How to kill a knight in full plate armour?

[E-Ro]

and it might even be possible with a longbow in the right archer's hands at close enough range

Short of hitting a joint, I cant see an archer shooting a man in plate and Taking out of the fight, much less actualy killing him.

[Kittyhat]

Sounds like heavy stuff.

It's not. Battle plate weighed perhaps around 45 pounds, lighter than modern combat troops' gear tends to be, and was more flexible than you likely think. As noted earlier in the thread, knights could do tumbling exercises in plate.

Being top heavy makes you very vulnerable should you mistep or lose balance.

The weight was also evenly distributed.

Then it's a simple matter of warging ants to crawl into the armor.

Obviously, historical armor was not designed with magical assaults in mind.

For nonwargs I'd say any repeatEd weapon thrust would do.

To the joints? Sure, if you can get at them. Bear in mind, the knight isn't going to just stand there and unresistingly let you do it, and he's probably going to be trying to kill you, too.

[Kittyhat]

Short of hitting a joint, I cant see an archer shooting a man in plate and Taking out of the fight, much less actualy killing him.

Either way, I think we can agree that archery of any kind is not a major threat to plate-wearing troops, aside its ability to kill their mounts.

[E-Ro]

Killing someone in plate is difficult, but possible you need to bash them repeatedly with the pommel of your sword, or create an opening that you can thrust at, wrestle them down and dirk em, or use a blunt or pole weapon. It is really fascinating to read about, its such good protection. You feel so good when wearing it, almost invincible I recomend everyone try it at some point its cool.(yes I am a nerd)

[Booknerd2]

Ok, any history buffs here?. I saw someone post boiling oil and I just had a flashback from a class I took. I had a professor tell my class that they also threw down hot sand so it could slip through the armor. I am guessing those at a higher elevation/during a seige for defense.

Any truth to this?

[Castel]

Not a history buff by any means, but isn't this why they had warhammers? To pierce plate?

[E-Ro]

Ok, any history buffs her?. I saw someone post boiling oil and I just had a flashback from a class I took. I had a professor tell my class that they also threw down hot sand so it could slip through the armor. I am guessing those at a higher elevation/during a seige for defense.

Any truth to this?

Yes, during siege witch is most of warfare, they would throw or pour things usually hot things.

[Kittyhat]

Not a history buff by any means, but isn't this why they had warhammers? To pierce plate?

Pretty much. Though more accurately, the hammers simply sent the shock of impact through the plate. The plate itself might survive more or less intact, but the man underneath is still eating that violent trauma.

An elegant and scientific solution to the problem of plate armor, really.

[E-Ro]

Not a history buff by any means, but isn't this why they had warhammers? To pierce plate?

Yes, but not everyone will carry a warhammer. Its all personal preference, remember not everyone will be wearing plate, only a small few will have Full plate.

[Brony Stark]

Not a history buff by any means, but isn't this why they had warhammers? To pierce plate?

The plate gets dented, the guy insude gets blunt force trauma

Eta: ninjad by kitty

[Mr.Blonde]

I roll my eyes whenever i read the bron vs vardis scene, such nonesense.

Which part?

[Kittyhat]

Which part?

The part where a sword blade does significant damage to plate armor. Bronn must be stronger than the Mountain!

[Castel]

The part where a sword blade does significant damage to plate armor. Bronn must be stronger than the Mountain!

I'm pretty sure Bronn struck at the juncture of armour, between the plates. *shrugs*

[Pallantides]

At closer ranges, they can get through the outer shell (the plate itself), but only just. At least according to this test:

Of course, that's not enough penetration to lead to any actual damage, but it does seem to show that at that point, we've reached the outer limits of defensive capability for a practical plate armor breastplate. So penetration that could injure or kill isn't far away, and it might even be possible with a longbow in the right archer's hands at close enough range (or else for a crossbow with a heavy enough draw weight).

The problem, though, is that even then, that makes archery of any kind only barely effective against plate ... at best. And it wasn't as though the knights were just standing there doing nothing (except at Agincourt, where they were busy slogging through/drowning in the deep mud).

Other point to take special note of, is that even if you were able to kill the guy charging at you at that distance, there's no guarantee your fellow troops could kill the other riders behind that guy, and they've already trampled you poor sods, and stuck you with their lances.

[E-Ro]

Which part?

The whole scene from vardis using a sheild, him becoming tired as if the plate weighed 100 pounds, and bron slashing the plate to pieces.

[Mr.Blonde]

I'm pretty sure Bronn struck at the juncture of armour, between the plates. *shrugs*

Indeed. If I recall correctly Bronn's blade caught ser Vardis in the elbow once, and the other significant damage was to the roundel that protected his armpit. Other than that the only damage to Vardis' armor was aestethic. Scratches, a decorative falcon wing etc.

[Ser Lepus]

Several methods:

1.-Charge with a heavy lance and you will be able to penetraty many pieces of armor (probably not the breastplate, but everything else is possible; not all the pieces were equally thick).

2.-An arbalest bolt at close distance, or a longbow arrow at very close distance.

3.-Make the knight fall from his horse with a guisarme or polehook, immobilize him before he stands up, and stab him through one of the weak points of the armor (armpit, face or crotch).

4.-Maul him with a warhammer, poleaxe, polehammer, halberd, greatsword, mace or flail until he falls, immobilize him before he stands up, and stab him through one of the weak points of the armor (armpit, face or crotch).

5.-Bull rush him, make him fall, immobilize him before he stands up, and stab him through one of the weak points of the armor (armpit, face or crotch).

6.-Wrestle him, make him fall, immobilize him before he stands up, and stab him through one of the weak points of the armor (armpit, face or crotch).

7.-Cut his fingers or break his wrists or hands with your sword or axe, immobilize and stab him through one of the weak points of the armor (armpit, face or crotch).

8.-Use a piercing weapon like a bastard sword (half-swording) or estoc to stab him through one of the weak points, like the armpit.

9.-Use one of the weapons actually able to break steel plates if you hit it enough times and hard enough, like a bec de corbin or a horseman´s pick.

10.-Drown him, set him on fire, spill boiling oil, burning lime, burning pitch, red hot sand, cinders...etc., on him, throw him from a high place, throw great rocks on him...etc.

[Pallantides]

Ok, any history buffs here?. I saw someone post boiling oil and I just had a flashback from a class I took. I had a professor tell my class that they also threw down hot sand so it could slip through the armor. I am guessing those at a higher elevation/during a seige for defense.

Any truth to this?

Generally it would've been boiling water rather than oil. Oil was a precious commodity at the time, and boiling it and pouring it on attackers would've been a waste. Not to mention that it could be used as a food, which was something that defenders did not have a lot of. It also depends on the area one would be in as well. You likely would not see boiling water used in an area where water was scarce (like in the middle east). Sometimes they used caustics (lye, lime, etc.) And they knew of how to make a mixture that was composed of hydrochloric and nitric acid known as "Aqua regia" in the 14th century.

Though that's not to say that oil wasn't used, it simply was far more common to see hot sand, water, pitch, and caustic agents and also things like rocks and other heavy things.

[Pallantides]

The whole scene from vardis using a sheild, him becoming tired as if the plate weighed 100 pounds, and bron slashing the plate to pieces.

To be fair to Vardis, he was apparently fairly aged, not in the best of shape, was given a heavier shield than normal, and was also using a likely overweight ceremonial blade. He probably was more likely exhausted from his armour not fitting him properly, and perhaps not having worn it for some time and therefore ended up not being as used to the weight as he should have been (as light as plate is, and easy it is to move in, it does add a fairly substantial amount of weight to your body, so if you're not used to it, it can easily wear you out. It doesn't help that he was swinging wildly with that sword, further causing problems).

[Ser Lepus]

Generally it would've been boiling water rather than oil. Oil was a precious commodity at the time, and boiling it and pouring it on attackers would've been a waste. Not to mention that it could be used as a food, which was something that defenders did not have a lot of. It also depends on the area one would be in as well. You likely would not see boiling water used in an area where water was scarce (like in the middle east). Sometimes they used caustics (lye, lime, etc.) And they knew of how to make a mixture that was composed of hydrochloric and nitric acid known as "Aqua regia" in the 14th century.

Though that's not to say that oil wasn't used, it simply was far more common to see hot sand, water, pitch, and caustic agents and also things like rocks and other heavy things.

Yes, oil was probably used only in a few places and times. You have to take into account that in some places, like Italy and Spain, the peasants sometimes used olive oil to pay their feudal taxes, so, if the castle was under siege, there was a few weak points in the wall that were critical for the defense, and the lord had a few tons of oil, he could feel tempted to use it.