NHL: Stanley Cup Playoffs

[S John]

Edit: OK maybe Dan Boyle could score the goal that Ovechkin just did. Wow!

That was sick.

I've only really paid attention to hockey for the last few years, so I am no expert, and I really haven't yet progressed as a hockey fan to watching games that don't involve the Caps. But... I have watched a couple dozen Caps games this year and in this playoff series I have seen both sides of the Caps that I have become familiar with over the course of this season and last season. Sometimes they look incredible.... and other times they look like they just don't give a shit, or the 'Crapitals' come out as I like to say.

Anyway, as someone that doesn't know a whole lot about hockey, I cannot figure out what the fuck the deal is with that. Is it because they're young, is it a coaching issue? I just don't get it. In other sports that I follow I would blame the team coming out flat on the coach, but I don't know if that's necessarily the case with hockey. It appears that the Caps are going to take this one. How is it that they can look so dominant in the 2 wins and then get slapped around in two of the losses?

[Brandon Stark]

Its a combination of things that can lead to the increase in intensity and focus that you want to see from a team come playoff time. Coaching plays a role, but maybe not as much as experience and veteran leadership amongst the players. Sometimes a perfect storm comes along and a group of younger guys can all hit their stride and make a run, but even then you're likely to find a few vets keeping the ship in tight order even when they're not shining in the spotlight. I'm not super familiar with the Caps roster save their top guys, but I would guess that the most playoff success and experience in any player would be Fedorov, and a leader he ain't. Hockey locker rooms are a lot different than any other sport, mostly due to hockey players being so much different on the average, and its not easy finding the right balance of guys.

As to the other thing, its not so much an issue of having physically over-exerted themselves down the stretch as it is the tremendous amount of mental focus it takes to play hockey at that level for so long. If the Sharks would have cruised like it looked like they were going to when they were up by 10-11 with a few months left in the season instead of having to really bear down to hold the Wings off, you might have seen a little more ratcheting up.

Or its Joe Thornton's fault.

[BLU-RAY]

Another thing with the Caps is that they are a fantastic, high-octane offensive team with a middling-at-best defense and suspect-at-best goaltending, and any team with that makeup is by nature going to be streaky and a bit inconsistent. Pittsburgh had similar problems in the late-90s/early 00s. Some nights your scoring isn't there, and if it's not, Jose Theodore is not gonna fuckin' carry your team.

[Biter]

If the Sharks can't stage a gigantic comeback then this incarnation of the franchise might go down as the most underachieving the NHL has ever seen. Its a lack of mental toughness displayed in eerily similar fashion to the Bruins when a certain center who now plays for the Sharks was in Boston. I'm not solely blaming Joe for what appears to be another collapse, but he sure as shit doesn't help. His career numbers show one of the starkest dropoffs in point production and +/- of any player considered a star. There's something wrong in that locker room, and while Claude Lemieux wasn't the right guy to bring in, he might have been part of the right idea. However they've factored character and playoff experience into the acquisitions they make, they need to make it a priority in the off-season before all their talent gets too old to take advantage of a change in culture.

Hello hyperbole! In a league where Bobby Hull, Stan Mikita, Pierre Pilote and Glenn Hall join together to win a grand total of one Stanley Cup, a team with one previous Hart winner is hardly the most underachieving ever.

Also, what do the '86 Oilers, '88 Flames, '90 Bruins, '91 Blackhawks, '92 Rangers, '93 Penguins, '95 Red Wings, '97 Avalanche, '98 Stars, 2000 Blues, '03 Senators and '07 Sabres have in common?

SPOILER: Have you guessed it?

No team has ever been able to win it all in their first year of winning the Presidents' Trophy. However, these teams have a 75% success rate in winning the Cup in following seasons.

And let's face it, if Gretzky, Messier, Coffey, Kurri, Anderson, Fuhr, Tikkanen, MacInnis, Brett Hull, Bourque, Neely, Chelios, Lemieux, Jagr, Kevin Stevens, Yzerman, Fedorov, Lidström, Sakic, Forsberg, Roy, Belfour couldn't get it done, the likes of Travis Moen, Brad Lukowich, Mike Grier or Jody Shelley won't do it either. And ever thinking otherwise is just ridiculous.

[Brandon Stark]

Okay, I'll admit that I was exaggerating, but you have to admit that the Sharks have been one of the most disappointing franchises in recent times.

On a side note, I think the Oilers made a giant leap in '82, made the finals in '83, then they won both the league standings and the cup in 84 and 85. The President's just wasn't handed out until 1986 (where they lost in 7 in the cup finals), but they still won the cup the first two times they finished first overall. And while all the teams you mentioned may not have won, I think a good number of them at least won their conference and got to the finals.

Especially this year with all their additions, there's just something wrong with that franchise. Its not like they're Columbus and they've never been to the playoffs before - they've won their division 2-3 times of the past 5 seasons. There's just a very noticeable discrepancy between talent and playoff achievement.

I mean the series isn't over yet, but the way they've just looked so damn disinterested is really odd.

[Biter]

Okay, I'll admit that I was exaggerating, but you have to admit that the Sharks have been one of the most disappointing franchises in recent times. Especially this year with all their additions, there's just something wrong with that franchise. Its not like they're Columbus and they've never been to the playoffs before - they've won their division 2-3 times of the past 5 seasons. They've got everything on paper they need to make deep runs into the playoffs and just can't seem to get it done. Maybe its coaching - choosing guys with more strategic value than fire. I really don't know.

Sure, that I'll agree with. If it was easy to pinpoint the problem, it would have been identified and resolved already. McLellan shouldn't be a stranger to playoff coaching, but in the future I'd like him to see him more willing to shake things up when there's not enough intensity. Like Torts.

Well, considering last night, he doesn't have to do it exactly like Torts.

Yeah, only two of the 23 PT winners have been eliminated in the first round. The 2000 Blues (lost to the Sharks) and 2006 Red Wings (lost to the Oilers). So the trend of Pronger being involved in these upsets seems to continue...

[Rexor]

I'm amazed at Ovechkin lauding the Washington fanbase for dumping a beer on Tortorella. What a classless organization, from the fans to the players.

[Lord O' Bones]

I'm amazed at Ovechkin lauding the Washington fanbase for dumping a beer on Tortorella. What a classless organization, from the fans to the players.

I't's not that simple.

"Good job by our fans. Our fans are one more player for us. They do what they have to do for us," Capitals star Alex Ovechken said Saturday morning at the team's practice. "They scream and they're loud. Maybe it was too much to [throw] beer or water or whatever. But sometimes that happens. And maybe that's going to happen tomorrow against us, too. You never know."

ETA: The VS. play by play guy for this Flames/Hawks game sounds exactly like the news announcer from South Park. Distracting as hell.

Edit2: Tortorella has been suspended a game.

[TheHoundRules]

Tort = Idiot.

There are ways to handle dumb fans.

[Lord O' Bones]

Breaking news! Joe Thornton still afraid to shoot! :bang:

Well then.

[Rexor]

I't's not that simple.

"Good job by our fans. Our fans are one more player for us. They do what they have to do for us," Capitals star Alex Ovechken said Saturday morning at the team's practice. "They scream and they're loud. Maybe it was too much to [throw] beer or water or whatever. But sometimes that happens. And maybe that's going to happen tomorrow against us, too. You never know."

ETA: The VS. play by play guy for this Flames/Hawks game sounds exactly like the news announcer from South Park. Distracting as hell.

Edit2: Tortorella has been suspended a game.

How is that NOT Ovechkin lauding the fans? I fail to recognize...

Add that with Ovechkin's "Oh, I didn't know I wasn't allowed to show up at the opponent's morning skate"...just ugh. I hate Ovechkin and his "passion"

[Lord O' Bones]

How is that NOT Ovechkin lauding the fans? I fail to recognize...

Add that with Ovechkin's "Oh, I didn't know I wasn't allowed to show up at the opponent's morning skate"...just ugh. I hate Ovechkin and his "passion"

You said he was lauding them for throwing beer. He's lauding them for being great fans in his opinion and acknowledges that there was possible beer throwing. Not the same.

I know you hate Ovechkin. If you weren't a Crosby fan, I might even care. ;)

Also, thanks for the phantom goalie interference call LaRue. Idiot. Edit: And following it up with a non-call the other way? Priceless.

[Rexor]

You said he was lauding them for throwing beer. He's lauding them for being great fans in his opinion and acknowledges that there was possible beer throwing. Not the same.

I know you hate Ovechkin. If you weren't a Crosby fan, I might even care. ;)

Also, thanks for the phantom goalie interference call LaRue. Idiot. Edit: And following it up with a non-call the other way? Priceless.

Actually, I'm more of a Malkin fan than a Crosby fan...

I would hate Ovechkin if he were a Penguin. He's just a douche.

[BlueRose]

I am in awe of Hiller. He is just amazing. I think the Ducks are going to win this series, probably tonight.

[Lord O' Bones]

I am in awe of Hiller.

Strange. You sure you're a 'nucks fan? :)

[Lord O' Bones]

Right as I'm screaming at the television "where in the fuck is our top line!!!" there they were.

Game 6. Bring it on.

[Biter]

On a side note, I think the Oilers made a giant leap in '82, made the finals in '83, then they won both the league standings and the cup in 84 and 85. The President's just wasn't handed out until 1986 (where they lost in 7 in the cup finals), but they still won the cup the first two times they finished first overall. And while all the teams you mentioned may not have won, I think a good number of them at least won their conference and got to the finals.

You're getting the years a little mixed up. The Oilers were first in league standings and won the Cup in 1984, then they were second to the Flyers in the regular season, who they beat in five games in the final in 1985. In 1986 the Oilers lost to the Flames in the Conference Finals, and the next year they won in seven games, again against the Flyers. The only time the Oilers have lost in seven games in the Cup finals was in 2006.

No, the probability of making the finals were the same as being eliminated in the first round before this year. A first-time PT winner has made it to the Cup finals twice, the Bruins in 1990 and the Red Wings in 1995.

[Rexor]

I'm really not sure how this heartless Rangers team managed to win one game against Washington, let alone 3.

[BLU-RAY]

I'm really not sure how this heartless Rangers team managed to win one game against Washington, let alone 3.

Yeah, this is an absolutely sorry performance. Washington is running roughshod over them.

Goaltending is important in the playoffs, but it's also overrated. People make a huge deal about having a great goalie and riding the hot goaltender in the playoffs, and it's a factor, but one goalie is just not gonna make you a cup champ. I can't remember the last time a team won the Cup based entirely on the strength of its goaltending.

Detroit last year? Certainly not.

Previous year's Ducks? Nope, more to do with great team D, as anchored by Nieds and Pronger.

Hurricanes in '06? Nope. Offensive taem with decent D and decent goaltending.

Lightning in '04? See above. The team with the scorching-hot goaltender and not much else (Calgary) lost this one.

Devils in '03? I'm the first to tout Brodeur, but this was a really good team, and the Devils have always played fantastically in front of him. If the Ducks had won this cup, I'd say Giguere, but you may note that though he won the Conn Smythe, his team lost the Cup.

Red Wings, '02? Nope.

Avalanche, '01? This was a fantastic, talent-laden team. St. Patrick didn't hurt, but he didn't ahve to win it himself.

Devils in 2000? Again, Brodeur was great, adn you can maybe argue this, but IMO this was a team deal; Brodeur gave the Devils an edge, but he didn't have to win it himself.

Dallas Stars, '99? This was Eddie the Eagle, and no. Again, if the Sabres had won this, you could make the argument for Hasek, but... not so much really for Belfour. This was a fantastic, fantastic Stars team.

Red Wings '98 or '97? Again absolutely superb teams that got decent goaltending from decent goaltenders in the playoffs.

Avalanche, '96? Roy was great, but Sakic + Forsberg in their primes? Can't hand it entirely to the netminder.

Devils, '95? Jacques Lemaire. NZT.

Rangers, '94? If anything, this was Messier's win. Richter was great, and I used to love watching him, but he's not the be-all and end-all of goaltending.

Canadiens, '93? Really, this is probably the last one. The team got lucky by dodging Pittsburgh thanks to the Islanders, but you can certainly make the argument that Roy just manned up and took this one. It was a nice Montreal team, but they weren't as stacked as, say, the Nordiques that year, and they didn't really have the offense of the Kings with Gretzky and Jari Kurri.

So a great goalie can win you a series, and is a big part of winning a Cup, but this Rangers team is a shit team, and Lundqvist by himself cannot overcome that. He might pull out game 7, but this team is realistically not going anywhere.

[Lord O' Bones]

Avalanche, '01? This was a fantastic, talent-laden team. St. Patrick didn't hurt, but he didn't ahve to win it himself.

I can still see in my mind's eye Sakic rushing the cup into 77's hands and hear Gary Thorne: "RAYMOND BOURQUE!" I admit I teared up a bit, and I hated the Avalanche. Good times.

As I'm still working from the fiction that as go the Caps, so go the Sharks *knock on wood, tosses salt over shoulder, flips cap inside out* I'm still rooting for them to pull out the series win. But the more I hear about the Tortorella incident, the more potentially annoyed I am. If, as Glan Sather says, they were being spit upon, security should have shut that shit down.

Also, after some time has passed, with consideration and rewatching much of the game, and now being removed from the passion of the moment, I still say that the officiating in last night's game was at best sub par.