Theon's fate

[bemused]

Other collective nouns for rooks are a clamour , a building , a storytelling ( they seem to have a lot ). I've most often seen parliament used for owls . It's a murder of crows , but they and ravens both corvids , so what the heck...

[grillmeister]

Are we that sure that Theon is going to die soon? Remember, everyone hates him and wants him dead for a crime he didn't commit. If Davos finds Rickon or Bran finds some way to communicate with someone then Theon might be in the clear.

Didn't commit? I hold Theon responsible for the fall of Robb Stark. Remember, Roose Bolton joined forces with Lannister once he learned Stark had lost winterfell. Then followed The Red Wedding.

[Although Bolton might have planned this, in case he should turn up on the losing side, even earlier when he planted Ramsay or Reek1 at Winterfell before marching south. And: is Ramsay and Reek1 the same person? I need to re-read to confirm.]

[Lord Yarwyck]

Didn't commit? I hold Theon responsible for the fall of Robb Stark. Remember, Roose Bolton joined forces with Lannister once he learned Stark had lost winterfell. Then followed The Red Wedding.

[Although Bolton might have planned this, in case he should turn up on the losing side, even earlier when he planted Ramsay or Reek1 at Winterfell before marching south. And: is Ramsay and Reek1 the same person? I need to re-read to confirm.]

Also, he did commit the crime of the murder of two children (plus numerous rapes and other murders carried out either by him personally or men under his command). They weren't the children everyone believes them to be, but he is still a child murderer and a war criminal. His personal journey is relevant to us but no-one else - yeah, he's cinders. Or at least should be.

[grillmeister]

In another tread I posted this theory:

After reading the Theon chapter from TWoW we now know that Stannis holds the turncloak. To Stannis' advantage Theon know Winterfell better than most presently in the north, and any possible weaknesses. And when the Prince of 'Winterfell was surrounded in ACOK, maester Luwin urged Turncloak to take the black and explained there are secret ways of escape. We do not know if he know any of these, but I know Stannis as a patient man. If given the time, he will find one secret tunnel and take the castle from inside wich will be much easier than storming it, and probably also than starving it.

Alternatively, he can let Ramsay have his Reek back, and if Reek still enjoys the freedom of the castle, he can find the exit from within the castle and then lead Stannis' host back in. This is probably easier than searching from outside, but depends on that Reek not being punished for escaping. My bet is on the crypts, although Bran and Rickon did not escape this way.

Anyway, I don't see the Theon chapters being concluded yet, as Stannis might have use for him.

As to kingsblood, Asha also posess this.

[Big Daddy Dave]

Good point.

It would be quite a twist if everyone expected Theon to be burned, and it ends up being Asha while Theon lives a bit longer. She could be burned in his place for trying to save him and/or trying to escape with him. It seems to me Asha's story is at a bit of a dead end, while Theon still has gas in the tank of his.

[ihatebrienne]

I honestly believe the next of his days will be depend entirely on Bran's decisions and what he wants Theon to do. Theon as we all have seen is a pretty fucked up guy right now, and the fact that the Old Gods are speaking to him (Bran actually) will probably mean to him a way to redeem himself with all the things he did to the North and to the Starks, specially betraying Robb. Just can't think of any other future role for Theon in the books.

If he lives or dies through the entire saga I don't know, but I 'feel' he will survive.

[Nubaa]

[Although Bolton might have planned this, in case he should turn up on the losing side, even earlier when he planted Ramsay or Reek1 at Winterfell before marching south. And: is Ramsay and Reek1 the same person? I need to re-read to confirm.]

Reek1 and Ramsay are separate people, for a time everyone believed Ramsay had been killed but that was because he switched places with Reek1 (reek1 was the one killed) and that's why he was still pretending to be Reek1 when Theon showed up to take Winterfell. I don't think he was planted necessarily, IIRC he was captured by Rodrik from that mess with Lady Hornwood eating her fingers.

[Black Maester Sam]

He was captured, while hunting and raping some girl with Reek1. From the last Theon chapter:

“The girl’s fault. If she had not run so far, his horse would not have lamed, and we might have been able to flee. I gave him mine when I saw the riders from the ridge. I was done with her by then, and he liked to take his turn while they were still warm. I had to pull him off her and shove my clothes into his hands-calfskin boots and velvet doublet, silver-chased swordbelt, even my sable cloak. Ride for the Dreadfort, I told him, bring all the help you can. Take my horse, he’s swifter, and here, wear the ring my father gave me, so they’ll know you came from me. He’d learned better than to question me. By the time they put that arrow through his back, I’d smeared myself with the girl’s filth and dressed in his rags. They might have hanged me anyway, but it was the only chance I saw.”

[The Red Hand]

Also, he did commit the crime of the murder of two children (plus numerous rapes and other murders carried out either by him personally or men under his command). They weren't the children everyone believes them to be, but he is still a child murderer and a war criminal. His personal journey is relevant to us but no-one else - yeah, he's cinders. Or at least should be.

I thought Jojen's vision proved Reek/Ramsay did it. He allowed the murder of children and men under him because he saw no other way out, and we see in his POV how regretful and conflicted he is about his choices. I'm not saying hes innocent, just that compared to say Cersei hes not that bad. And to the post you quoted Robb's fall is more the fault of Roose, Walder, and Tywin than anyone else.

[Budj]

I think Theon is toast. Asha is urging a beheading at the heart tree (to appease the North) as a mercy to Theon. That is much better than being burned alive. His 'kingsblood' will be used somehow...Asha is the POV at Stannis' camp. No more need for Theon...and personally I prefer that. I liked his story arc, but what he is now does not make for good reading now that he is out of Ramsay's grasp. He is broken.

[mrlukeduke]

I think Theon will be kept by Stannis to be given back to Jon. If Jon lives, maybe he'll execute Theon at Winterfell – in front of as many northmen houses as possible – to try to reunite a broken North. Then perhaps he'll finally accept "guardianship" over Winterfell with Stannis' bastard-pardon, at least until Rickon returns.

[alienarea]

I wonder whether Theon would accept to be warged by Bran?

[Usurper's Dog]

I thought Jojen's vision proved Reek/Ramsay did it. He allowed the murder of children and men under him because he saw no other way out, and we see in his POV how regretful and conflicted he is about his choices. I'm not saying hes innocent, just that compared to say Cersei hes not that bad. And to the post you quoted Robb's fall is more the fault of Roose, Walder, and Tywin than anyone else.

Sure, maybe he's not quite as bad consiering he did express a lot of regret afterwards. But regardless of what we see through Theon's POV chapters, he still is responsible for the murder (and skinning) of two Northern children - smallfolk or not. Theon is done for, but not until he gets the opportunity to redeem himself in one epic moment. Bran/Bloodraven will have something to do with said moment - the question is what?

[The Red Hand]

Sure, maybe he's not quite as bad consiering he did express a lot of regret afterwards. But regardless of what we see through Theon's POV chapters, he still is responsible for the murder (and skinning) of two Northern children - smallfolk or not. Theon is done for, but not until he gets the opportunity to redeem himself in one epic moment. Bran/Bloodraven will have something to do with said moment - the question is what?

Jaime tried to kill Bran and he lost his hand, Sandor killed Mycah and nearly died from his wounds, Theon did worse than that and he went through an even worse ordeal. I'm not saying that hes been through enough, just that I don't think his story is over quite yet.

[Babeldygob]

I wonder whether Theon would accept to be warged by Bran?

Interesting question. I think he would, he's already meek and he's kind off been groomed for that by Ramsay. Bran could speak through Theon.

[The Red Hand]

Interesting question. I think he would, he's already meek and he's kind off been groomed for that by Ramsay. Bran could speak through Theon.

I don't like this idea, I think Bran was talking through the tree to make Theon remember who he was before Reek. Why do all that just to force your way into his being and make him do what you want? Still, might happen.

[aryagonnakill]

Yes I agree, I don't believe theon will not make it to rule the ironborn. I don't see why george put so much emphasis on only the strong can rule the ironborn, and thats why asha wasn't raised a queen. And she is one tough bitch. Theon is maimed and weak the ironborn won't rise up against euron to go to their doom at theon's hand. Asha could do a great job at ruling through theon's name. I'm doubtful about that but it wouldn't shock me for george to have theon make it through the series. I just don't see how he could hope to rule after being so tormented by the bastard of bolton.

Also agree that something needs to happen at the weirwood or that was a waste of time it is in asha's personality to want to save theon more torment, after witnessing the poor foot soldiers that burned for cannabilism.

But what if Theon is the one to kill Ramsey? No one can really say what would be going on in Theon's mind were it real life, and its up to GRRM what's going on in Theon's mind in ASOIAF. And if a bullied highschooler kill his tormentor he turns into a serial killer, not afraid of anyone.(sometimes) tho that is a fact

[The Red Hand]

But what if Theon is the one to kill Ramsey? No one can really say what would be going on in Theon's mind were it real life, and its up to GRRM what's going on in Theon's mind in ASOIAF. And if a bullied highschooler kill his tormentor he turns into a serial killer, not afraid of anyone.(sometimes) tho that is a fact

:agree:

Theon's biggest problems before being captured by Ramsey were his arrogance and insecurity. It happens all throughout the story, characters go through tough shit, pull themselves up and keep trudging ahead. My theory is that Ramsay will die(hopefully by Theon's hand) and through his tormentors death Theon's emotional and spiritual journey will be complete.

[Where Boars Glow]

In another tread I posted this theory:

After reading the Theon chapter from TWoW we now know that Stannis holds the turncloak. To Stannis' advantage Theon know Winterfell better than most presently in the north, and any possible weaknesses. And when the Prince of 'Winterfell was surrounded in ACOK, maester Luwin urged Turncloak to take the black and explained there are secret ways of escape. We do not know if he know any of these, but I know Stannis as a patient man. If given the time, he will find one secret tunnel and take the castle from inside wich will be much easier than storming it, and probably also than starving it.

Alternatively, he can let Ramsay have his Reek back, and if Reek still enjoys the freedom of the castle, he can find the exit from within the castle and then lead Stannis' host back in. This is probably easier than searching from outside, but depends on that Reek not being punished for escaping. My bet is on the crypts, although Bran and Rickon did not escape this way.

Anyway, I don't see the Theon chapters being concluded yet, as Stannis might have use for him.

As to kingsblood, Asha also posess this.

Although Asha is more valuable to marry to one of his lords for a claim to the Iron islands.

[wolfmaid7]

I think Theon is toast. Asha is urging a beheading at the heart tree (to appease the North) as a mercy to Theon. That is much better than being burned alive. His 'kingsblood' will be used somehow...Asha is the POV at Stannis' camp. No more need for Theon...and personally I prefer that. I liked his story arc, but what he is now does not make for good reading now that he is out of Ramsay's grasp. He is broken.

I agree with you Budj......Theon will prove his usefulness to Bran and BR in someway to help Jon. Also, Theon before this crap happened was a virile individual.He is utterly broken; no teeth,no dick and no fingers. I would not want to live after that..send my ass to the downed god.