Why does everyone hate Catelyn Stark?

[Valmy]

Yeah alot of people do not hate Catelyn Stark.

[RobSnow]

I love Catelyn. What parent hasnt made huge mistakes in the cause of loving their children? She is way less sinister and self serving in her maternal-ness then Cersei.

[noobilly]

See, this is the kind of posts which makes it really hard to take the "I hate Catelyn" crowd seriously.

It was Ned's decision to go to KL. He's the Lord, he doesn't have to do what his wife suggests. Not only that, but after Bran's fall Catelyn asked him not to go and he ignored her.

Tywin started the war. If you think having a son arrested is a justifiable reason to start a war...:rolleyes: Not to mention that the first hostile act between the Starks and Lannisters was the push of Bran, and then the attempt to kill him with the dagger.

And the Red Wedding was planned before Jaime was released. The plan was to get Edmure, Cat and a bunch of other high nobles as hostages - more than enough to exchange with Jaime.

If I was a high lord, and the daughter of another high lord grabbed my son when he has done nothing wrong, I might start a war. Certainly doesn't seem outside the realm of possibilities.

[NeonGreenWalker]

I don't hate her at all really. Sure her hatred of Jon is borderline irrational and since he's a fangirl/boy favorite in the series that's a black mark on her, as well as the whole freeing Jaime which was the North's only real bargaining chip. They had other hostages but Jaime was really the only one that mattered. When she started hanging Frey's though? She got pretty badass. I honestly want a reunion between her and her daughters, even though she's pretty much a grotesque now. She thinks that everything she loved and cared about are gone, she needs a little bit of good to happen to her.

[eyeheartsansa]

Agreed. She needs to be reunited with her kids and for the reader it is frustrating that she just barely missed Arya.

[Chocolate_dream]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

To add to that, her "holier than thou" treatment of Peter Baelish led him to seek revenge on the Starks and everything else came crumbling down.

I truly believe that if she had been more sympathetic to Peter , he would not have turned into such a monster. She didn't even visit him when he was wounded after the duel with Brandon because she believed herself to be too highborn to deal with the likes of him.

I'm so sick of her and the Mountain. Their deaths are long overdue. Hopefully they will both end up gutting each other soon.

[Alexia]

That is my favorite anti-Catelyn argument ever. Really? Rejected suitor is unable to deal with rejection and decides to destroy the woman's entire family in revenge? It is all her fault!

:lmao:

[David Selig]

Yeah, it's all Catelyn's fault, Littlefinger was a poor innocent victim and was completely justified for starting a massive war, organising a number of assassinations, and murdering Lysa because Catelyn didn't visit him while he was injured...:rolleyes:

We are not even sure LF was really seeking a revenge on the Starks, BTW - there's a good chance he'd have sided with Ned if Ned wasn't so insistent on putting Stannis on the throne.

[Chocolate_dream]

That is my favorite anti-Catelyn argument ever. Really? Rejected suitor is unable to deal with rejection and decides to destroy the woman's entire family in revenge? It is all her fault!

:lmao:

No but she could have been kinder and more empathetic to someone she had considered a "friend". She doesn't care about anyone elses feelings except her own while simultaeneously pretending to be the "good guy".

*puke*

[NeonGreenWalker]

To add to that, her "holier than thou" treatment of Peter Baelish led him to seek revenge on the Starks and everything else came crumbling down.

I truly believe that if she had been more sympathetic to Peter , he would not have turned into such a monster. She didn't even visit him when he was wounded after the duel with Brandon because she believed herself to be too highborn to deal with the likes of him.

I'm so sick of her and the Mountain. Their deaths are long overdue. Hopefully they will both end up gutting each other soon.

Wasn't she ordered not to by Hoster? She was promised to Brandon so having a close relationship with Littlefinger did seem inappropriate. Remember that flashback scene of Cat and Lysa playing kissing games with him? Besides I don't think Littlefinger would be the man he is today without this happening. One of the big things he tries to teach Sansa is that the world is not a story. This was the moment when he learned that lesson. Challenging Brandon must have sounded a fine idea to him at the time, something straight from a bard's song. He learned the truth of the world that day. Besides look at what happened when Lysa "visited" Petyr when he was wounded. They shagged, Lysa got pregnant, Hoster forced tansy tea on her making her miscarriage and then she was unable to conceive a healthy child.

Honestly most of her actions seemed logical to me (aside from freeing Jaime. That was a world of stupid). All of the evidence pointed to Tyrion that she gathered. She didn't even want to confront him. Remember she was trying to go unnoticed. But when she couldn't hide she couldn't very well say kind words to the Imp, even so far as to greet him. She had to take him, kill him or let him go on his way which wasn't really an option. Her mistake was going to the Eyrie and trusting her sister instead of taking him back to the North. Sure it began the war, but it was Jaime crippling Bran that was the first domino here.

Catelyn is a victim really. She made a few bad decisions, but they pale in comparison to many others in the series.

I do agree about the mountain though. I love to hate him :D

[Valmy]

BTW - there's a good chance he'd have sided with Ned if Ned wasn't so insistent on putting Stannis on the throne.

Well sided with Ned in that particular instance but LF doesn't side with anybody besides himself. After all he "sided" with Joff and then had him murdered.

[Stinky Steward]

people blame her for the red wedding?no one ive talked to about seems to think so

and as for hating cat, she kinda destroyed her family

ned"i shouldnt got to KL"

cat"you must"

ned"okay"

ned dies

cat"im going to arrest the dwarf in plain sight using tully bannermen"

tyrion"wtf?you know my father is going to get pissed"

cat"whatever"

tyrion escapes anyway, tywin attacks riverlands

cat"im going to free you so you can free my daughters, despite the fact that neither you nor your brother would do say without tywins leave"

jaime"okay, its not like im a valuable hostage or anything"

she loses robbs most valuable hostage with no gain for robb

she caused neds death, the capture of sansa, arya going rogue, she starts a war that causes a war that kills robb, and bran and rickon in her eyes, since they were reported dead, she then releases jaime which led to the red wedding, since thres no way the blackfish can get back at tywin for the red wedding without jaime to kill, and brynden wouldve done it

so shes responsible for every casualty, highborn and low, in the riverlands and the north, i wonder why people would hate her for that

Hmmm, I can see why Littlefinger loves her :)

I'd agree with most of this, I think the only part that's unfair is bolded; Ned had little choice but to go.

[David Selig]

If Cat had visited Petyr, that would probably got him into more trouble because Hoster would've been angry and could well have done something more drastic than just sending Petyr away. I don't recall any indication that Petyr hated Catelyn for not visiting him anyway - I've always thought his grudge was against Hoster, the Starks and the social reality in Westeros which made it impossible for a minor noble to marry the daughter of a Lord Paramount. And that wouldn't have been changed by Cat visiting the recovering Petyr a few times.

I am surprised nobody has yet blamed Cat for asking Brandon not to kill LF in the duel - after all, it was obvious he'd grow up to be a ruthless mastermind and start the war of the Five Kings, right? ;)

[Stinky Steward]

FWIW I like Catelyn a lot as a character. She's a strong, honorable, and usually wise adult female character, the only major one in the series at that, and I was sorry to see her go.

I totally acknowledge, though, that a lot of things she does (capturing Tyrion, releasing Jamie) are epic failures, and that her dislike of Jon is deeply unfair. GRRM made a strong female character, then punished her for being a mother. That's just one of the things he does.

[ghost the direwolf]

Hi, this my first post, and I haven't been on this forum too long, so I am sorry if this has already been discussed, but why does everyone hate Catelyn Stark? In all the threads I have read, I have found some one or other bashing her, and that has concerned me a bit, cause I quite like her.

Sure, she is not nice to Jon (which is understandable considering it's Westeros), and has made a lot of mistakes, but so has everyone, and she normally blames herself for them too (like when she sent Ned and the children south).

I have also heard a lot of people say that Catelyn is only concerned about her own, which I disagree with. In aCoK, she was praying in the sept for her own and everyone else affected by the war.

And why is she blamed for the Red Wedding? Shouldn't it be Walder Frey, Tywin Lannister, Roose Bolton, and to a lesser extent, Robb, who were responsible for it?

[ghost the direwolf]

I do not like her because of Bran and Rickon. i mean what kind of mother will leave her nearly 8 year old and his very young brother to go to KL to find some stupid proof. how could she even say to Bran the cripple boy " there should always be a Stark at WF".

[HighwayStar]

I don't hate Catelyn in the least, though I wouldn't say she is one of my favourite characters in the whole series. If anything, I feel a lot of pity for her, especially since I have known quite a few people in real life who have lost their children, and I know how devastating it can be. She does make mistakes, some even rather big, but it cannot be denied that she is devoted to her family, and she certainly didn't deserve to die that way, and end up as a vengeful zombie to boot. As to her treatment of Jon, I agree that it was not very nice of her, but she never tried to harm the boy, as other women would have done. If Cersei had been in her place, she would probably have tried to dispose of Jon (as she actually did with some of Robert's bastards).

[you wouldn't know me]

I don't get why she had to leave winterfell either why not just send Ser Rodrik

[Call me Odie]

I don't hate Catelyn. It you hate Catelyn you have to hate Eddard too because they are just as honorable, dutiful and single minded.

[wolverine]

I have hated Catelyn for quite a while. Much of it stemmed from her treatment of Jon. I don't think that I have seen anyone point out yet that she also convinced her husband to trust LF, I am sure Ned thanks her for that.

The arrest of Tyrion was completely stupid since she was basing it on the fact that LF said the dagger was Tyrion's won from a bet with LF. How dumb would Tyrion need to be to arm some retarded killer with his own easily identifiable dragon hilt dagger?

The release of Jaime is IMO the dumbest thing any character does in the series so far. She is so irrationally selfishly blinded by trying to protect her children it is annoying. Even Robb realized he needed to get her out of his sight so he could be allowed to make rational decisions.