulations, presumably those that deal with what to do when your commanding officer goes batshit crazy. Everybody in the crew, but Anders, agreed with him. Starbuck also seemed to be going against Adama's rendez-vous orders, IIRC, so she in herself was staging her own mutiny.

If it is indeed the case that Adama and Tigh on Galactica simply concluded that Gaeta is a filthy mutineer who deserved what he got (thus no punishment necessary, not even a very light one) - which is more or less how the writers are saying they see things (it was "justified" and "Kara was right") - then he has all my sympathies in in his [i]real[/i] mutiny. He can show them the difference, now...