Jump to content

U.S. Politics, 4


TerraPrime

Recommended Posts

Let us move the discussion back on to politics. The wrangling of the alleged intolerance of the U.S. lefties, unless tied to a political topic, should move to its own thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Awww can't we go back to "Christians are mean" = "Burning people alive"? It was such a fruitful discussion!

I was trying to end it, honest! :D

So...with all the Tea Partiers winning GOP primaries, does anyone think they have a real chance at beating the Dems in November?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone seen the Esquire story on Newt Gingrich? His second wife dished to a publication for the first time. This is the wife that he started an affair with while his first wife was sick with cancer, and served divorce papers on during her recovery. It confirms what a lot of Newt's detractors have said about him -- that he's a hypocritical sociopath desperate for power and respect.

She called a minister they both trusted. He came over to the house the next day and worked with them the whole weekend, but Gingrich just kept saying she was a Jaguar and all he wanted was a Chevrolet. " 'I can't handle a Jaguar right now.' He said that many times. 'All I want is a Chevrolet.' "

He asked her to just tolerate the affair, an offer she refused.

He'd just returned from Erie, Pennsylvania, where he'd given a speech full of high sentiments about compassion and family values.

The next night, they sat talking out on their back patio in Georgia. She said, "How do you give that speech and do what you're doing?"

"It doesn't matter what I do," he answered. "People need to hear what I have to say. There's no one else who can say what I can say. It doesn't matter what I live."

http://www.esquire.com/features/newt-gingrich-0910

Link to comment
Share on other sites

eta: post in response to Nymeria's question. Also, it's good to have more confirmation that Newt is a scumbag.

I think there's a shot some of them will. Unless the Democratic base gets energized enough to come out and vote, the GOteaParty will score some victories. Their base is going to continue being riled up with the latest scare tactics (or the same old ones as they still work well) and are going to be at the polls regardless.

With all the Democratic legislative victories, I just don't understand how Dems are upset with the way things are. Sure, the legislation that passes is usually watered down and sometimes weakened to the almost pointlessness. That's not fun. But it's like people don't realize these debates never would have even come up were Republicans in charge, let alone made it to and passed a vote.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was trying to end it, honest! :D

So...with all the Tea Partiers winning GOP primaries, does anyone think they have a real chance at beating the Dems in November?

I guess that depends if people stay angry with incumbents. It's pretty hard to predict what will happen, really. I have a hunch that it's not going to be the whitewash that people think, because it was only two years ago that Obama was elected, and the public probably aren't going to forget who preceded him, even if they are not really all that happy with some of what is going on in Congress. Sure, the Republican base has been whipped up by the Tea Party types, but are these candidates likely to attract broad support from swing voters? Doubtful.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

eta: post in response to Nymeria's question. Also, it's good to have more confirmation that Newt is a scumbag.

I think there's a shot some of them will. Unless the Democratic base gets energized enough to come out and vote, the GOteaParty will score some victories. Their base is going to continue being riled up with the latest scare tactics (or the same old ones as they still work well) and are going to be at the polls regardless.

The economy is still bad, it's a mid-term and the GOP has got it's base all fired up with bullshit and phantom fears, so yeah, it's not gonna be a fun election for the democrats. They should, hopefully, maintain control of both houses though.

With all the Democratic legislative victories, I just don't understand how Dems are upset with the way things are. Sure, the legislation that passes is usually watered down and sometimes weakened to the almost pointlessness. That's not fun. But it's like people don't realize these debates never would have even come up were Republicans in charge, let alone made it to and passed a vote.

It's alot of things. Alot of people bought into the "Obama is the Liberal Messiah" bullshit. Alot of people expected Obama to somehow change everything instantly and thus hold anything he hasn't gotten to in less then 2 years against him. Alot of people are letting the perfect be the enemy of the good and beleive that he could have passed way more lefty shit but he just didn't want to, ignoring the political realities of the time. And so on.

Essentially, the media (and not just the traditional media either, the blogs and other crap have bought this shit too) have created the narrative that he's a socio-commie who's just not liberal enough for the Left wing and has accomplished nothing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It all comes down to the economy. If the recovery was more robust the Dems would be in solid shape. As long as the economy is still limping along when the elections come the party in power is at risk of taking significant losses. This has nothing to do with which party is advocating policies which would be best economically or how successful the party in power was. Its simply that during hard times a lot of people tend to blame those currently in power and want change rather doing so makes sense or not. Individual races maybe won or lost on other issues but overall the economy is going to decisive.

Perhaps if the Dems were better at touting their successes and selling their economic policies to the public this might not be the cases. As it is though the Republicans still have a stronger propaganda system. They simply get their message across better.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Anyone seen the Esquire story on Newt Gingrich? His second wife dished to a publication for the first time. This is the wife that he started an affair with while his first wife was sick with cancer, and served divorce papers on during her recovery. It confirms what a lot of Newt's detractors have said about him -- that he's a hypocritical sociopath desperate for power and respect.

http://www.esquire.com/features/newt-gingrich-0910

Yeah... that's pretty much exactly what I predicted would happen. Classic example of a politician who believes he's untouchable and his skeletons won't come back to haunt him. He's a hypocrite, plain and simple.

Neither side is immune to it, >cough< John Edwards >cough<, but it typically stings the GOP worse since they have hijacked the banner of "family values."

(ironic, given that the current president seems to have a much healthier family life than most of his opponents)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It all comes down to the economy. If the recovery was more robust the Dems would be in solid shape. As long as the economy is still limping along when the elections come the party in power is at risk of taking significant losses. This has nothing to do with which party is advocating policies which would be best economically or how successful the party in power was. Its simply that during hard times a lot of people tend to blame those currently in power and want change rather doing so makes sense or not. Individual races maybe won or lost on other issues but overall the economy is going to decisive.

Perhaps if the Dems were better at touting their successes and selling their economic policies to the public this might not be the cases. As it is though the Republicans still have a stronger propaganda system. They simply get their message across better.

Not so sure about that. While the Dems approval rating has taken a hit, the only thing people in general seem to hate more than Dems in congress are Republicans.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Perhaps if the Dems were better at touting their successes and selling their economic policies to the public this might not be the cases. As it is though the Republicans still have a stronger propaganda system. They simply get their message across better.

That's key right there. Even when the Dems have been able to turn an issue against the Republicans, the Republicans have the ability to simply ignore said issue and go back to their agenda. It doesn't matter how stupid, contradictory or outright insane, the GOP has decided to embrace their agenda wholeheartedly and it's working. While Democrats are busy fighting with the GOP and other Democrats to get things accomplished, the GOP is firmly united in trying to destroy their opposition.

You can fight this type of blind fervor, it is possible, but in order to do so the Dems would have to put more energy into the fight than they simply have right now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

See the thing is, the economy has turned around, and is even growing - except for jobs. No surprise there. Jobs in the US have been on a steady decline for over a decade. Which is why I do not understand why the Dems are not putting the hammer to businesses. They really have nothing to loose here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, rescind all the tax loopholes for corporations that outsource more than 10% of their jobs outside of the country. I was skimming the various political sites I check out daily and found this on the Huffington Post8 Surprising Facts About The Shrinking Middle Class From 'Third World America':

According to the White House, in 2004, the last year data on this was compiled, U.S. multinational corporations paid roughly $16 billion in taxes on $700 billion in foreign active earnings— putting their tax rate at around 2.3 percent.

That whole article is worth checking out.

We need jobs, badly. How about the massive workforce needed to fix our infrastructure. In the same article:

In studying car crashes across the country, the Transportation Construction coalition determined that badly maintained or managed roads are responsible for $217 billion in car crashes annually – far more than headline-grabbing alcohol-related accidents ($130 billion) and speed-related pile-ups ($97 billion)", Arianna writes in Third World America.

But Americans are paying an even higher price for our deteriorating roads. Of the 42,000 road fatalities each year, 53% are at least partially the result of poor road conditions. "We are currently spending $70 billion annually on improving our highways, but that’s nowhere near the $186 billion a year that is needed. It's a collision of need versus resources; for far too many of us, it can be fatal," she adds.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Newt Gingrich is a flaming asshole, and I hope he dies in a car fire.

Will the predicted car fire be a result of the alleged flamingness of the said asshole?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

BR,

Put "the hammer to businesses" to do... what?

Not sure really. But getting them to spens some of their cash reserves. Stop outsourcing, stop paying CEOs such ridiculous amounts, untie CEO pay to stock performance, Hell tax bonuses above x amount at a significantly higher rate, stop Board and executive collusion, actually enforce safety standards, enforce disclosure laws so the market has better information, tax the ever lovin' fuck out of cash and semi-liquid investments (beyond a reasonable working capital) etc.

See, from a realistic standpoint, I think it is the right thing to do for this country (not sure about outsourcing and its effect on other countries, but that would be a whole nother thread) and from a political point of view it makes sense. The Repubs tie the Dems to gov't then make gov't the villain. Dems need to turn the Repubs advantage into a weakness. They need to expose corporate malfeasance and hypocrisy left and right. Then hoist the Repubs by their own petard.

At the same time these new taxes should be used to give direct loans to start up businesses. If it was determined that Student Loans given through private lenders were bad what do you think is happening to small businesses?

Now, that being said, ideally we need a balance between public, private, and the populace. Right now things are SO out of whack with Corporations it has become destructive, and oppressive. And it looks like no one will call them on the carpet about this. (except maybe Nader, who is just too left to contemplate). Here hoping that it will swing back AND that it will not swing back too far.

Somehow the US economy became a zero sum game. This is a direct consequence of us loosing our MFG base, and then our service base. When all you are doing is managing people or getting commission on sales of financial paper, then all you can do is take wealth and capital out of the economy. I blame "trickle down" magical thinking, our shift to a financial products economy, the ex-hippies turned business leaders of the Boomer Generation, and the rise of the managerial class. Oh and piss poor education, and the rise of home schooling. It has put us in quite a pickle.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Will the predicted car fire be a result of the alleged flamingness of the said asshole?

Now I have this whole picture in my mind. Newt waks up to his car whistling tunelessly, As he goes by the camera we whip pan to follow him. There are trails of smoke coming from a widening black hole in his pants.

He turns on the car.

(NSFW). Newt mutters something about letting the kids use his car. As he pulls out we notice more smoke filling the car....
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not sure really. But getting them to spens some of their cash reserves. Stop outsourcing, stop paying CEOs such ridiculous amounts, untie CEO pay to stock performance, Hell tax bonuses above x amount at a significantly higher rate, stop Board and executive collusion, actually enforce safety standards, enforce disclosure laws so the market has better information, tax the ever lovin' fuck out of cash and semi-liquid investments (beyond a reasonable working capital) etc.

How do any of those create jobs?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How do any of those create jobs?

Well, I don't want the gov't going in and taking over every single company. So the idea is to incentively the things we want companies to do, and disincentivize the things that hurt our economy. Kinda like how tax policy is used on us. You know, buy a house have a kid - gov'rt says they want to encourage these things so we offer a tax break.

So while discuouraging excessive CEO pay does not directly affect jobs, it will hopefully get businesses to start spending money on actually producing things, and starting new projects. Crazy, I know.

As a side note, productivity is no longer on the rise. Looks like the American worker is tired of getting fucked. Hopefully this means the jobs will follow. Now if we can just get the banks to loan again.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
×
×
  • Create New...