Iskaral Pust Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Bad result today for Liverpool, who still aren't playing very well. But Chelsea hardly dominated. They took the first goal well enough after Mascherano gifted them possession when there was very little cover behind him. Most teams won't punish that error so clinically. Skrtel should have closed down Drogba better to prevent him crossing. Once the cross came in, I don't think Reina or Carragher could have done much more. Anelka finished well.The second goal was Carragher's fault (getting repetitive). Ridiculous for Drogba to have beaten him around the line like that.I'm sure Benitez will point that both were the result of individual errors, but that doesn't excuse our weak attack.Torres was off form and missed two decent chances (header and left foot), and Benayoun was very unfortunate with his late chance. Our crossing was very poor all game (Kuyt, Johnson, Riera and Insua) -- easy stuff for Terry, Carvalho and Ivanovic.We didn't create much all game. Benayoun should have been in from the start and Gerrard was a passenger yet again. Captain Fantastic has been Captain Anonymous so far this season. Essien didn't even need to man-mark him this time. Babel looked a little more confident when he came on.I thought the refereeing was very one-sided. Torres was constantly being wrestled, held, pulled back and kicked after he passed the ball, but nothing was given. But at the same time the ref gave frees for a lot of Chelsea dives, with Drogba being the worst offender as ever.I had expected that we would struggle today. We've started poorly this season and look unconvincing against any decent teams even if we are thumping some weaker teams. I wouldn't write off our season yet though. We need Gerrard to wake up out of his lethargic slump and we've yet to see what our midfield will look like with Aquilani. Three losses in eight games is a very poor statistic, but we haven't dropped any points in silly draws yet (our downfall last season). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renasko Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 I think this is an exaggeration. I don't think either Tottenham or Villa have teams that are as good or better than Liverpool's. I'll be surprised if one finishes above Liverpool, and astonished if both do.Not that exaggerated, Mormont. I feel that Tottenham having the likes of Modric, Lennon and Defoe makes them very formiddable, and likewise Villa having Young, Agbonglahor, Petrov and co. makes them pretty decent. They've better options in the forward departments than Liverpool, in any case, and have talented defenders in their squads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faber Posted October 4, 2009 Share Posted October 4, 2009 Shit. Totti injured again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horza Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Forza Megson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted October 5, 2009 Author Share Posted October 5, 2009 Liverpool were shocking against Chelsea yesterday. Carragher and Skrtel in central defense is an enormous liability * 2. Skrtel is no Vidic and I don't understand why Liverpool doesn't have more capable defenders. Carragher is just horrible, he seems far more a liability than he was in previous years. Alonso is still greatly missed in midfield, Mascherano and Lucas are useful workhorses but very limited. Man U is coping better with the loss of Ronaldo than Liverpool is without Alonso, which is somerwhat unexpected to me but it shows how frail Liverpool's squad is. Gerrard does what he can, Kuyt was once again invisible. Riera continues to be a fairly average winger, as he's always been. For a similar player I actually prefer Reyes who played for Arsenal a few years ago, or Valencia's David Silva. But mainly the central defense is so unreliable under pressure. As for Benitez, I find him an irritating little man. Anyway, Chelsea deserved 3 points. Drogba and Anelka are a lethal couple in every match and a Lampard/Essien/Ballack midfield is nothing to be sniffed at. City to beat Villa tonight I expect and move to 3rd.MormontI think this is an exaggeration. I don't think either Tottenham or Villa have teams that are as good or better than Liverpool's.Despite my criticism of Liverpool above I agree with this. For all it's weaknesses I don't think Villa or Spurs have a better side. Man City is the real threat and most likely to move into the top 4. Villa and Spurs I expect to finish behind Liverpool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marcelo Rebelo Firqoralas Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Liverpool were shocking against Chelsea yesterday.I didn't think Liverpool were shocking. Most of the match was pretty even and both teams played a diciplined and powerful defensive game. Liverpool created some chances and Chelsea created a bit more, but they didn't dominate the game completely. All in all, Liverpool met a really good team away and lost, and that was in no way surprising. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Leverkusen are top of the Bundesliga on goal difference ahead of Hamburg (who were gifted victory by Hertha's third choice keeper), Schalke might be falling apart financially but Magath manages to keep his extremely young team near the top of the league and Werder is picking up momentum, with Pizarro, Marin, Özil, Hunt (finally realising his potential?) and even Naldo (7 goals in all competitions so far this season, not half bad for a defender) providing plenty of entertainment.With Bayern 8 points behind the league leaders, their defense vulnerable and their ridiculously expensive attack missfiring I wonder how much time van Gaal has left at the club. Of course his advantage over Klinsmann or Magath is that the press seems to hold him in greater esteem. Or maybe they're just scared of him.In any case, van Gaal has had more money to spend than either Magath or Klinsmann (plus he's not being forced to use Rensing) yet isn't exactly domintating the Bundesliga. So, lots of fun for everybody. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Tottenham's best players aren't as good as Liverpool's - they've got no-one on the level of Gerrard, Torres or Mascherano - but after that Liverpool have a steep decline. Beyond those I think out of the outfield players, only Benayoun would be looking at a regular first-team spot and even then only maybe, with Skrtel, Kuyt and Insua having places in the squad. And Spurs certainly have more depth beyond the first team, which is the thing I can see crippling Liverpool. Defensively in particular, if Mascherano's missing they're fucked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuroishi Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 How are Wolfsburg doing so far this season ? Judging by their league position, they seem to have somehow mixed results, were they just a one-season-team ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 How are Wolfsburg doing so far this season ? Judging by their league position, they seem to have somehow mixed results, were they just a one-season-team ?They aren't in the same form as they were in second half of last season, which isn't terribly surprising, particularly since Veh is trying to get them to play a slightly different style (last year they relied very much on a counterattacking game, this season they are more about possession). They managed to hold their team together, but with the additional burden of CL football, several other teams (Werder, Schalke) improving and some others overperforming at the moment (yes, I'm looking at you, Mainz) they look a bit worse than they actually are.The teams that are having really disappointing seasons so far are Hertha, Dortmund and Stuttgart, though at least the latter are unlikely to be relegated.Wolfsburg should manage to challenge for the European places, but the Bundesliga is a very balanced league (apart from Bayern. Well, usually anyway) and there are about 8-10 clubs who could finish in the top five without anybody being particularly surprised about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuroishi Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 They aren't in the same form as they were in second half of last season, which isn't terribly surprising, particularly since Veh is trying to get them to play a slightly different style (last year they relied very much on a counterattacking game, this season they are more about possession). They managed to hold their team together, but with the additional burden of CL football, several other teams (Werder, Schalke) improving and some others overperforming at the moment (yes, I'm looking at you, Mainz) they look a bit worse than they actually are.OK, thanks ! I'm interested in part because they signed in two good ligue 1 players this summer (Karim Ziani and Thomas Khalenberg).The teams that are having really disappointing seasons so far are Hertha, Dortmund and Stuttgart, though at least the latter are unlikely to be relegated.Wolfsburg should manage to challenge for the European places, but the Bundesliga is a very balanced league (apart from Bayern. Well, usually anyway) and there are about 8-10 clubs who could finish in the top five without anybody being particularly surprised about it.Yeah, that's a bit like Ligue 1... That makes for interesting local competitions, but doesn't really help on the European stage, does it ? (of course in comparison with Italy, Spain and England where the same small pool of teams win the local leagues over and over again) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Yeah, that's a bit like Ligue 1... That makes for interesting local competitions, but doesn't really help on the European stage, does it ? (of course in comparison with Italy, Spain and England where the same small pool of teams win the local leagues over and over again)Spain has actually had quite a few different teams winning the title or at least coming close in recent years. Deportivo La Coruna, RCD Mallorca, Atletico Madrid, Valencia, Sevilla FC, Real Betis, Celta de Vigo and Real Sociedad have all played in the Champions League in the last decade. Of course, only Real Madrid and Barca seem to be blessed with long term success, three of the above teams are even in the second division at the moment, but there is strength in depth in the Spanish league.The Bundesliga at least is slowly catching up and could overtake Serie A in a year or two in the UEFA ranking, and if the plans to limit clubs' spending are ever put into effect traditionally well run German clubs (notable exceptions like Schalke and formerly Dortmund aside) could benefit even more.And if they don't we'll just fall back to pointing out that we get to see more goals per game than the fans in any of the other big leagues. ;) Not sure what Ligue 1 could pride itself on though, maybe the quality of its defenders? :P ETA: A couple more clubs since I actually went and checked league results. Anything to pass the time, I guess... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kuroishi Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 Spain has actually had quite a few different teams winning the title or at least coming close in recent years. Deportivo La Coruna, RCD Mallorca, Atletico Madrid, Valencia, Sevilla FC, Real Betis, Celta de Vigo and Real Sociedad have all played in the Champions League in the last decade. Of course, only Real Madrid and Barca seem to be blessed with long term success, three of the above teams are even in the second division at the moment, but there is strength in depth in the Spanish league.That's true, I don't know why but in my mind Valencia still qualifies as a big team, even if they have been less than impressive for some years now...And I appreciate teams like Sevilla and Atletico, not on par with Real or Barça, but always able to be serious challengers even on european competitions (but that's not always been the case...).The Bundesliga at least is slowly catching up and could overtake Serie A in a year or two in the UEFA ranking, and if the plans to limit clubs' spending are ever put into effect traditionally well run German clubs (notable exceptions like Schalke and formerly Dortmund aside) could benefit even more.And if they don't we'll just fall back to pointing out that we get to see more goals per game than the fans in any of the other big leagues. ;) Not sure what Ligue 1 could pride itself on though, maybe the quality of its defenders? :P ETA: A couple more clubs since I actually went and checked league results. Anything to pass the time, I guess...You almost got it right, Ligue 1 takes pride in the tactical quality of its teams, the impressive cohesion of its defensive sides, and the outstanding skills of its goalkeepers :rolleyes: Seriously though, I think there truly are big differences between the philosophies of Ligue 1 and Bundesliga. I'm always astounded to see the difference in effiency for players like Grafite or Ibisevic in both leagues...That's not fair :| . You are supposed to be the ones with boring teams, whose only stars are defenders and big, mean goalkeepers, while we should be the ones with panache, with flamboyant, classy attacking midfielders, scoring lots of goals and unfairly losing games while still keeping our pride and arrogance.Something's gone wrong along the way... :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wizard Posted October 5, 2009 Share Posted October 5, 2009 It was a very entertaining game. Both defenses were shit, but Arsenal's attacking was obviously much better and a joy to watch. The game could just as well have ended 10-4. :)I see what you mean. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted October 6, 2009 Author Share Posted October 6, 2009 JonBayern's league results have indeed been very disappointing. Van Gaal probably has so much credit because he is a genuinely excellent coach and seen as one of the best in the world.I hope Bayern will start doing really well soon, seems to me they should be able to take the title. As you say, a lot of spending and a new manager, it should start gelling at some point ( even if you hope it won't).Robben injured again, Ribery was injured as well, so it's not as much misfiring as being injured. I haven't seen Gomez in the first 11 anymore, nor Luca Toni. I wonder what is going on with them. Olic is a nice player but not as the main striker. Of course they also have Klose. So many choices, perhaps too many? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Van Gaal probably has so much credit because he is a genuinely excellent coach and seen as one of the best in the world.I think at this point in his career the respect is no longer all that warranted and is rooted mostly in his success in the nienties. He did well for AZ lately (though overall the Eredivisie seems to have gone downhill over the last ten years as well), but before that he had a disappointing second spell at Barca and managed to fail to qualify for the 2002 World Cup as national team coach. Bayern is his chance to prove that he is still a great coach IMO, the jury is still out.Robben injured again, Ribery was injured as well, so it's not as much misfiring as being injured. I haven't seen Gomez in the first 11 anymore, nor Luca Toni. I wonder what is going on with them. Olic is a nice player but not as the main striker. Of course they also have Klose. So many choices, perhaps too many?Signing Robben and then complaining when he gets injured would be ridiculous given his fitness record. It's more that van Gaal has decided to play with just one striker after Ribéry proved intractable but doesn't seem to rate Toni at all and can't decide which of the other three he likes best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Renasko Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Believe Gomez isn't playing because of the bust up he had with Butt. Gave him a right thumping...seen his face?Not sure why Bayern aren't doing well in the league. I've only seen them once this season against Juve in the CL, and they played them off the park that night. Robben and Ribery really look like they could cause any defense serious trouble, and in the future it'll be interesting to see how Bayern's attack does against, say Chelsea. Also having a reliable player like Klose up front isn't a bad thing, either. :D He's probably the best header of the ball in the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Believe Gomez isn't playing because of the bust up he had with Butt. Gave him a right thumping...seen his face? :lol: That wasn't a "bust up", they just collided during a training session.Also having a reliable player like Klose up front isn't a bad thing, either. :D He's probably the best header of the ball in the game.I think Klose is great, but van Gaal appears unconvinced so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wizard Posted October 6, 2009 Share Posted October 6, 2009 Kris Boyd fractured his eye-socket when he sneezed. :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJDonegal Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 Here's a good story to end this thread on - Avram Grant is back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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