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Winter's Breath

when the sun rises in the west and sets in the east...

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Jon Snow and Daenerys? I mean come on. So many things wrong with that. First, we don't know if Jon is alive. Second, if he is, he's at the wall while Daenerys mostly cares about King's Landing and the South. The farthest North I think Daenerys will go is Winterfell. Third, With Price Aegon alive and doing quite well, that seems like the best oprion for Daenerys marriage wise. That is, if she can get to Westeros before winter makes it completely impossible.

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Jon Snow must get with Dany, because the blue rose in a wall of ice prophecy is the cornerstone of R+L=J. And people want R+L=J to be true.

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I have another candidate for the Mountain blowing in the wind - Frankengregor. Set his zombie ass on fire, and there will be airborne ashes of a Mountain.

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Jon Snow must get with Dany, because the blue rose in a wall of ice prophecy is the cornerstone of R+L=J. And people want R+L=J to be true.

Not me, i don't want R=L=J to be true.

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When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east- Quentin.

When the seas go dry- the Dothraki sea was described as drying up in Dany's last chapter in ADWD.

And mountains blow in the wind like leaves- I am not sure. Someone suggested that the dragons destroying the pyramids is this part's equivalent.

When your womb quickens again- at the last Dany chapter she gets a period, which is totally unnecessary unless it is.

And you bear a living child- I don't know. Her dragons? All the slaves calling her mother? Something else?

Then he will return, and not before- Khal Jhaqo suddenly appears (again, last Dany chapter in ADWD)

Whether or not this is true, I don't think we will know. It could just be a nice background plot element...

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All these prophecies make some sort of sense except the Mormont one. IMO Dany will have another child with another man THEN fall in love with him and he becomes her Sun-and-Stars.

What Mormon prophesy?

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When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east- Quentin.

When the seas go dry- the Dothraki sea was described as drying up in Dany's last chapter in ADWD.

And mountains blow in the wind like leaves- I am not sure. Someone suggested that the dragons destroying the pyramids is this part's equivalent.

When your womb quickens again- at the last Dany chapter she gets a period, which is totally unnecessary unless it is.

And you bear a living child- I don't know. Her dragons? All the slaves calling her mother? Something else?

Then he will return, and not before- Khal Jhaqo suddenly appears (again, last Dany chapter in ADWD)

Whether or not this is true, I don't think we will know. It could just be a nice background plot element...

She has been having her period throughout the books. In the last chapter, she cannot remember exactly when she has had her last - two or three months before or something similar. I think she had an abortion in that chapter, induced by starving or poisonous berries and bad nutrition in general. That implies she can get pregnant (though it is no proof that she can bear a living child).

I think it is true, and very important, not just a background element. I am not entirely sold on any of the "Drogo has returned" theories, really, but something must happen to definitely fulfil that part too.

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She has been having her period throughout the books. In the last chapter, she cannot remember exactly when she has had her last - two or three months before or something similar. I think she had an abortion in that chapter, induced by starving or poisonous berries and bad nutrition in general. That implies she can get pregnant (though it is no proof that she can bear a living child).

I think it is true, and very important, not just a background element. I am not entirely sold on any of the "Drogo has returned" theories, really, but something must happen to definitely fulfil that part too.

You mean miscarriage. And I agree.

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You mean miscarriage. And I agree.

Eh, English not being my first language, what is the difference? That an abortion is willingly induced and miscarriage not?

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Eh, English not being my first language, what is the difference? That an abortion is willingly induced and miscarriage not?

Yes, pretty much.

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Women have abortions willingly. Miscarriages happen naturally. A miscarriage is your body aborting the baby. But saying dany is having an abortion is like sayng she is willingly trying to kill her baby. She may be preggers or miscarriging. I don't think that prophecy by MMD has played out yet. Interesting ideas if they have. But I think it would be a little more obvious. Pyramids can be termed as mountainlike...in mayan culture building the pyramid was a replica of mountains. And she does say winter is affecting the dothraki sea. I have to disagree with quentyn too. Cause he didn't real rise up in the west. But I guess he was raised there.

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Sorry to be pedantic but you're both right. Medically a miscarriage is called a 'spontaneous abortion', most doctors don't use that language though because of the negative connotations.

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In AGOT, Mirri Maz Duur tells Dany, "When the sun rises in the west and sets in the east, when the seas go dry and mountains blow in the wind like leaves, when your womb quickens again, and you bear a living child. Then he will return, and not before." I thought this was just a cool way of saying never, until Dance. Quentyn, the sun's son, comes from the west and dies in the east. This could be for filling the first part of Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy, which means the other parts will also come to pass. I bet the seas going dry will be when the narrow sea freezes during the long winter, and the mountains blowing away will happen when there is a large volcanic eruption, in Ashai, Valaria, or Hardhome. She could then fall in love with anyone and have a baby.

There are a couple of interpretations on what would happen next. Some think that she will die giving birth and then join Kaul Drogo in the nightlands. But I think she will find him in a dream, like Jon Snow keeps finding Ygritte. In the dream he will help her make a decision about something huge, that will effect the end of everything.

Did anyone else think Mirri Maz Duur's prophecy will come true?

I like this very much. I've never though about the prophecy in this point of view. I like it.

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I wonder if that isn't the point. That people can interpret anything they want...the quatrains of Nostradamus a good example. Maybe it wasn't meant to be a prophecy or a curse, but because some events can be interpreted in that light...it's becoming a curse.

Does that make any sense? Kind of the idea of a self-fulfilling prophecy. It wasn't true until someone believed it was true.

That's why the best prophecies are the ones that can and have numerous meanings, because sooner or later they 'fit' exactly into something that has already happened. Granted, ASOIAF prophecies are less random than most, but still leave a great deal of room for interpretation. If there is any room for doubt whether Drogon is sufficiently simmilar to Drogo and the series ends - we will have to concede that this was the result of this 'prophecy'.

Dismissing the oddly specific words of a shadowbinder as 'mere rambling' seems like overconfidence, especially since we already have elements that nicely 'fit' it's wording. The Dothraki reapperance in the story is a strong signpost suggesting 'Big reveal ahead'.

Be it a reincarnated-as-Rhaego/Drogon spirit of Drogo, or his exact Dothraki clone ; )

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So much of what goes on in this series is subject to so much interpretation, which is precisely why Melisandre has no idea what she's doing.

This could very well be another prophecy.

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All these prophecies make some sort of sense except the Mormont one. IMO Dany will have another child with another man THEN fall in love with him and he becomes her Sun-and-Stars.

Mayhaps Victarion? She'll probably hate him at first.

I really can't picture Dany falling in love with anyone besides her sun and stars. She clearly hasn't gotten over him even when she takes other lovers. Drogo's name is mentioned with love in her narrative up until the latest book.

I agree that Dany will probably never be happy with Jorah, especially with his betrayal and treating her like a child. She tried to imagine herself with Jorah, but his face kept changing to Drogo's. I really don't like how he had her eyes on her while Drogo was living and how he thinks Dany looks like his ex-wife Lynesse.

Victarion? He only wants her for the conquest and the dragons. It won't be true love. He'd take the dragons, then kill her if she even so mentions her dearly departed khal. NO! NO! This woman has suffered enough. Worst possible ending for me.

If she has another man's child, she'd have to wait nine more months to see the prophecy come true. You know what happened last time she set off to Westeros while pregnant. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that she arrives in Westeros in tWoW. This story is dragging so much. If the 'prophecy should come to pass', let's hope the birth of the dragons count as her living sons (or for some miraculous twist that Rhaego is alive).

Drogo returns? Reincarnation perhaps? Any child Dany would have would have his soul?

You have to wonder why the Targaryens had dragon's blood in the first place. Are you speaking of bestiality? The problem I have with the reincarnation theory is concerning whose spirit lives in Rhaegal and Viserion. That's all. I would rather the real Drogo return in dragon form than have a replacement sun and stars.

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Hi all,

I'm a new poster and somewhat hesitant about posting a theory but here goes.

Concerning the sun rising in the west and setting in the east I take this from Tyrion's voyage from Volantis in ADwD on page 489

"Quote"

"What hour is this?" he asked Moqorro. "That cannot be the sunrise unless the east has moved. Why is the sky red?"

"The sky is always red above Valyria, Hugor Hill."

As Tyion is travelling west to east it would follow to me that when Dany finally decides to head to Westeros then she will be travelling east to west so therefore Valyria would appear rising in the west as she approaches and setting in the east as she goes past.

That's my interpretation of the first part of the profecey anyway. The rest I'm still formulating.

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