Tyrion: A Clean Record (almost)

[Éadaoin]

The she knew what was expected of her line is what changes it for me.

Unpleasant yeah, but not rape.

W o w.

She's a slave. She cannot give consent. I really, sincerely hope that you do not feel this way about the sex slaves in our own world. Because Christ.

[Gannicus]

Ramsay and Gregor also torture their victims before they kill them, or kill them slowly and painfully. Does that mean that less gruesome forms of murder aren't murder? :rolleyes:

Those guys are evil, EVIL. But he was basically saying some rape is worse than others.

[Gannicus]

The she knew what was expected of her line is what changes it for me.

Unpleasant yeah, but not rape.

But the whip marks on her back shows what happens when she fights.

To be fair I don't think Tyrion saw her back until after he had already fucked her. I don't think it really crossed his mind that this girl was any different than a Westerosi whore. After he saw her back he felt guilty I think.

[Winter's Knight]

Damn it people have taken the bait and this tread is on the verge of becoming a rape definition discussion.

Whether it's labeled as rape or not makes no difference. Tyrion wouldn't consider it rape, nor would the rest of Westeros/Essos, or Joer Mormont for that matter. But for us it is. On the other hand what Tyrion did at the whore house was shabby and he knew it. Even though it's on the lower end of the rape totem pole, even Tyrion realizes it's a little low.

Oh for fuck's sake-most rapists don't consider what they do as rape.

But the whip marks on her back shows what happens when she fights.

To be fair I don't think Tyrion saw her back until after he had already fucked her. I don't think it really crossed his mind that this girl was any different than a Westerosi whore. After he saw her back he felt guilty I think.

And promptly raped her again.

Before he raped her the first time, he specifically thinks that she is likely to have been captured by a slaver as a child-he is under no illusions concerning her wanting to be there.

[Garlan Marius]

And the art of trolling is not lost.

[Gannicus]

Oh for fuck's sake-most rapists don't consider what they do as rape.

Really? That's news to me. Where did you hear that, a feminist article about college date rape?

[Kittykatknits]

Really? That's news to me. Where did you hear that, a feminist article about college date rape?

Ok, tell me this is a joke? Please.

And, we are at 20 pages. Someone, please, lock this damn thing.

[PatrickStormborn]

Ok, tell me this is a joke? Please.

And, we are at 20 pages. Someone, please, lock this damn thing.

I honestly don't know how this thread hasn't been locked yet. Hell, one of the posters defended Tyrion threatening to rape Tommen by saying that they too had threatened to rape someone and it was "okay". :stillsick:

This might actually be the worst thread on this forum yet. And that's saying something after all the Cat/Dany/Sansa/Cersei threads.

[Winter's Knight]

Really? That's news to me. Where did you hear that, a feminist article about college date rape?

Tch. It's taught in Feminazing for Beginners. Chapter One: An Introduction to the Rape-Happy Beast of Burden. Also covered in Animal Husbandry: Managing Your Male Menagerie.

[Miryana]

The she knew what was expected of her line is what changes it for me.

Unpleasant yeah, but not rape.

Good Lord. So a victim of human trafficking can't be raped if she's been so badly abused that she's gotten to the point of being so physically and emotionally scarred that she'll do whatever is required by the client who's paid her jailor. ASOIAF may be a fantasy series but that doesn't mean it can't have modern relevance, and the situation with Tyrion and the sex slave is appallingly close to what still goes on all over the world.

Tyrion is a rapist. He's capable of moments of kindness, loves his brother deeply, and doesn't consciously set out to be a monster until his breakdown and depression in ADWD make him imagine punishing his enemies in the worst possible ways. But he's still a rapist. He's human, fun, witty company, relatable - like so many rapists that friends and family don't want to imagine being capable of a crime that's easier to cope with if they keep telling themselves that only Ramsays and Gregors would do that.

[Gannicus]

Now I'm seriously confused. Is it common knowledge that rapists don't consider themselves rapists?

1 - The violent rapist

2- The date rapist, get's girls drunk or whatever.

Number 2 still must realize it's rape, no?

[Winter's Knight]

Now I'm seriously confused. Is it common knowledge that rapists don't consider themselves rapists?

1 - The violent rapist

2- The date rapist, get's girls drunk or whatever.

Number 2 still must realize it rape, no?

No.

Thomas looks at a study of 1882 college students who were asked four questions to determine if they had ever raped (or attempted to rape) anyone:

1) Have you ever attempted unsuccessfully to have intercourse with an adult by force or threat of force?

2) Have you ever had sexual intercourse with someone who did not want you to because they were too intoxicated to resist?

3) Have you ever had intercourse with someone by force or threat of force?

4) Have you ever had oral intercourse with someone by force or threat of force?

Questions like these are bound to lead to underreporting—what guy is going to admit to forcing a girl to give him head? As it turns out, a lot of guys will admit to this, 120 to be exact: That's six percent of the survey's respondents who copped to either rape or attempted rape. Importantly, Thomas notes, the survey does not actually ask these guys if they've ever exactly "raped" anyone:

If a survey asks men, for example, if they ever “had sexual intercourse with someone, even though they did not want to, because they were too intoxicated (on alcohol or drugs) to resist your sexual advances,” some of them will say yes, as long as the questions don’t use the “R” word.

ETA This clusterfuck from reddit.

[Gar Weg Wun Sygerrik]

No.

Never been so certain that I do not want to click a link.

[Lion of Judah]

I honestly don't know how this thread hasn't been locked yet. Hell, one of the posters defended Tyrion threatening to rape Tommen by saying that they too had threatened to rape someone and it was "okay". :stillsick:

This might actually be the worst thread on this forum yet. And that's saying something after all the Cat/Dany/Sansa/Cersei threads.

I saw that and I got goose bumps; chills I tell you! Unbelievable.

[Gannicus]

Never been so certain that I do not want to click a link.

I did it for you. The funny thing is I was half joking about calling her source a feminist article about college date rape. As it turns out the source is from a blog called The Sexist written by a woman named Amanda Hess and the study involves almost 2000 college students.

The statistics might be true, but that survey is, shall we say hardly cold science.

[Gannicus]

I saw that and I got goose bumps; chills I tell you! Unbelievable.

I don't know what post you're referring to. But the poster probably just meant that some people say things they don't mean when they're angry. How many times have you heard some one say "I'll fuckin kill you"...Most of the time it's just smoke.

In fact I remember getting into an argument with a guy a few years ago, who said he was going to rape me. Fortunately he ended up walking away not 20 seconds later. Words are wind ;)

[DogLover]

Damn it people have taken the bait and this tread is on the verge of becoming a rape definition discussion.

Whether it's labeled as rape or not makes no difference. Tyrion wouldn't consider it rape, nor would the rest of Westeros/Essos, or Joer Mormont for that matter. But for us it is. On the other hand what Tyrion did at the whore house was shabby and he knew it. Even though it's on the lower end of the rape totem pole, even Tyrion realizes it's a little low.

Considering Joer's own son brought shame on his house and was exiled for his involvement in the slave trade, Joer would also consider this rape.

[1234567]

Whether it's labeled as rape or not makes no difference.

Oh Hell, yes it does. It makes a huge difference.

Tyrion wouldn't consider it rape, nor would the rest of Westeros/Essos, or Joer Mormont for that matter. But for us it is. On the other hand what Tyrion did at the whore house was shabby and he knew it. Even though it's on the lower end of the rape totem pole, even Tyrion realizes it's a little low.

Slavery is banned in Westeros under pain of death or the Wall. That's why Jorah is in Essos in the first place. For the record, what Jorah was doing was also rape.

Also there is plenty of evidence that not only would it be considered rape (even bloody Victarion was disgusted by the women who were to be sold as slaves being raped, and he's one of the ironborn!!). Not only that, the institution of prostitution is not supported across the board. Ned was disgusted at Robert bedding a 15 year old prostitute because of her age (and she at least seemed to be partially willingly involved in that line of work), and Stannis wanted to close the brothels of KL down.

What Tyrion did is the same as a Western man going out to South East Asia and having sex with someone who he would not sleep with in his own country because it would be a crime and he would know it was wrong, but doing it anyway because it's okay there. Sometimes " When in Rome, do as the Romans do" is seriously not okay.

[TerraPrime]

[Mod Hat]

If I see another round of rape apologies and rape excusing like we've seen in the this, there will be deletions. For now, the thread is closed. If you have the urge to start a continuation thread, I suggest you think really hard on whether that's a good idea.

[/Mod hat]