I Need Support for This Whole Bakker Thing

[shortstark]

SPOILERS

had to delete that post because of major failure to get the spoiler black out thingy to work

[Happy Ent]

For me, the book picked up around the Battle of Kiyuth (spelling?). I am very happy I stayed with these books, the whole trilogy was an immensely satisfying read. (With some sentient trees it would have been perfect.)

[shortstark]

oh well

SPOILER: TTT

Kellhus mastering the third unutteral was a big disappointment now he is almost a god, i wanted there to be one area in which he was vulnerable in some ways, now he is on his way to being the most powerful sorceror

[Ran]

Aegern,

I thought so first, but a search of the web reveals at least three different pronunciations being used by families with the Bakker name. I always said 'Baker' myself, but when I saw that, figured I might as well check.

Thanks for clearing it up, Stego.

[Balefont]

Bakker is not for everyone; it's not accesible for those who need to be coddled.

I third Stego on this. It's not candy like Harry Potter.

[Derfel Cadarn]

Is the 3rd book out in the UK? I've looked but its not in any book shop I've checked

[Xray the Enforcer]

Aegern,

I thought so first, but a search of the web reveals at least three different pronunciations being used by families with the Bakker name. I always said 'Baker' myself, but when I saw that, figured I might as well check.

You're not the first to ask. There's a thread on it on the three-seas.com forum...

[Werthead]

Is the 3rd book out in the UK? I've looked but its not in any book shop I've checked

No. It comes out on 4th May in trade paperback. I'm guessing we then have to wait a year for the mass-market paperback.

I have the first two books in MMPB and I wanted to hold off reading them until the third one was out in that format as well. I have American Gods and then Jonathan Strange to keep me busy, but I'll probably have to rip into The Confusion and The System of the World as well to make sure I take up more time.

[Caligula_K]

Well, I'm about 100 pages in to TDTCB, and so far its been really excellent.

[Bazzlebane]

It's fantastic, and I'm surprised some boarders here didn't like it. I'd have thought most Martin fans would like it -- it's intelligent, dark, though provoking. And for those who say it's tedious -- how can you be bored by the big battles?

I think Bakker rights better big-scale battle better than just about anyone (yes - better than Martin. Many of Martin's big battles take place off-screen). After a couple pages into the first big battle in DTCB I realized I should take another breath. It floored me. Book 2 was even better; I haven't read 3 yet.

[Xray the Enforcer]

coddled my ass. its all about taste.

Well, there's that, too.

But I think that it's an acceptable take to say that Bakker's books are freakin' dense and somewhat challenging. In the same way that, say, Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrell (with all it's freakin' footnotes) is also dense and somewhat challenging. Both books are much more challenging than reading Harry Potter, or Wheel of Time, or many other standard fantasy tomes.

The taste bit comes in where you find Bakker annoyingly emo, and I can't stand JS&MN because it's unacceptably twee and self-satisfied.

[Bastress of Winterfell]

This is starting to sound quite promising. I like Tolkien and Martin so its probably great.

[Darlan Laerdon]

As a huge fan personally, I can only describe the books as pimptastic.

[Decius]

oh well

SPOILER: TTT

Kellhus mastering the third unutteral was a big disappointment now he is almost a god, i wanted there to be one area in which he was vulnerable in some ways, now he is on his way to being the most powerful sorceror

SPOILER: TTT

He still dies to a Chorae as does any other sorceror. He might be the most powerful sorceror mankind knows, but don't forget if he really rallies mankind against the Consult he is up to Mekeritrig and other nonmen and even against the two Inchoroi, who have worked the Gnosis for thousands of years. He needs every bit of power he can get.

[Jerol]

I'm reading the prologue. What is this, the Brokeback Prince:

And Kellhus, his bearded face warm with firelight and compassion, answered: “No one’s soul moves alone, Leweth. When one love dies, one must learn to love another.â€

Of course, not that there's anything wrong with that!

[ztemhead]

I've heard the same sort of crit about Gene Wolfe. Are y'all saying the styles are similar? I'm not a fan of Wolfe.

[Decius]

I'm reading the prologue. What is this, the Brokeback Prince:

And Kellhus, his bearded face warm with firelight and compassion, answered: “No one’s soul moves alone, Leweth. When one love dies, one must learn to love another.â€

Kelhus will use any way and person needed to get what he wants. This doesn't mean he is gay, as you will see soon enough.

[Mind Elemental]

I read The Darkness That Comes Before a while back (January or February) and I thought it was good, but no GRRM. My main complaint is with characterisation -- Bakker can characterise well, sure, but I have difficulty enjoying a book where most of the POVs are unsympathetic, and the remaining two (Achamian and Esmenet) weren't especially engaging. That was also symptomatic of a wider issue with Bakkerworld's feel -- it makes Westeros look like candy. AGOT may have had Ned's beheading, but it also had uplifting moments ("The King in the North!", the dragons' birth);

SPOILER: Minor TDTCB spoilers

Bakker has nothing of that ilk, and precious little mirth (along the lines of Tyrion's witticisms), either.

When I have time, I'll give TWP a look, but that won't be for a while.

And I always thought it was "Backer". Whoops.

[Werthead]

However, that one line gets lost in the hundreds of thousands of people killed throughout the two books I have read so far. I feel sure that by the third book, it will be millions.

No. It doesn't get that bad until much later

Although it should be borne in mind that in Memories of Ice:

SPOILER: MoI

there is a sequence which can only be described as 'charnel house'. Remember not to read after about page 400 having eaten any time recently.

[shortstark]

I read The Darkness That Comes Before a while back (January or February) and I thought it was good, but no GRRM. My main complaint is with characterisation -- Bakker can characterise well, sure, but I have difficulty enjoying a book where most of the POVs are unsympathetic, and the remaining two (Achamian and Esmenet) weren't especially engaging. That was also symptomatic of a wider issue with Bakkerworld's feel -- it makes Westeros look like candy. AGOT may have had Ned's beheading, but it also had uplifting moments ("The King in the North!", the dragons' birth);

SPOILER: Minor TDTCB spoilers

Bakker has nothing of that ilk, and precious little mirth (along the lines of Tyrion's witticisms), either.

When I have time, I'll give TWP a look, but that won't be for a while.

And I always thought it was "Backer". Whoops.

I disagree, while there is no one as witty as Tyrion isn Bakker's world, it is not entirely humorless, There is numerous funny exchanges between Akka and Esme, and in TWP Kellhus had the campfire roaring with laughter on numerous occasions.