Pretenders

[Cozur]

I was wondering whether we'll see some information on various pretenders in Westeros, and, possibly, Essos.

I know the Blackfyre pretenders was a fairly serious threat to the Targaryens at times, and that the Reynes and Tarbecks rebelled against the Lannister.

It seems to me, however, that during the very long time that the seven kingdoms and the free cities have existed, there has to have been more rebellions than those two mentioned above. What houses have become extinct because of rebellions?

[_Oberyn_]

Manderleys were made to move north.

Butterwells of Whitewalls got wiped out by Bloodraven.

Toynes,not sure if Myles Toyne was the last one though

Osgrays maybe, not sure if Eustace Osgrey had any more children when he got remaried.

[Cozur]

Manderleys were made to move north.

Butterwells of Whitewalls got wiped out by Bloodraven.

Toynes,not sure if Myles Toyne was the last one though

Osgrays maybe, not sure if Eustace Osgrey had any more children when he got remaried.

I think I remember a vague reference to the Osgrays in one of the books, so it's possible his line was continued. Afaik, the Butterwells of Whitewall just had 9/10 of their property taken away from them by Bloodraven?

[_Oberyn_]

Afaik, the Butterwells of Whitewall just had 9/10 of their property taken away from them by Bloodraven?

Ofc, I forgot. :( But Whitewalls was taken down.

[voodooqueen126]

The Boltons have rebelled several times.

[Glyn Tarvoke]

The Casterlys of Casterly Rock are extinct. Skagos rebelled against Winterfell. (In the next book, maybe we'll have more details on that one). The Iron Isles are pretty much always in rebellion. GRMM writes that karhold got its name from a younger son of Winterfell who put down a rebellion.

It seems that in Westeros warfare has been pretty much constant among the lords, Kings and as the second Hedge Night story shows even between small holders. There's no way to list all of them, just the bigger or more important ones. However, from the context rebellions seem to be fairly constant and certain groups seem to have been fighting one another for thousands of years (Marcher lords vs Dorne as one example).

(ADWD's epilogue of ADWD has a pithy comment which explains why many rebel. And In the second hedge night story, Ser Osgrey provides his (self serving) explanation of why he rebelled; others provide what was more likely the main reasons for Osgrey's decision to rebel; and red widow's Septon Sefton provides complaints justifying the possibility others, even who supported the Targeryons over Blackfyre, might rebel yet again)

[Antonius Pius]

There's also the Defiance of Duskendale, and Balon Greyjoy's earlier attempts to win a crown.

But in general, I think we can assume that there would be a LOT of rebellions/pretenders etc. Not just to kingship, but to all levels of lordship. Just to name an example, in AFFC Jaime comes across Lancel's new wife. She is the heir to ... [forgot the name of the castle/lordship] Her mother's sister also has a claim. Now, this other claimant may not raise a fuss, but she easily could. The same in AGOT, where Ramsay Snow forcibly marries Lady Hornwood, and then starves her to death for her lordship. His conduct may be especially cruel, but this kind of conflict would be seen all over Westeros.

[Lummel]

Darry via a Frey marriage (& the Freys for obvious reasons are married to everyone), Lancel has the Darry ploughman quartered on his arms.

[Antonius Pius]

Darry via a Frey marriage (& the Freys for obvious reasons are married to everyone), Lancel has the Darry ploughman quartered on his arms.

Yes, that's the one. With Gatehouse Ami Frey as the bride.

[fluffywarthog]

Rebellion was unbelievably common in any feudal structure, be it a major challenger to the crown, a parallel dynasty being set up to the crown, or merely a coalition of minor nobles fighting for increased representation. Even peasant revolts were far more common than most histories tend to record; in centralized states like Britain and France, serf rebellions occurred at least once a generation well into the eighteenth century. Throw into that pirates raiding or demanding territory, secession-minded lordlings, bandits, and the machinations of foreign powers, revolt became the rule rather than the exception in medieval times.

The feudal system itself is often seen as the chicken hatched from the egg of social degeneration after the fall of Rome. Without a system of written common law, a uniform bureaucracy, and even a rudimentary social welfare system, it was up to minor military officials to act as governors for the chieftains. The social games, military culture, and never-ending training through melees, jousts, and marches are obviously required by a life where any rabble-rousing farmer could raise a rebellion of thousands of angry farmers against a few dozen lords and household guards.

Consequently, warfare became the ends rather than the means of survival for the nobility and monarchy. Rather than simply keeping a lid on vassals and serfs, it became the reason for being for the gentry. Pillage, looting, ransoms, and land acquisition were good reasons to rebel, as well as to join the king in putting down a rebellion. Everyone had something to gain or lose.

In the last century of Westerosi history, we have multiple rebellions each generation: the first Blackfyre challenge to Daeron II in 184AL, followed by a succession challenge after his son's death in 221. In 212, yet another Blackfyre rebellion was put down by his grandson Maekar I. During this whole time, raiding was common by the Greyjoys, who were always, eventually, put down. After the death of Maekar I in 233 at the hands of another rebel lord, the Great Houses conspired to either seat his son (Maester) Aemon or his son Aegon V. During the reign of Aerys the Mad, there were at least three major rebellions alone- the Tenpenny Rebellion (including the last of the Blackfyre pretenders), the Defiance of Duskendale, and finally, Robert's Rebellion, which was followed five years later by yet another Greyjoy rebellion, and finally the War of Five Kings ten after that.

[LuisDantas]

There is some useful (and entertaining) information on the early Blackfyre rebellions in the second and third tales of Dunk and Egg, "The Sworn Sword" and "The Mystery Knight". I recommend reading them in order (and if at all possible, reading "The Hedge Knight" before either).

It doesn't matter how far advanced into reading the main books you are, however.

As I recall it, the Bran chapters in ACOK had some hints of rebel movements as well, or at least House succession dilemmas.

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/The_Sworn_Sword

http://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/The_Mystery_Knight