laughing tree knight Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 So that's the question, I'm speaking of the black haired babe who died many years ago. my main point of thought would have to be Varys. I mean he doesn't want Robert's reign to last. Only to last a little while and hold together until his plans for Aegon or Viserys comes to pass many years to come. And we know that he knows of the lineage of Joffery, etc.... But he let that go on because it suited his purpose to have a deposable 'king" Lannister for a returning Targaryan. But a true born son would ruin all those long term plans. So did someone poison King Robert and Cersei's true born son. and if so was it Varys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Damian Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 I am not sure, I know that Cersei claimed to Ned that she was once pregnant by robert but jaime had it taken care of. I do not know if she was lying about the child that died or not, No one at court seems to mention a dead prince or princess to Robert or Cersie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrogant Bastard Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Pretty sure that black haired baby is a creation by the tv series. In the world of the show, I assume it died naturally but i dont really know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raksha the Demon Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Cersei did not bear any of Robert's children; and that was a deliberate decision on her part. I think she mentioned using moon tea. In the TV miniseries, Cersei expresses regret for a black-haired baby boy who died after birth; but it didn't happen in the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughing tree knight Posted August 24, 2011 Author Share Posted August 24, 2011 i gave away my copy of the book after the show aired for a friend to read but I thought there was a small reference to it in a chapter. not in the one between CAT and Cersei i know that was added, but I thought there was a mention of a child. I could be wrong. what is the ruling on whether or not Cersei every gave birth to a true born heir by Robert Barattheon?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medieval Housefly Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 So that's the question, I'm speaking of the black haired babe who died many years ago. my main point of thought would have to be Varys. I mean he doesn't want Robert's reign to last. Only to last a little while and hold together until his plans for Aegon or Viserys comes to pass many years to come. And we know that he knows of the lineage of Joffery, etc.... But he let that go on because it suited his purpose to have a deposable 'king" Lannister for a returning Targaryan. But a true born son would ruin all those long term plans. So did someone poison King Robert and Cersei's true born son. and if so was it Varys?I thought it was added to the tv series and I was actually mad about it. Cercei was killing off King Robert's true born children as to not raise suspicion about her own children; however if she had had a baby with black hair it just didn't fit into the picture for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughing tree knight Posted August 24, 2011 Author Share Posted August 24, 2011 right ok..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrogant Bastard Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 i gave away my copy of the book after the show aired for a friend to read but I thought there was a small reference to it in a chapter. not in the one between CAT and Cersei i know that was added, but I thought there was a mention of a child. I could be wrong. what is the ruling on whether or not Cersei every gave birth to a true born heir by Robert Barattheon??I believe Cersei tells Ned in the Godswood that she aborted one of Robert's when pregnant, but I'm 99% sure she never gave birth to a true born heir by Robert. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brienne the Beauty Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 It is just TV show continuity that Cersei had a baby by Robert. She did not in the books, and this is important in relation to the prophecy by Maggie the Frog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malkan Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 yes it was a TV thing I believe, in the books when Ned and Cersei have their talk about the incest, she says one time Robert got her pregnant, but jaime found a woman so she could abort himNow at least it happen in the TV series, so its still a valid question in that "reality", I don't think Varys would have poisoned, I believe she did have a son and he died naturally, and with him die the only "love" Cersei had for Robert, and any chance of them having an actual relationship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Captain Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Cersei did not bear any of Robert's children; and that was a deliberate decision on her part. I think she mentioned using moon tea. In the TV miniseries, Cersei expresses regret for a black-haired baby boy who died after birth; but it didn't happen in the book. As I saw the show first, I was kind of disappointed that this actually didn't happen in the books. I thought it did a good job of depicting how originally Cersei did care for Robert (however briefly), but I guess that's why the show put it in. I can't really remember about the moon tea part, but that would make sense later on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICE CROW Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 As I saw the show first, I was kind of disappointed that this actually didn't happen in the books. I thought it did a good job of depicting how originally Cersei did care for Robert (however briefly), but I guess that's why the show put it in. I can't really remember about the moon tea part, but that would make sense later on.I agree i liked the show version of this alot better, in general the books make it seem like she instantly hated the man and never looked back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laughing tree knight Posted August 24, 2011 Author Share Posted August 24, 2011 I agree i liked the show version of this alot better, in general the books make it seem like she instantly hated the man and never looked back.ok well then just think for a second for the T.V show which has far to go and has set up the dilemma I set forward in the post, think of it as fifth season problem for the show to retcon or figure out. or let sleeping dogs lie.but my point as an exercise if the show was gospel... or if they had to write their way out of it would you think some one killed the child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raksha the Demon Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Cersei does mention in the books (forget which one, probably AFFC) that she was sexually aroused by Robert once; during their wedding night. She seems to have gone into the marriage nursing a childish crush on Rhaegar Targaryen and the belief that she should have been Rhaegar's wife (since her father tried to arrange a betrothal between the young Cersei and Rhaegar, and young Cersei was strongly attracted to Rhaegar), as well as a hatred for Robert for having killed Rhaegar. Not to mention the ongoing affair with her twin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Antony Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 I agree i liked the show version of this alot better, in general the books make it seem like she instantly hated the man and never looked back.Well, She didn't ever love him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stubby Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 Whilst it started out as book topic I'm going to move this one to the TV threads now.:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyDogIsNamedDanerys Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 So that's the question, I'm speaking of the black haired babe who died many years ago. my main point of thought would have to be Varys. I mean he doesn't want Robert's reign to last. Only to last a little while and hold together until his plans for Aegon or Viserys comes to pass many years to come. And we know that he knows of the lineage of Joffery, etc.... But he let that go on because it suited his purpose to have a deposable 'king" Lannister for a returning Targaryan. But a true born son would ruin all those long term plans. So did someone poison King Robert and Cersei's true born son. and if so was it Varys?I think that Cersei poisoned her child by Robert (in the books, she had a late-term abortion of that child). But that's just me. I don't think most agree with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lynxx Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 ...So did someone poison King Robert and Cersei's true born son. and if so was it Varys?I originally thought that Varys was looking out for Robert's bastards by getting Gendry apprenticed to the armorer, but that doesn't make sense. It was most likely Jon Arryn.OK, so who was the person who got Gendry fired and sent to the Wall, safely away from the scheming at King's Landing? Jon Aryn was already dead. Was it possibly Ned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HodorSaysHodor Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 I originally thought that Varys was looking out for Robert's bastards by getting Gendry apprenticed to the armorer, but that doesn't make sense. It was most likely Jon Arryn.OK, so who was the person who got Gendry fired and sent to the Wall, safely away from the scheming at King's Landing? Jon Aryn was already dead. Was it possibly Ned?When Ned went to see Gendry, he was trying to figure out what Jon Arryn had been up to. Also, Robert was still alive at the time. Ned had no idea he'd be arrested and/or beheaded, in the near future. I think after Robert and Ned's deaths, the smith no longer cared what happened to Gendry, even though he was good at what he did. Maybe he wanted to prevent any future "trouble" for himself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lezboyd Posted August 24, 2011 Share Posted August 24, 2011 I think the black haired babe dying was put in the TV series to support/drive home the point that Robert's seed was strong and that his true/natural borns were all black-haired, given the limited time the TV series had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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