The War of the Three Queens

[Osuniev]

Hey, so I was re-reading aFfC, in English this time...

And I find myself wondering what are these "three queens" Littlefinger told Sansa about.

I suppose you need to pick 3 into: Cersei (this one seems the more obvious), Margaery, Daenerys (but does LF knows about her ? It seems to me like this could very well be the unforeseen element that ruins all his plan), Myrcella (which might be crowned in Dorne -HAS to, to fulfill Maggy the crown prophecy), and maybe Sansa herself (if he plans to crown her 'Queen in the North').

So which ones do you think it will be ? Do you have any other candidates in mind?

EDIT: ooops, really sorry, just figured out how to use the Search function... My bad. If someone can lock or delete this topic... Thank you.

[Yakman]

Hey, so I was re-reading aFfC, in English this time...

And I find myself wondering what are these "three queens" Littlefinger told Sansa about.

I suppose you need to pick 3 into: Cersei (this one seems the more obvious), Margaery, Daenerys (but does LF knows about her ? It seems to me like this could very well be the unforeseen element that ruins all his plan), Myrcella (which might be crowned in Dorne -HAS to, to fulfill Maggy the crown prophecy), and maybe Sansa herself (if he plans to crown her 'Queen in the North').

So which ones do you think it will be ? Do you have any other candidates in mind?

EDIT: ooops, really sorry, just figured out how to use the Search function... My bad. If someone can lock or delete this topic... Thank you.

I would GUESS that it's:

1. Cersei as Queen Regent

2. Margaery as Queen

3. is either:

Asha as pretender Queen of the Iron Isles and the North

OR

Myrcella as Queen of Westeros under Dornish law

Doran is too smart to let news of the coup attempt get out. He sent Hotah and only trusted men to rescue Myrcella and I doubt that he's allowed news of Arianne's insolence to escape from his private circle. BUT Myrcella is clearly a front runner in the number 3 category.

Asha was never crowned Queen of the Iron Isles, but she is the heir of Balon's body.

Alternatively, given the timeline issues, it's possible that the 3rd Queen is not Asha nor Myrcella but rather Jeyne Westerling, but I rather doubt this

I doubt that he is referring to Dany. She's a rumor and REALLY FAR AWAY, and in the passage he is (imho) clearly referring to Westeros.

[Anya, Vengeance Demon]

I doubt that he is referring to Dany. She's a rumor and REALLY FAR AWAY, and in the passage he is (imho) clearly referring to Westeros.

He is referring to Westeros. Y'know, the land which Dany has often, and loudly, claimed as her own, and which (with her dragons) she has the means to conquer. Dany is a much more plausible queen by the end of AFFC than Myrcella (alone, in near-captivity in the Water Gardens) or Asha (who fled the kingsmoot with nothing more than her own ship, having been rejected by the majority of ironborn captains).

[Alexia]

He is referring to Westeros. Y'know, the land which Dany has often, and loudly, claimed as her own, and which (with her dragons) she has the means to conquer. Dany is a much more plausible queen by the end of AFFC than Myrcella (alone, in near-captivity in the Water Gardens) or Asha (who fled the kingsmoot with nothing more than her own ship, having been rejected by the majority of ironborn captains).

I agree. LF is referring to Cersei, Margaery, and Danaerys. He is smart enough to sort out the differences between rumor and fact.

[Queenslayer(in the bed)]

But in the end somehow Queen Sansa will win...

[Yakman]

I agree. LF is referring to Cersei, Margaery, and Danaerys. He is smart enough to sort out the differences between rumor and fact.

i dunno.

He says "Reign of the 3 Queens"

Dany rules not a single person or square foot of Westeros. Nor has anyone pledged to her. I don't think he's referring to her. Asha is far more likely. She at least may have the loyalty of the Ironborn who remain in the North. That may well make her a Queen in Baelish's eyes--or at least for this statement.

[Alexia]

Dany rules not a single person or square foot of Westeros. Nor has anyone pledged to her. I don't think he's referring to her. Asha is far more likely. She at least may have the loyalty of the Ironborn who remain in the North. That may well make her a Queen in Baelish's eyes--or at least for this statement.

Barristan Selmy? Jorah Mormont?

Asha lost her bid for queen at the kingsmoot and is bound by Ironborn law against trying again against the winner of the kingsmoot. She is nothing more than a refugee from Euron now, no kind of queen at all.

Considering that I'm sure LF knows about the dragons, I think he's preparing the Vale, the North, and Sansa Stark to swear to Danaerys and come out of the War of Five Kings on top. With him as the power behind, of course.

[Anya, Vengeance Demon]

He says "Reign of the 3 Queens"

No, he doesn't. "What little peace and order the five kings left us will not long survive the three queens, I fear." He's talking about a war, and in the future tense; not a present-tense reign of three queens.

[dolorouseddwasright]

Are you sure he wasn't referring to Renly?

Sorry, I've been drinking and I'm trying to be humorous. I really have no recollection of the 3 queens thing. Maybe I should go back and reread the series. I've only read it through twice, what a piker.

Punish me, I deserve it.

[Daemon23]

I think this is a big hint that Littlefinger does in fact know a great deal more about Daenerys than he has let on. Perhaps he has contrived to continue to receive reports from Jorah, or from other parties.

[nightwisp1956]

But in the end somehow Queen Sansa will win...

Along with King Tyrion.

Seriously, this is possible. I would not discount totally the possibility!

[Daena the Defiant]

I doubt that he is referring to Dany. She's a rumor and REALLY FAR AWAY, and in the passage he is (imho) clearly referring to Westeros.

Here's a quote from an old post of mine:

Littlefinger makes the remark to Sansa after he has just returned from Gulltown (working his wonders on Lady Waynwood, I think) and remarks that he hoped to have more time after the end of the War of the Five Kings, or as I like to call it, Wot5K, but Cersei's made such a hash of things already, he doubts Westeros can withstand the Wot3Q (figure it out ;) ) which hasn't happened yet.

Now we know that Littlefinger has sources of information everywhere. He has the Kettleblacks and gods know haw many more agents in Kings Landing, so he knows all about Cersei's plans to have Margaery executed as traitorous adulteress and how that would set two of the three Queens (and their mighty factions) at each others throats.

As has been said numerous times, the ports are the first places where news of foreign events arrive (obviously), so having been in Gulltown, Petyr is probably very well informed on recent current events in Slaver's Bay.

Prior to that, obviously, there were rumours and reports of Danaerys' conquests, her dragons, etc. everywhere Euron knows, the Citadel knows, Arya hears about them in Braavos. Intelligence was brought to Cersei by Varys to the same effect, but she ignored it and disregarded it as ludicrous.

It doesn't take a military genius to discern exactly what Danaerys Targaryen is up to, after all - she has hatched dragons, she conquered cities and ports, she is training knights, she is seeking ships, she aquired her Unsullied Jannissary army, she wears a crown, she has convened a Queensguard -s he clearly thinks she is is a Queen of Something... it is obvious that she planning an invasion and reconquest.

So, Littlefinger frets that the Wot3Q will be Queen Regent Cersei warring against Queen Consort Margaery, just as "Rightful Queen" Danaerys Targaryen comes a'knocking to brush aside the Usurper's widow and daughter-in-law and reclaim the throne of her fathers.

[Happy Ent]

Let me, as I have done for many years, point out that Queen Selyse Baratheon of House Florent is queen of Westeros, just like Stannis is king. If we are looking for random women with some kind of claim to the title then Selyse certainly fits the bill at least as well as do Dany, Marge, Cersei, or Myrcella.

At the time of the Sansa/Alayne chapter, we (the readers) have no idea of what is going on at the Wall. For all we know, Selyse may have morphed into Cthulhu (tentacles and Florent ears) and started eating the North, and Littlefinger might just have gotten news of that.

[Patrick Mallister]

I think the candidates for the 3 queens are as follows:

Cersie

Margary

Dany

Sansa - queen of the north and the vale after marrying Harry the Heir

Myrcella

While Selyse has the claim of queen, Stannis is very much in the picture. I took LF's quote to mean that the women are "running the show" at face value. In regards to Asha, I think she's not much more than a refugee at this point as is noted above.

[Happy Ent]

While Selyse has the claim of queen, Stannis is very much in the picture.

How do you know this? Selyse may have eaten Stannis. At this time, we have no idea what’s going on at the Wall. (Not that I think Selyse is in fact Cthulhu.)

[Lord Varys]

That Littlefinger recently has returned from Gulltown, where he encountered his ship, The Merling King, which had returned from Braavos. And that indicates what ever news he was referring to earlier in his conversation with Sansa ('interesting times we live in', 'one can never have too much swords') is news from Essos, and thus indeed Daenerys, not Myrcella, or Selyse.

News about Myrcella would likely not travel to the Vale via Braavos, and Selyse is, well, no real threat nor anybody remotely important on the large scale of things, while Cersei's and Margaery's trouble indeed could plunge the Realm into yet another civil war (Lannisters against Tyrells), and Daenerys's return certainly would do, too.

As Myrcella was never properly crowned, and Doran and Arianne have intention whatsoever to ally with Daenerys and make Myrcella Queen, I doubt that she will ever become one.

[Mad Monkey]

How do you know this? Selyse may have eaten Stannis. At this time, we have no idea what’s going on at the Wall. (Not that I think Selyse is in fact Cthulhu.)

She may have eaten Stannis, and the entire series might be a dream sequence had by Bran after he took a brief tumble out of a window a few feet off the ground at Winterfell. I don't think that the author will introduce Cthulhu or something that similar to it this late in the story.

As Myrcella was never properly crowned, and Doran and Arianne have intention whatsoever to ally with Daenerys and make Myrcella Queen, I doubt that she will ever become one.

I think Daenerys is more plausible than Myrcella for this reason too, even though it partially conflicts with one likely interpretation of Cersei's prophecy. Doran and Arianne no longer need Myrcella, since through Trystane they might link up with Daenerys and be able to revenge themselves on... whoever they want right now, actually, since everyone who was personally involved in Elia's death is now dead (Tywin, Ser Gregor, Ser Amory... wasn't that it?)

[Alexia]

I think Daenerys is more plausible than Myrcella for this reason too, even though it partially conflicts with one likely interpretation of Cersei's prophecy. Doran and Arianne no longer need Myrcella, since through Trystane they might link up with Daenerys and be able to revenge themselves on... whoever they want right now, actually, since everyone who was personally involved in Elia's death is now dead (Tywin, Ser Gregor, Ser Amory... wasn't that it?)

They may also cast some blame on Ser Jaime and Elia's replacement, Queen Cersei.

[Mad Monkey]

They may also cast some blame on Ser Jaime and Elia's replacement, Queen Cersei.

They may, especially to curry favor with Queen Daenerys, but I'm not sure they really have any reason to blame Jaime or Cersei for anything. I'm not good with the timelines, but I think that Cersei wasn't even married to Robert when all of this happened, right?

[Alexia]

They may, especially to curry favor with Queen Daenerys, but I'm not sure they really have any reason to blame Jaime or Cersei for anything. I'm not good with the timelines, but I think that Cersei wasn't even married to Robert when all of this happened, right?

That doesn't necessarily mean she didn't plot it with her father (she was Tywin's heir, after all) - and Jaime killed Aerys, the king he was sworn to protect, as his father's storm troopers were scaling the walls of Maegor's. If I were Doran, I would think they were all in on it together.