[Book Spoilers] House of the Undying

[erolyn]

I really could have forgiven everything else if they'd just thrown in that one ten-second line:

"Three betrayals you will know..."

[ViennaGirl]

I haven't gone back and re-watched the episode yet, but I thought snow/Snow in the throne room was kind of a huge hint, as was Dany going beyond the Wall. I've had moments where I thought Dany's arc was going to be - rightful queen hangs out in the south, frees slaves, decides she's actually more at home there, stays and rules in the south, recognizes that sometimes you don't get what you think you deserve, but you can do great things anyway. That doesn't fit the fantasy trope of Gorgeous Sexy Dragon Queen Saves Westeros, which is fine by me.

I think snow in the throne room means Snow in the throne room. Not sure how I feel about that. Jon is my favorite character, but I don't want to see him abandon his vows (and yeah, maybe he's "dead" and is released). I'd rather see him as king in the north if he has to leave the NW.

I guess maybe I'd interpret Dany finding Drogo beyond the Wall means she'll find love? Or death? I'm not a Jon/Dany shipper, so I hope it's not love, unless maybe with Dolorous Edd.

[ARYa_Nym]

I took from the Dany/Drogo scene that theories are correct and Drogo will return to Dany in the afterlife. She will have to die to see him again.

[PuckTFD]

In my opinion, the House of the Undying scene was pretty great. Once you set aside your prejudice from having read the book scene and stop tearing your hair out for it being different, you can realize this. There weren't any prophecies, sure, but there was still heavy foreshadowing. I mean, the Red Keep being burned by Fire and it, and the Iron Throne, being covered in Snow, as well as a trip to the Wall? Fantastic. And really, a blue rose wouldn't mean anything on the show. No blue roses showed up in the first season, and without Ned Stark's inner dialogues from the first book, there haven't been any hints at R+L=J. It'd be a good nod to the readers, but it's unnecessary. I'm sure the writers have something planned for R+L=J, if it's actually true, and I also bet they'll add in the prophecies at some point. They went to the trouble of establishing Quaithe as a mysterious and prophetic character, so I'm guessing she's going to show up again and might dispense out some prophecies.

Also, the Khal Drogo scene was more potent in the series than a Rhaegar + Ellia scene would have been. First of all, they'd have had to get two actors for them and drain the limited budget a bit more. And they would've actually had to explain who Rhaegar and Ellia were for those who didn't read the book, only to lead up to, what? "His is the Song of Ice and Fire."? It wouldn't even be a title drop, since the series is called A Game of Thrones. I talked to someone who doesn't read the books who watches and she absolutely loved seeing Drogo again, especially with an utterly adorable Rhaego. The scene was fantastic and just the kind of emotional and character/acting-driven scene that works in a television series like this. It conveyed Dany's whole "If I look back I am lost." attitude perfectly and showed off Jason Momoa's acting skills once more.

[Samalander]

Did the snow in the throne room represent Jon Snow becoming king? Or was it ashes?

First time I saw it, I thought it was ashes. On rewatch, It was probably snow. That looks like ashes.

A subtelty that the showrunners probably did not intend, but that gives the whole thing quite a deep double-meaning.

Basically, blue rose = Lyanna Stark.

The glass window in the vision was the regular symbol of the seven, with a blue center. Was the blue allusion intended?

[dreamcatcher]

The thing that worries me the most about Jon Snow becoming a king (of which we are getting more and more clues), is Kit Harington's ability to play one. I really, really hope there's more to Kit than his tortured eyes (and I love Jon to bits), like, being all self-confident and shit.

[insertname]

Meh, I don't trust D&D enough to actually take hints for books 6&7. Yeah, they might have hinted to Jon on the throne...but they also might just have hinted to "winter is coming", or a bunch of other possibilites. I'd rather read too few than too much into this.

[Lord Roivas]

I have to admit I didn't have too much of a problem with the HOTU scene.

The only thing I would have changed was when Dany walks up to the throne and seemingly touches it, that's where they should have had her pick up the blue flower.

I suppose I'm in the minority here but with them showing the Throne room in snow and ruins I took that as them showing what the next long night would look like, when the others bring the war to the south. Especially considering after this is the scene where Sam sees the undead army.

[Direwolf Lager]

starting with the good points: enjoyed the scene of the throne room in King's Landing but wish they would'v. e shown a better view of Daenerys looking/touching the iron throne, the dragonfire was badass

bad points: mushy/cheesy khal drogo scene, no rhaegar playing his harp and speaking of the prince that was promised, no prophecies (3 heads of the dragon, betrayal for gold, love and etc.)

i understand it has to be made so nonreaders will be able to understand it, but i feel like the prophecies are just so important to the rest of daenerys' story arc im not sure how they could just leave it out. also i hope quaithe makes her statement "to go west u must go east" bit early in 3rd season and along with the appearances of "arstan whitebeard" and strong belwas

[KC_Accidental]

I knew it would be difficult to do this scene and wasn't expecting most of the prophecies. I was however expecting at least Rhaegar and the Mad King. Very disappointed in it. Like others I'm also worried that we've seen a glimpse at something to happen in future books. As soon as Dany entered the throne room and I realised there would be no Mad King and that the place was a snowy ruin I said "oh no..." to myself. The roof has clearly been destroyed by dragons and with the snow it seems to indicate that Kings Landing has been destroyed and abandoned with winter and/or White Walkers taking over. The Drogo thing also has me thinking that he will return. BUT HOW?! I don't like this one bit.

There's also the matter of the unbelievable stupidity in Pyat Pree's plan. I kinda liked how they gave him a better reason to 'have a go' at Dany but if he got burnt to a crisp by baby dragons how did he expect to keep fully grown or even stunted growth adult dragons without a fire hazard of some sort?! Idiot.

[Prince of Braavos]

I would have preferred such info come from the author not from the TV show.

I completely see what you're saying and agree to a certain extent; I guess it's just a simple difference of opinion on how ok it is.

That being said, this is a natural consequence of a TV adaptation being made of a still-in-progress book series when the showrunners know how the series ends. If you want another example, look at the very first scene of the pilot and compare it to the book prologue. In the book, the wildlings are scattered all over the place; on TV, they're in a weird and specific layout of a circle with a line down the middle. Which is the same way all the O's in the show's logo are done. And there's a scaled-up version of the logo with THREE lines down the middle of the O's instead of one. And, if I'm not mistaken, the Valar Morghulis coin (at least the TV version, which HBOGO showed in close up as a special feature) has a line down the middle. Nothing obvious, but I'd say this all connects the larger ice-and-fire mythology, the Others, the three riders, and possibly the FM. And it has nothing to do with the books.

[Crannogwoman]

My initial reaction is anger, but I think I need to rewatch and see it for what it is. I view these episodes anticipating things that have happened in the books, and it's just so hard to keep that out when watching that I tend to nitpick over the minor and major.

But GRRM had to have given some sort of approval, right? As long as what's shown is consistent with the ending he will write, I'm a bit more accepting of it.

[boojam]

But GRRM had to have given some sort of approval, right? As long as what's shown is consistent with the ending he will write, I'm a bit more accepting of it.

Well I don't know. George wrote E9 and consulted on adaptation there.

He is listed in the credits.

Yet , as far as I know , has yet to give an interview with his observations on Season 2.

Does not talk much about it in his blog.

I get the feeling he is not as engaged this year.

[nightwisp]

I was disappointed. Probably the first time in both seasons I was disappointed. But, I agree with the emphasis on Blackwater they did not have lots of extra resources to do all the "special effects" for the House of Undying scenes. Looking forward to next season already! :)

[Sanette]

The thing that worries me the most about Jon Snow becoming a king (of which we are getting more and more clues), is Kit Harington's ability to play one. I really, really hope there's more to Kit than his tortured eyes (and I love Jon to bits), like, being all self-confident and shit.

I really don't want Jon on the throne... maybe beyond the Wall but not in the south. I'm sure Kit would be great, he plays angry Jon very well so "self-confident" shouldn't be a problem. The reason for him being all tortured and lost is because the writers are writing him like that. Jon from this season has very little in common with Book!Jon.

[WillWork4NinjaPowers]

Disliked.

[Spaßvogel]

My biggest problem with the scene is just that I never felt Dany was ever in any danger! It was just so bland. In the books, she was helpless, she was dosed with hallucinatory drugs and actually seemed lost until she started burning stuff with her dragons...and they couldn't find a way for her to emerge from the burning building with her dragons and give her a real climax, another image that will drop Jorah to his knees?

[Peasant Rebel Leader]

It was always clear to me that the book sequence was very unlikely to be seen on the show. All the ambiguity is lost if we see it through our own eyes and not through Dany describing it. Besides that it would have been quite a lot of work for them to recreate all the visions.

I think they did a good job with their budget. making the house creepy and all. It was a bit desolate and everything. But I guess that's true for the whole Qarth arc, they could've done quite a lot more (had they had more screen time...)

Although I gotta say the camera tricks were repeated a bit too often for me (After Dany walking around the tower, they do the same with Jaqen (not actually vanishing, but moving outside the camera range and then being gone)). Well...

Going back to my thoughts above, did anyone get the feeling that they could have set up a scene with Arstan/Selmy in Season 3? When she learns his real name (and I guess she will sooner, works better on tv), she can ask him about her father and oldest brother, and she can ask him about the visions in the rooms which happened between the scenes we had in this episode. Might be a good way of getting a bit of exposition rolling...

(sorry if I am repeating any point here...)

[Wolfmage]

HotU was pretty cool. I liked how they made the link between magic and the dragons such an explicit plot point. Quaithe makes such an observation about that street firemage and we know it's generally true across Westeros. So it makes total sense that Pyat Pree and the other Qarth Warlocks, having already felt their power suddenly grow manifold just by the presence of the dragons and Dany, now lust to keep her and the dragons as close as possible.

This takes something that was a background allusion in the books, (ie. the contrast from the initial dismissiveness towards the eccentric "palace of dust", and the evident powers in the HotU and other ominous lights post-HotU), and makes it explicit. Very clever.

Didn't mind the lack of prophesies, though I wasn't sure whether we were meant to think the Iron Throne and Drogo were temptations in her path or simply illusory foreshadowing. At first I thought they might be traps.

That said, I thought Dany's "Drakaris" moment was a little underwhelming in the end. Would have liked it to be a might more forceful and perhaps see the Tower itself on fire, but I guess they are saving some of that kind of drama for Astapor.

[Arya Nymeria Stark]

1. In the book, someone gave her instructions... only take the first door to the right... for a staircase, only go up, not down.

2. They didn't even say anything about Rhaegar's son, Aegon!

Honestly, I thought the scene in the book was extremely important, but they made it so unimportant in the show!