bloodymime Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 It's when Ned confronts her and she throws Ashara back at him. She wonders if Ashara killed herself because Ned killed Arthur. She knows Ned killed Arthur.Thank you, that's interesting Jaime never thinks of it given his worship of Dayne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sumpthy Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 That is true.. so I guess the real question is how much do the people in Westeros know about what happened at the Tower of Joy. Are Ned and Howland Reed (and Barristan???) the only ones? Surely Robert must have asked Ned what happened to Lyanna and the kingsguard who were there. Wouldn't others know as well?On the subject of the White Book, Jaime would know whatever Barristan wrote in there, but based on the other entries its unlikely it's more detailed than something along the lines of "Slain by Ned Stark at the Tower of Joy". I think any member of the Kingsguard is allowed to read the White Book but I'm not sure how many bother to do so. I get the impression Jaime is reading it for the first time in A Storm of Swords so I don't know how likely it is to see someone like Boros Blount or Meryn Trant reading up on the predecessors, but I suppose it's safe to say that they all could know that Ned killed Arthur Dayne. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grimwolfe Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 only ned and howland came back from the ToJ, and if they didnt tell anyone, no one would know. Not to mention with Barristan still around and kicking, all the fame of those days is on him. Dayne (to me at least) seemed more like the garlan tyrell type, superb fighter, but took no glory in what he did, so people knew he was a great warrior, but they never knew of any remarkable deeds, unlike barristan the bold who took part in a tourney when he was barely a teenager, took part in the battle of 9 penny kings, saved aerys from duskendale by himself etc. etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyryan Lannister Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Sandor Clegane's take on Lord Eddard http://youtu.be/Ir10KmgGrjUGod I love the Hound Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artos Stark Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 I got the feeling in the books that Ned was very well respected and had a great name. Some of Jaime's Pov's make it seem that way. Jaime even seemed to have respect for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 People know what happened at the ToJ but there are too many mysteries and tragedies surrounding it. No one is going to care about a boring mystery when there are thapphires in the Trident. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Last Direwolf Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 People know what happened at the ToJ but there are too many mysteries and tragedies surrounding it. No one is going to care about a boring mystery when there are thapphires in the Trident.Rubieth actually! :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QueenNymeria Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 I have wondered this myself, especially in the larger context of thinking about what actually transpired at the ToJ. Lyanna's death was part of the same event and it seems like someone, especially Robert Baratheon, would have demanded a blow-by-blow account of the incident. Ned would be hard pressed to keep it quiet. I mean, what could he have said to Dayne's family when he returned Dawn? Information is valuable in Westeros and it seems unlikely that no one would have been curious about what happened at the ToJ and how it happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khal Pono Posted June 9, 2012 Author Share Posted June 9, 2012 People know what happened at the ToJ but there are too many mysteries and tragedies surrounding it. No one is going to care about a boring mystery when there are thapphires in the Trident.LOL. Rubies, not sapphires. Get your types of corundum straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Serie Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 People know what happened at the ToJ but there are too many mysteries and tragedies surrounding it. No one is going to care about a boring mystery when there are thapphires in the Trident.I'd say that people actually don't know what happened at the ToJ, both the people of westeros and the readers. Of course there's a tone of speculation and some, including me, are pretty much convinced of certain theories, but still nothing is quite clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Blonde Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Ned's own people (mistakenly)thought he killed Arthur Dayne in single combat but Ned outright surpressed any information of the ToJ incident.Ned would not speak of the mother, not so much as a word, but a castle has no secrets, and Catelyn heard her maids repeating tales they heard from the lips of her husband’s soldiers. They whispered of Ser Arthur Dayne, the Sword of the Morning, deadliest of the seven knights of Aerys’s Kingsguard, and of how their young lord had slain him in single combat. And they told how afterward Ned had carried Ser Arthur’s sword back to the beautiful young sister who awaited him in a castle called Starfall on the shores of the Summer Sea. The Lady Ashara Dayne, tall and fair, with haunting violet eyes. It had taken her a fortnight to marshal her courage, but finally, in bed one night, Catelyn had asked her husband the truth of it, asked him to his face.That was the only time in all their years that Ned had ever frightened her. “Never ask me about Jon,” he said, cold as ice. “He is my blood, and that is all you need to know. And now I will learn where you heard that name, my lady.” She had pledged to obey; she told him; and from that day on, the whispering had stopped, and Ashara Dayne’s name was never heard in Winterfell again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Istari Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Ned respects Arthur Dayne, so I doubt he would boast about killing him (I can hardly see Ned bragging about killing anyone for that matter)Besides, the more he talks about killing AD the more questions he would be asked. I imagine - especially if R+L=J is true, then Ned does not want to draw any unwanted attention to the TOJ. This may be less convincing, but it could very well be that people don't want to credit 'the non-knight in the North' with the death of the Sword of the Morning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticWeirwood Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 I presume Ned told Robert and Barristan enough of the truth as possible without spelling out that Jon was there and why the three Kingsguard were still there.I wonder what he might have said, especially to Barristan. Any idea? Barristan certainly knew the way their vows bound them. This almost feels like a plot hole. What story would have satisfied another Kingsuard member about why his brothers did not go to “their king”, Viserys, after Aerys, Rhaegar, and Aegon were all dead?Hmm... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 My speculation is that Ned's story is that he ran across the three kingsguards on their way to Dragonstone and he defeated them so that they would not be able to reach and defend Viserys. He then detoured to Dorne in order to return Dawn and Author's bones to Starfall and leaves out any mention of the Tower of Joy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gougef Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 My speculation is that Ned's story is that he ran across the three kingsguards on their way to Dragonstone and he defeated them so that they would not be able to reach and defend Viserys. He then detoured to Dorne in order to return Dawn and Author's bones to Starfall and leaves out any mention of the Tower of Joy.Ned buried them at the ToJ with the stones from the tower itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Pepper Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Ned buried them at the ToJ with the stones from the tower itself.Lol, I realized that after I had posted but was too lazy to make an edit. Revised speculation: Ned's public story is that he ran across the Kingsguard on their way to protect and defend Viserys and he defeated them with his small force and then moved on to Dorne to return Dawn to House Dayne of Starfall and leaves out any mention of Tower of Joy. Of course, this speculation can include that his private story to House Dayne was different than the public story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrypticWeirwood Posted June 9, 2012 Share Posted June 9, 2012 Ned buried them at the Tower of Joy with the stones from the tower itself.Ser Barristan would certainly want to know the final resting places of his three brothers. I’m somewhat surprised no one ever distinterred them and gave them proper burials at the family plot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kg1982 Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 That entire scene is very hush hush, Ned never talked about what happened there so I don't think people know he and Howland were personally responsible for killing 3 KG, people probably just assume he went south with a much larger force, but it is kinda weird now that you bring it up. It's probably just an oversight by George though honestly.If the real circumstances of the battle got out, then that might lead to questions.. Such as why three Kingsguard were in the middle of Dorne guarding Lyanna rather than going to guard Viserys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 Rubieth actually! :PI know, oh, oh, oh - Rhaegar's Rubies - but I couldn't help myself :P. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Two Towers Posted June 10, 2012 Share Posted June 10, 2012 I think most people only knows that Arthur Dayne and the rest of the kingsguard (except for Barristan and Jaime) died during Robert's Rebellion without any specifics. Only Robert and his circle, Barristan included, knew whatever story Ned told them, perhaps just that the 3 kingsguards where at the TOJ holding Lyanna on Raeghar's orders (something that Robert would believe, and that would be part of the truth), and that Ned and his companions had to kill them to free her. Of course, winterfell and the North would have their own version of the rumors and so would the Daynes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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