JonathanTheBold Posted May 21, 2013 Share Posted May 21, 2013 Good points.I wonder why the crow is drowned and has seaweed on it's wings. Is it foreshadowing or what?It's ment to specify balon an euron the iron islanders worship the drowned god and as part of their practices they men are drowned and restructured by a priest and I think the crow is either euron or areon damphire or them together that would explain the crown and sea weed because euron is the crow and the sea weed is areon because areon wears robes of seaweed so it could be a hybrid of the two meaning they worked together Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Man of Many Faces Posted June 26, 2013 Share Posted June 26, 2013 In AFFC, Euron told Victarion that he once had a dragon egg, but claims he randomly threw it overboard during one of his dark moods. I thought the implication was that Euron actually gave his dragon egg to the FM as payment for Balon's murder? We know dragon eggs are incredibly valuable, and we know Euron's whole scheme of conquest involves dragons (he won the Kingsmoot by basically promising he could bring dragons to the Ironborn). A dragon egg would be the perfect thing for the FM to demand from someone like Euron, not just because of an egg's intrinsic value, but because of what Euron would be "giving up"---the FM probably thought they were demanding Euron's greatest hope for conquest (since Euron logically couldn't get a dragon if he had no egg to hatch, and a Euron/Dany alliance was probably not considered a possibility, either because of Dany heading East instead of West, or even because the contract might have been sealed before Dany hatched those eggs), thus rendering the egg a price worthy of assassinating a king.Euron's story about what happened to that egg was certainly bizarre enough that if he'd been telling it to anyone but Victarion, that person would probably have called bullshit on it.That's an excellent point! I forgot that he had said he threw his dragon egg "overboard," I feel like that is a completely BS story. There is no way that someone so hellbent on power would throw something like a Dragon egg into the ocean when he also has a Dragon horn to summon them. This makes a lot of sense to me, it is an extremely powerful and priceless item that Euron would hold dear and trade for the power of killing a King and being able to take the throne for himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qixoticneurotic Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 totally crackpot. cotter pyke had balon killed and his price was what brought the iron bank to the wall. But seriously I am curious to know what the faceless man requested for their services. also could eurons drago egg by way of the iron bank be one of the eggs given to dany? is euron That clever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Pine Posted August 3, 2013 Share Posted August 3, 2013 totally crackpot. cotter pyke had balon killed and his price was what brought the iron bank to the wall. But seriously I am curious to know what the faceless man requested for their services. also could eurons drago egg by way of the iron bank be one of the eggs given to dany? is euron That clever?'a drowned crow with seaweed hanging from his wings.' I suppose a drowned crow could be a Nights Watch member from the Iron Islands, and Cotter Pyke is one that we know, but the seaweed hanging part just seems strange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qixoticneurotic Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 'a drowned crow with seaweed hanging from his wings.'I suppose a drowned crow could be a Nights Watch member from the Iron Islands, and Cotter Pyke is one that we know, but the seaweed hanging part just seems strange. "dead things in the water" could relate. im just throwing stuff at the wall Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonmag170 Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 Were any members of the night's watch in Winterfell when Theon took the castle? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Pine Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 "dead things in the water" could relate. im just throwing stuff at the wallHmm. Interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mother of The Others Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 A dragon egg would be the perfect thing for the FM to demand from someone like Euron, not just because of an egg's intrinsic value, but because of what Euron would be "giving up"---the FM probably thought they were demanding Euron's greatest hope for conquest (since Euron logically couldn't get a dragon if he had no egg Will they only contain the dragon threat by collecting eggs, or will they also seek to quicken the egg(s) and match up the hatchlings with a dragonrider of their own? (Possible explanation for why "Pate" is hanging around the Citadel. He's either on a learning mission or is waiting for specific events to happen before he strikes).Would the Faceless ever work for Euron, though? I can't imagine Ser Kindly signing off on the Balon death deal that helped Euron grab the seastone chair; that's a selfish murder not the divine justice kind of murder which the FM specialize in. So in some ways I'm tempted to cheer for the idea that Euron is a FM imposter already. But he's acting too Euron-ish still. So I think he's the original Euron. If he's still acting like him but the FM acted out of character to help him, is it possible Euron magically compelled the FM to aid his cause? Then there's this to consider, too:if Euron did commission the FM to kill Balon and had to make a significant sacrifice, what if he pledged his support to R'Holler and to give up the Drowned God? This probably means that he is intending to kill Damphair. And when the true Greyjoy line remains true to the Drowned god, It's gratitude will manifest in the form of a kraken that smashes Euron's fleet. (Kraken, Please?) Why would the FM want to pimp R'hllor to foreigners, though? That's not their god, baby. Well, only in the sense they honor all gods. But they don't seem to prosetylize any specific religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Knight of Grey Garden Posted August 5, 2013 Share Posted August 5, 2013 Thanks great post OP, I also think the price was the dragon egg, this seems highly priced item and my guess is that it was Euron dearest thing in the world, since he seems to like the idea of being a dragon king (want to marry Daenarys, the dragon horn).I think there's two possibilities with the drowned crow with seaweb reference :1) It's only a way to be talk about Euron and not confusing him with the Night watch mens2) Could describe the way Euron got his dragon egg, by sailing to Valyria, sinking his ship and drowning just to be saved in a similar fashion than Davos or Aeron did and finding the dragon egg somewhere after waking up (Maybe he's a the Drowned god champions too if that's the case, that would make Aeron so frustated).I also think there is something with the Faceless Mens and Dragons, my guess at the moment is that they have been hired by the Citadel at a ridiculous price to kill all the dragons for eternity... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capo51 Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 It's worth mentioning another theory on here that Euron has been forced (or at least manipulated) to go towards Daenerys by the warlocks to get revenge on her for the incident at the House of Undying. A more far-fetched version of this theory, imo, in that "Euron" is actually a warlock in disguise (his lips are blue from shade of the evening, but this can obviously be explained away otherwise.) I wonder if there's any way these two theories could be correct.Here's the link to the warlock conspiracy: http://asoiaf.wester...cks-have-euron/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aethermancer Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 I think you are all missing the reference to the crow. Remember the scene where Euron is wearing his cape (and nothing else) and speaking with Victarion about his plans? Remember the dream he spoke of?“When I was a boy, I dreamt that I could fly,” he announced. “When I woke, I couldn’t... or so the maester said. But what if he lied?”Victarion could smell the sea through the open window, though the room stank of wine and blood and sex. The cold salt air helped to clear his head. “What do you mean?”Euron turned to face him, his bruised blue lips curled in a half smile. “Perhaps we can fly. All of us. How will we ever know unless we leap from some tall tower?” The wind came gusting through the window and stirred his sable cloak. There was something obscene and disturbing about his nakedness. “No man ever truly knows what he can do unless he dares to leap.”Doesn't that sound awfully familiar to another dream in this story? One involving a certain three-eyed crow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon of the Dead Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 I'm 99% sold on this theory, but a couple of things keep bugging me:1. If GRRM wanted the crow to represent Euron, why not go with something a bit more specific, like "a one-eyed crow" or something like that? The words "drowned" and "seaweed hanging from its winds" are iconic symbols of the Damphair2. Like someone mentioned already, Euron arriving so soon after Balon's death is suspicious, because Euron is supposed to be more cunning than that and because it's seems a bit too convenient and obvious, and GRRM is way more subtle than thatI've wondered IF maybe the Damphair hired the FM but was planning to frame Euron, or viceversa, but I don't see any motives for Aeron to want Balon dead or any way in which Euron has tried to blame Aeron. Unless there was some shady in-fight going on with the Greyjoy bros and maybe that's among the "messed up" stuff GRRM mentioned in the Aeron chapter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arya kiddin' Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 I've wondered IF maybe the Damphair hired the FM but was planning to frame Euron, or viceversa, but I don't see any motives for Aeron to want Balon dead or any way in which Euron has tried to blame Aeron. Unless there was some shady in-fight going on with the Greyjoy bros and maybe that's among the "messed up" stuff GRRM mentioned in the Aeron chapterVery nice. One reason I can think of why Damphair may want Balon dead is because he chose Asha as his heir. Aeron would not have approved of a woman ruling the ironborn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orbulas B. Harding Posted September 24, 2013 Share Posted September 24, 2013 Perhaps picking up the egg and throughing it back in the water is a metaphor: He had one but only long enough to take it to the faceless men so they'd throw his brother in to the sea, transitively dropping the egg in to the ocean Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nymeria Stone Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 This time, I mean to clarify another often brought up theory. This one states that King Balon Greyjoy was murdered by a faceless man, hired by his brother Euron Greyjoy. Well, the problem is that I don't think really see Euron running to hire a murder. After all, he is an ironborn and we would assume he is as arrogant as one. I don't think he would hire a faceless man, or have the money to pay for one. Neither I believe that the kindly old man would really work for Euron, even for a lot of money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon of the Dead Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 Very nice. One reason I can think of why Damphair may want Balon dead is because he chose Asha as his heir. Aeron would not have approved of a woman ruling the ironborn. Oh, yes, that makes excellent sense! The Damphair was pissed at Asha being heir. And didn't he think at least once that Balon was wrong by treating Asha like a man and all that? And actually, if it hadn't been for Euron's sudden arrival, the Damphair and Victarion might've succeded in ruling the Isles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jevans Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 I've had a look through some (not all) responses, and most seem to think it too risky for Euron to return so soon. One day after the king's death? Really? Wouldn't that be so up Euron's alley? He strikes me as very cocky. I think he'd get a thrill out of ordering the assassination of his brother, then promptly strolling back to Pyke and claiming the crown. He'd probably be laughing as he sat down on the Seastone Chair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon of the Dead Posted October 8, 2013 Share Posted October 8, 2013 I've had a look through some (not all) responses, and most seem to think it too risky for Euron to return so soon. One day after the king's death? Really? Wouldn't that be so up Euron's alley? He strikes me as very cocky. I think he'd get a thrill out of ordering the assassination of his brother, then promptly strolling back to Pyke and claiming the crown. He'd probably be laughing as he sat down on the Seastone Chair. Yes, but he's also supposed to be very cunning and coming so soon makes him look as an obvious suspect of Balon's death. And in the Isles, kinslaying is a big deal (that's what stops Victarion from tearing Euron to shreds), so Euron wouldn't gain a lot of respect for being his brother's killer But then again, most Ironborn are idiots and they still think Balon simply fell from the bridge, nothing more, so I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maestor Tarly Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 If Euron did hire a faceless man to kill Balon as the dream prophecy seems to indicate, what would the price be? This seems to be troubling everyone on here because Euron values himself and power the most so wouldn't the faceless men make him pay with:1)his life; which he has not as he is alive2)his power; which is possible if the faceless men conspired to kill Balon, and crown Euron in order to rule in secrecy through him and that's why he is seeking out Dany and her dragons However after reading everyone's posts another possibility has come to mind. Maybe he didn't have to pay any price at all, maybe he saved a faceless man's life and is thus owed a debt from the many faced god. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerys Ahai Reborn Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 If anyone has any doubts that Balon was at least killed (you think it was an accident), then look in the appendix for AFfC or ADwD:{Balon} ... killed in a fallAnd as we know, GRRM has the appendices tell us what is pretty damn obvious for the readers (so has Jon as Ned's bastard when really not, because it isn't pretty damn obvious for most readers) at the start of each book. And at the start of AFfC, what do we only already have? The prophesy. No Greyjoy family interactions or thoughts. We only have the prophesy. Not sure where I was going with that, but yeah, it should remove any doubts that Balon was killed and that the prophesy is of his death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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