Why Renly? Why? Damn It!

[The Black Betha]

Renly became one of my favourite characters, but after his death I realized he wasn't that much. Although I still don't like Stannis that much to want him for king. I'll be TEAM ROBB forever, I guess (ok, that was stupid)

[Nahlim]

I liked Renly. Not too much, but liked him. When he was killed, I had a feeling it was a bit premature. The guy didn't get to do anything significant! But hey... It's the GRRM way...

[Joyce Wang]

I saw the post a while ago, but didn't read it. Today, I reached the Renly's death,I guess i know what is "why renly?why? Damn it!" all about. so here I am. I'd say the way Renly died is really surprising. If one evil stroke can turn the table around so easily, why not all the kings and lords just seek help from the sorcerers? somehow It just makes the human battles look like a joke. If Stannis can march to the KL with the new host, it will be bad news for the Imp.

[Rody]

I saw the post a while ago, but didn't read it. Today, I reached the Renly's death,I guess i know what is "why renly?why? Damn it!" all about. so here I am. I'd say the way Renly died is really surprising. If one evil stroke can turn the table around so easily, why not all the kings and lords just seek help from the sorcerers? somehow It just makes the human battles look like a joke. If Stannis can march to the KL with the new host, it will be bad news for the Imp.

You´re going to love it then when Stannis does reach KL

When I made this topic, I wrote Why Renly? Why? Damn It!

It was because I really liked the guy and felt really pissed when he kicked the bucket.

[Greyjoy the Reaver]

This was definitely a WTF moment for me. Especially the way it goes down with the shadow and all. I had to stop and do a reread of the chapter just to make sure I read it right. In the end it did make for entertaining reading. If it is so easy for Mel to kill with the shadow baby I don't know why Stannis doesn't use that on all his opposers.

[Crown]

That chapter was just odd. I had to re-read it a few times before I fully understood it was a shadow and not Stannis himself, I was tired while reading it, that's why I didn't understood it at first. However, it's not the weirdest chapter, that was the House of the Undying chapter.

[Fenlaf M. Lupin]

I felt sorry when Renly died but now beacuse I was fond of his character but of how much he was loved, specially when we get to see his court through Cat's eyes "the knights of summer" for me it was jsut so sad how this young sers and ladies seemed to be playing at war, with all their honor and colorful gowns.

I really would had loved to see Renly rule KL, like in Sansa's song, were every knight keep their oaths and the heroes were real XD.

[the rag doll]

I was really sad when Reny died, especially because he seemed so much better than Stannis, but then I changed my mind after a while. Stannis is waaaayyyy more kick-ass.

[Aegon Targaryen X]

Renly's death was sad and stunning. If he had to be murdered for Stannis to take the Throne the fires must of shown that wench that stannis loves something about Renly. The real sad part in all this is Loras and Brienne. Loras lost his love, and Brienne lost the man she thought she could have though never could.

GRRM has made a habbit of if the readers love this character kill em off.

[Sam with Hooters]

Winterfell is Burning wrote:

Littlefinger also comments that "find lands for a third son is always hard, and twice so in Loras' case". Why would be twice as hard to find lands when he is young, handsome and a great knight?

Feudal lands weren't divided: a lord had one heir to carry on the title and rulership over that particular piece of land. Low-class options like learning a trade, becoming a merchant, or pursuing life as a sellsword would disgrace the family, so younger sons in Westeros have few options:

1. Marry for lands and/or wealth. The most popular, but of course competition for heiresses is fierce!

2. Life of honorable service as a septon, maester, Kingsguard, or black brother -- all of them, alas, include an oath of celibacy, so no trueborn heirs.

3. Throw support behind some *other* contender for the throne and hope s/he will reward you with lands and titles upon coronation. Of course, this makes you a traitor and attainted in the eyes of your original king/queen, who will now treat you as a deadly enemy -- and the higher-ranking you were, the less mercy you can expect.

4. Disgrace yourself with some kind of low-class profession.

5. Be your father's heir's toady, completely dependent on him.

6. Run away to a foreign land, with some of these options still available.

Since Loras is both

a member of the Kingsguard and gay

, he'll be almost impossible to settle on lands, since

the Kingsguard vow to hold no lands, and of course producing a trueborn heir could pose difficulty

. Furthermore,

his devotion to Margaery means he's unlikely to leave Kings Landing as long as she's there, or if she leaves, that he will accompany her as her bodyguard. All in all, his duties would keep him busy full-time and too preoccupied to administrate any territory.

[HyacinthGirl]

In the TV series we see that they ARE gay, but in the book I just could not pick up the hints of their "love", so can anyone guide to me to certain parts of the book that I can read so I can finally get the hints that Martin threw around.

Hints of their love:

- someone called Loras "Renly's little rose".

- when Sansa married... other someone (I don't know how make "spoiler") Garlan Tyrell said something about Loras he could be worse husband than this someone.

- Loras Tyrell went to White Cloaks, he could forget about marriage and producing heirs then.

- Loras Tyrell went mad after Renly's death and killed some Rainbow Guardsmen.

- Loras Tyrell said "when the sun is lost, candle is'nt recompensation" (or something similar I don't remember all phrase)

I hope I helped.

Kate Poem is right, there are so many more, but they're a bit later on and I don't wanna spoil. I know the TV show made it more explicit, but it's made pretty obvious in the books when you reread and stuff.

[Ser Malthred Storm]

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[the wolf warg]

i wasnt upset at all when this occured i was kind of relieved i didnt like how renleys character had no respect for anyone or anything , stannis was his older brother and he completly disregarded that just because he wanted to be a king, also the facts that people have already said his stoping and feasting in every hall and holding tourneys while battles were occuring were insulting to all of the people he wanted to rule who were "suffering"...stannis would make a great king

[KhaleesiDany]

Renly was my favorite minor character from BOOK 1 and I was very sorry to see him murdered in BOOK 2. If he had to go, I would have preferred him to die valiantly in battle than be magically assassinated.

[Crown]

Renly was my favorite minor character from BOOK 1 and I was very sorry to see him murdered in BOOK 2. If he had to go, I would have preferred him to die valiantly in battle than be magically assassinated.

Yeah, but as someone stated somewhere: Martin doesn't give a fuck about our desires.

[Drowsey Dragon]

His death ranks right up there with the Khals as the least monumental ever. A big let down for me as a reader. The shadow element is fantastic, but Renly, like the Khal should have gone out with an element of glory at least.

[Xtopher]

i think Drogo´s death was worse that Renly´s. Dying from a festered little cut, c´mon!

although i dont like how that cut was portrayed in the show. Its even worse that in the show he did the cut to himself to show his badassness, which was awesome, but that stupid little cut festered and he died from it. How dumb is that?

at least in the book the cut was a wound from a fight against one of his Kos, and he took it to defend Dany´s honor.

[Phat Walda]

I love when big fancy hero types die unremarkably. A glorious death is a truly rare thing, and plenty of stupid people who don't deserve them get them, so I figure it's only fair. ;)

[Fylimar]

I was shocked about how Renly died. It showed, how powerful Melisandre had become (I was certain, she was behind it, when I read the scene). The sad thing is: Both Renly and Stannis could have made good kings (well Stannis still could), if the first would have shown some responsibility and the second would get rid of the red woman and be himself again.

[Dragonreaver]

Unless you consider Mel's immunity to Cressen's poison supernatural. Jury's still out on that one, I think.

at first I thought the shadow creature was a lame way to go out, like a deus ex machina, but then the way magic is handled throughout the rest of the book, I look back and I really like the way it went down. I think it was the first time we see any magic, except for the dragons of GOT

True, at first I did not see it while reading that Mel actually drank the poison, I thought she made Cressen drink first.

But now I went back and saw it, so CoK opens up with some sort of magic.

But she did fail at making the flaming sword in the beginning though

Don't forget the whole Mirri Mahz Duur thing (can't remember the spelling). She did a not-inconsiderable amount of magic. But it all had some pretty serious consequences, which explains why it's not widely used.

And as for the poison, I thought it was stated (or at least inferred) in the book that she previously drank an antidote to counteract it, whereas he obviously hadn't? Even if not, she's from a foreign land. It's not implausible that she'd become accustomed to the particular poison she used (either naturally, or on purpose/through training) so wasn't affected by it, whilst he was. There are some instances in the real world of foods/substances that the locals have become adapted to, but which make visitors - at the least- violently ill.