The Acts of Caine by Matt Woodring Stover

[ztemhead]

I just finished Blade of Tyshalle and was sorely disappointed. It was long, self indulgent, and unnecessarily long. Did I mention it was too long? The problem with a high-magic world is that it ruins dramatic tension when anyone, at any time, can go from being at their lowest point to complete victory. Now and again Stover throws in some actual physics, as though that will lend credibility to an otherwise absurd magical system. I read the book thinking that he would work out some of the kinks from Heroes Die, but instead I found them magnified. Fail.

[pat5150]

I have a copy of Stover's Caine's Law up for grabs here.

Patrick

[kcf]

raising an old thread, because I finally got around to reading this very excellent book. Excerpts from my review are below:

Stover plays a bit with the narrative structure of Blade of Tyshalle, beginning with narration of someone who attended actor training academy with Hari and we see Caine being born through the eyes of someone who had no idea at the time. Then we flash forward to Hari seven years after events of Heroes Die, a Hari who has everything he ever wanted in life – a wife, a child, a relatively high caste position, etc. Of course Hari is miserable, his family is miserable, his job unsatisfying, his only friend is his greatest enemy and he continually questions who really ‘won’ in the events of Heroes Die. Much could be read into this portion of the book – is it commentary on a mid-life crises, the standard American-dream, what is a hero, what is a victory, knowing who you are and who you want to be, the various problems with an autocratic government, etc. The answer is yes and much could be written, but won’t – I encourage you all to read and make your own conclusions. However, the personal aspect of this, the ultimate journey of Hari, of Caine is expressed in sculpture crafted by none other than Caine’s nemesis from Heroes Die, Ma’elKoth – a classic look at a man in the fashion of David.

All of this is told in a compelling manner that makes it near impossible to put the book down. And that is the real key – execution. Stover writes well, very well. Caine is not really a likeable person, yet you can’t help but like him. It’s been a long time since I’ve read a book that had me so excited about what would happen next. You know that point in a great book or movie when the ‘hero’reaches that absolute low, when that key realization is made, a decision is made, and you just know that the ‘hero’ is about to rise and all hell is going to break loose? One of the best examples of that moment that I can recall is inBlade of Tyshalle and it was simply brilliant to read all that hell breaking loose.

Through all of this, Stover plays with many of the reader’s expectations. Caine is the classic anti-hero – we want him to win, he’s the good guy. But he’s essentially completely selfish, he solves his problems through violence, he doesn’t much care for collateral damage, etc. And yet he is a good guy – he fights the horrible government, he fights to save lives, he fights for his wife and daughter. But he’s cold. Redemption is not what he wants. He leaves regret behind. Vengeance is attained. And it’s complicated – we see Caine’s origins, we see his present, we see Hari realizing who he is and who Caine is, we see choices made, we see the consequences of those choices. This mess of a character, with no clear or easy conclusions to be made is what keeps Caine real and interesting.

The complexities of Caine further let Stover explore what is evil. Is Caine’s nemisis, Ma’elKoth evil? Is Caine’s former boss in the ‘real’, dystopic world evil? Is the Board of Directors for the network evil? Or is evil more simply and more correctly humanity itself? This blend of good and evil, the blend of science fiction and fantasy, the blurring of hero and anti-hero makes for nuanced reading that serves to reinforce Stover’s writing and the compelling nature of Blade of Tyshalle.

Full Review

[Sci-2]

Thanos...does this mean we could get an Annihilation Wave for the sequel?

Wrong thread. Soapies were incredibly scary, the online game deciding how the girl was treated was depressing yet accurate.

Caine fighting despite his injuries, particularly the scene in the bathroom, awesome.

Really, Blade of Tyshalle is among the top fantasies of all time in my book.

[wolverine]

It takes luck. Anything that appears on-line gets gobbled up rather quickly, so you have to be vigilant. You could look into IndieBound and see if the results are any better than Amazon or Abe's. http://www.indiebound.org/book/9780345421432 I found my copy at a local used book store. It was one of those books I looked for every time I went into a bookstore. My advice, spend a Saturday going to every possible used bookstore in your area. Maybe you'll get lucky.

This is so stupid. I thought Heroes Die rocked and really wanted to get Blade of Tyshalle. Why are so many crappy books flooding the market but you can't get the good stuff at a decent price?

[unJon]

Just finished this book (yay for Kindle). I thought it was a-mazing. Action packed, but deep at the same time. At points as dark and philisophical as Bakker without the heavy-handed dead-horse beating. A totally compelling page turner that I couldn't stop thinking about when I was forced to put it down. Stover definitely does not flinch from complex, gray characters and difficult decisions. I. Really felt like nothing came easy (even though in a certain sense, everything comes easy to Caine). I even loved the between chapter mythological retellings, which isn't normally my thing. It's a shame this book and author are not much more popular. This book should be super-highly recommended on this board.

Someone send Pat and Wert a copy to review! :P

[Sci-2]

Yeah, even if one are averse to e-books, people really should support Stover and get this book.

It's, dare I say, essential to the genre. :-)

[Werthead]

I'm still trying to work out how the hell you can have a series where Books 1 and 3 are easily available at very reasonable prices and Book 2 costs more than a new fridge freezer. How the hell does that even work?

Anyway, after a discussion about the series on Twitter last week, I have bought a copy of Heroes Die. If it's brilliant and I want to move on to Tyshalle, I'm not sure what I'm going to do. Possibly sell a kidney to fund buying a copy.

[Sci-2]

I'm hoping they put the books together in an omnibus for you must-have-print types.

I still shudder thinking about the soapies...

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

I've been reading these.. currently on Blade of Tyshalle.

They are really well-written. I didn't like the concept originally, but I had to give them a try after reading so much praise, and so far it's been well worth it.

BTW yesterday Barnes and Noble marketplace had several paperback copies of BoT up for sale, but they were all in the $30 range.

[unJon]

Ok, I just finished the last two books in this series (Acts of Caine). Totally blown away that these aren't more well known. It's the same feeling as when I discovered Kearney. Stover is just so talented. He writes dark, thought-provoking SF novels that are total action page turners. The third book was actually pretty standard and maybe the weakest, but it's more of a set-up novel for the fourth, which was maybe better than BoT. He played a lot with the structure of the novel in a way that worked for me. He even managed to re-interpret some past events in a way that didn't feel like retconning. He claims he has an idea for an even bigger Caine trilogy if the Acts duology sells well enough. So people, please, please buy these books. The world should get three more Caine books.

[Sci-2]

which was maybe better than BoT.

Haven't made it to the fourth book, but this is something to look forward to.

[unJon]

Sci, I think you'll particularly like it. There's a pretty meaty treatment of some gender issues at one point that I think you'll find appealing for future discussion.

[Werthead]

The series is being published, for the first time, in the UK on 27 May. The bad news is that it's ebook only for those who haven't made the transition yet.

[AncalagonTheBlack]

John Scalzi interviews Matthew Stover about the ACTS OF CAINE :

http://www.orbitbook...-acts-of-caine/

John Scalzi: This is a cliché question, but then I’m a fan and I really want to know: What’s next for Matthew Stover?

Matthew Stover: Something different, and then more of the same. I’m trying to pull together the ending of a hard-boiled contemporary crime thriller, as well as driving through to the end of another tie-in. After that, well . . . I have three different SFF projects in various stages of development, each as different from the others as they are from the Acts of Caine.

And if Orbit’s launch of the Acts of Caine results in a world-wide clamor for more stories about a certain charismatic homicidal sociopath with serious anger issues . . . well, I’m ready for that too.

[WrathOfTinyKittens]

If I had the money I'd pay this guy enough that he could write what he wanted without worries - of course as long as it included more Caine :P

[Werthead]

Three quarters of the way through Heroes Die. How come this series isn't much better-known? It's got the attitude of Takeshi Kovacs, the cynicism/humour of Abercrombie, a premise similar to The Hunger Games but far more nuanced and better-explored, the well-meaning rogue/city-building feel of Lies of Locke Lamora and a hefty dose of social commentary which in no way waters down the characterisation, action or pace. And it predated all of those aforementioned works (and, at the moment anyway, is probably better than all of them). This should have been (and hopefully still could be) huge.

[Candre]

Stover seriously should try some kickstarter stuff for another Caine book.There is a growing demand out there.

[Werthead]

Stover seriously should try some kickstarter stuff for another Caine book.There is a growing demand out there.

Not a bad idea, actually, for him or for Bakker as well. If Michael J. Sullivan, a nice guy but a very vanilla author (based on just the first two books of his first series), can raise $30,000, I think Stover and Bakker could do quite well (Stover most of all, however, as he could cross-pollinate with his Star Wars fans).

[john]

Three quarters of the way through Heroes Die. How come this series isn't much better-known? It's got the attitude of Takeshi Kovacs, the cynicism/humour of Abercrombie, a premise similar to The Hunger Games but far more nuanced and better-explored, the well-meaning rogue/city-building feel of Lies of Locke Lamora and a hefty dose of social commentary which in no way waters down the characterisation, action or pace. And it predated all of those aforementioned works (and, at the moment anyway, is probably better than all of them). This should have been (and hopefully still could be) huge.

Yeah, I'm also reading it now, after hearing about it and vaguely wanting to read it for years and years. I don't actually think it's better than any of those you mention (except Hunger Games, obvs) but it is excellent. The guy is clearly too talented to be struggling to do the kind of writing that he wants to.