[ADwD Spoilers] The Hooded Man at Winterfell

[The King Who Knelt]

But the bones weren't there because moat cailin was closed off and when it was taken and the bolton's heading to winterfell at some point he got into the lines of men, more than likely the manderlays after hearing the rumors of them and the frey's.. Sure its crackpot but hey its someone that would know the castle and could likely find a hiding place

Yeah it's possible, just seems to need a little too much explaining to be true.

If I HAD to pick who the hooded man was I'd go with Theon. For one the chapter title was "The Ghost in Winterfell" as a Theon POV. But more important IMO was the hooded man called Theon a kinslayer which, as it turns out, was a really cutting thing to say to Theon. We find out he's been dwelling on his feelings of betrayal to the Starks yadda yadda, so it kind of makes sense that this is what is "subconscious/alter ego" would say to him. Still feels like a clumsy fit, though

[Envie]

Yeah it's possible, just seems to need a little too much explaining to be true.

If I HAD to pick who the hooded man was I'd go with Theon. For one the chapter title was "The Ghost in Winterfell" as a Theon POV. But more important IMO was the hooded man called Theon a kinslayer which, as it turns out, was a really cutting thing to say to Theon. We find out he's been dwelling on his feelings of betrayal to the Starks yadda yadda, so it kind of makes sense that this is what is "subconscious/alter ego" would say to him. Still feels like a clumsy fit, though

You know, you bring up a good point, even though it only furthers my own belief it wasn't Theon hah. You pointed out that the chapter is titled "The Ghost in Winterfell" and along with the mystery murders and other happenings - I have to wonder if this hooded man isn't that ghost. Not literally, but possibly as others have said - the Blackfish? This also goes along with the theme / discussion in another thread that "There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" making you wonder if that isn't the missing Stark (Benjen?)...

[Sean T. Collins]

Here's the thing, though: Don't LOTS of people in Winterfell know who Theon is? It's not a secret. He just gave "Arya" away to Ramsay under his own name in front of dozens of witnesses, and everyone knows who he is at the various meals we see everyone taking. Ramsay still calls him Reek because Ramsay is a dick, not to hide his identity, not anymore. Honestly, it never even occurred to me that there was something special about this hooded guy who insults Theon when they bump into each other at night, because everyone there knows who Theon is and I can't imagine any of them respect him very much.

[Lummel]

You know, you bring up a good point, even though it only furthers my own belief it wasn't Theon hah. You pointed out that the chapter is titled "The Ghost in Winterfell" and along with the mystery murders and other happenings - I have to wonder if this hooded man isn't that ghost. Not literally, but possibly as others have said - the Blackfish? This also goes along with the theme / discussion in another thread that "There must always be a Stark in Winterfell" making you wonder if that isn't the missing Stark (Benjen?)...

Wait so what's your view Blackfish or Benjen?

Why do you find it more likely that the Blackfish abandons Edmure and Robett Arryn or Benjen breaks his oath and sneaks his way south past the Wall either just to kill people on a random basis than seeing Theon as the murderer?

[Andre]

Here's the thing, though: Don't LOTS of people in Winterfell know who Theon is? It's not a secret. He just gave "Arya" away to Ramsay under his own name in front of dozens of witnesses, and everyone knows who he is at the various meals we see everyone taking. Ramsay still calls him Reek because Ramsay is a dick, not to hide his identity, not anymore. Honestly, it never even occurred to me that there was something special about this hooded guy who insults Theon when they bump into each other at night, because everyone there knows who Theon is and I can't imagine any of them respect him very much

Yes, but the strange thing is that the hooded man is surprised to see Theon still alive. If he belonged to any of the parties who arrived with the boltons, shouldn´t he already know this?

[Dio Forel]

Surprised to see Theon because it is kinda like Theon is the Ghost of Winterfell and only Reek survived. The hooded man was reminding him that he is Theon. In Theon/Reek's POVs there is a lot of mention of what his name really is and forgetting who he was. Nobody was around at the time and Theon blacked out for an extended period of time. It would definitely make sense. It is also telling that it was the asshole Walder killed and not the one who was nicer to Theon/Reek.

[Andre]

Surprised to see Theon because it is kinda like Theon is the Ghost of Winterfell and only Reek survived. The hooded man was reminding him that he is Theon. In Theon/Reek's POVs there is a lot of mention of what his name really is and forgetting who he was. Nobody was around at the time and Theon blacked out for an extended period of time. It would definitely make sense. It is also telling that it was the asshole Walder killed and not the one who was nicer to Theon/Reek.

I agree. I didn´t want to dispute the theory that the hooded man is in fact theon himself. There´s no really proof for that theory, I admit, but I like it and I can´t come up with a better one. Blackfish, Benjen? Sound to fanboy-ish to me, wanting to see the former super-heroes come back and do awesome things. I see no reason for those two to appear in the middle of a snowstorm in the winterfell ruins and go about murdering mean but not really important frey-children. Mance? No, he was still playing music when theon left - and he should have already known that theon was there, so why the surprise? Big Walder, Manderly, Manderly´s men? The same, they all had seen theon previously. And they had no reason to leave the comparingly warm hall for the snowstorm outside. A supernatural-stark-ghost? I won´t rule it out, but there´s no proof for stark-ghosts up to now. Catelyn´s men? Possible, but wouldn´t they rather try to free the supposed arya instead of drawing attention to their presence by murdering little walder?

[Dio Forel]

I agree. I didn´t want to dispute the theory that the hooded man is in fact theon himself. There´s no really proof for that theory, I admit, but I like it and I can´t come up with a better one. Blackfish, Benjen? Sound to fanboy-ish to me, wanting to see the former super-heroes come back and do awesome things. I see no reason for those two to appear in the middle of a snowstorm in the winterfell ruins and go about murdering mean but not really important frey-children. Mance? No, he was still playing music when theon left - and he should have already known that theon was there, so why the surprise? Big Walder, Manderly, Manderly´s men? The same, they all had seen theon previously. And they had no reason to leave the comparingly warm hall for the snowstorm outside. A supernatural-stark-ghost? I won´t rule it out, but there´s no proof for stark-ghosts up to now. Catelyn´s men? Possible, but wouldn´t they rather try to free the supposed arya instead of drawing attention to their presence by murdering little walder?

I think if it was a real Stark ghost, it probably should've done something before the entire place was destroyed. That's a pretty sucky Ghost of Winterfell to me. Lets the whole place get destroyed and taken over yet chooses to cross into the world of the living to kill Walder. A big fact is that the murder was to somebody that overly tormented Theon and took place around the time of a blackout of Theon's and when Theon was roaming around by himself.

Honestly speaking I don't think it was a real character running around in a hood. As if a hood would be a great disguise for somebody running around killing somebody. A guy in a hood would stand out to me. That's almost as bad and inconspicuous of a disguise as when Clark Kent would take off his glasses and be Superman. Like wait is that Clark Kent? Nah it can't be... Clark has glasses this guy doesn't. Darn I wonder who Superman is...

[HotPiesBastard]

Its interesting that the chapter is titled A Ghost in Winterfell when Theon refers to himself as one of the ghosts in winterfell in the chapter The Turncloack. Starting to think that the hooded man is actually theon.

[Forseti]

If I remember correctly, (and I should be having a reread to be sure) the accusations that the hooded man levels at Theon more or less echo the ones he levels at himself when we share his thoughts in chapters prior to the encounter.

If so, that's another hint that he's seeing himself.

[redxavier]

If I HAD to pick who the hooded man was I'd go with Theon. For one the chapter title was "The Ghost in Winterfell" as a Theon POV. But more important IMO was the hooded man called Theon a kinslayer which, as it turns out, was a really cutting thing to say to Theon. We find out he's been dwelling on his feelings of betrayal to the Starks yadda yadda, so it kind of makes sense that this is what is "subconscious/alter ego" would say to him. Still feels like a clumsy fit, though

But he isn't a kinslayer, and thinks as much when other characters say it to him (Lady Dustin and the spearwife), so I don't see how it makes sense that a split personality would torment him with a falsehood. The hooded man has the knowledge of someone who's arrived at Winterfell after the wedding. He knows as much about Theon as someone recently come from the south who dislikes him intensely for his actions (like a pre-Red Wedding Northerner).

I think people are generally overstating the schizophrenia aspect, and forming a theory that hasn't much evidence. Why does Theon 'kill' in some situations but not others when all opportunity is there such as in the bedroom with Ramsay during the latter's wedding night? Theon's story is about the subjugation of identity and its slow reclamation, having Theon be Theon already but just some of the time sort of cheapens that arc.

[Forseti]

I think people are generally overstating the schizophrenia aspect, and forming a theory that hasn't much evidence. Why does Theon 'kill' in some situations but not others when all opportunity is there such as in the bedroom with Ramsay during the latter's wedding night? Theon's story is about the subjugation of identity and its slow reclamation, having Theon be Theon already but just some of the time sort of cheapens that arc.

Theon is constantly mulling over his identity in his mind, and has been caught muttering to himself several times. Addressing his mirror image wouldn't be a stretch at all given that behavior. If he was in fact talking to himself, the discussion can be seen as a stepping stone on the way to reassert himself as Theon, a conflict between being Theon and being Reek: "Lord Ramsay is not done with me." followed by "I leave you to him, then."

Also, none of this suggests that Theon is actually the murderer.

[Auska]

Wait so what's your view Blackfish or Benjen?

Benjen!

…

Also, the hood is not significant. It's cold and snowing like a mofo. Everyone's got their hood up.

[Bumble Bee]

I have wondered about who it could be under that hood as well and do not think it is Theon's split personality. Whoever it it may have been to one who killed the Frey kid, and there is only one group who hates them enough to kill even the Frey children and that is the BWB. Whoever it is could be one of them because the BWB got the other Freys and Jaime by infiltrating their various hosts and spying on them. It could be the Blackfish working with the BWB. Then again it could be Mance pacing the walls and using another spell to switch identities again.

[Forseti]

A Brotherhood man isn't as farfetched as most theories. Surely word of Arya being married off to the Bolton bastard would've reached their ears, and if lords from all over the north could get to Winterfell in time for the wedding, I don't see why one of them couldn't. Harwin would be a likely candidate.

[Lummel]

There's also been some speculation about the swords in the crypts. There were four missing when Lady Dustin and Theon went down there, but Bran and his crew only took three of them.

There are only three missing swords when they visit the crypts. The one from an old king that Hodor took, Brandon sword which Bran took and Riccard's sword which Meera took.

[Forseti]

Osha took Eddard's sword.

[Galen M]

Osha took Eddard's sword.

except that sword wouldn't be "missing," right? They never made Ned's statue, did they?

[ArtNJ]

I love the Theon split theory! I hope its true. But arent the dead kind of random? Would psycho-Theon/Reek really be trying to provoke inter-faction violence? Would he more likely be going after Ramsay's men one by one as a prelude to killing Ramsay? I *want* it to be true, but it doesnt feel quite right.

[Forseti]

except that sword wouldn't be "missing," right? They never made Ned's statue, did they?

The statue and sword were already there, waiting at an empty tomb for Eddard's bones.