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Jon Wolfwalker

Dany won't be in tWoW?

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Quaithe tells Dany she must "pass beneath the shadow" which most of us take as Asshai.

GRRM has said we won't see Asshai from any PoV's just flashbacks and what not.

So could it be possible we won't see any of Dany in the next volume? Or at the very least see her towards the end and she recalls things from her time there as she travels towards Westeros?

Who knows, she might visit there with only Drogon and then return to her people and we then see what she has learned.

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Doubt it. GRRM said at one point (I think over the summer) that he was writing about the Dothraki, which strongly implies he was writing Dany chapters.

I suspect the "pass beneath the shadow" quote along with the fact that Asshai is implied not to be a necessary locale for a PoV to visit means that equating the two is treating the prophecy too literally, or something along those lines.

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No grrm has confirmed (i think) that he was writing the battle of Meeren so i think she'll be in it

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Originally there was supposed to be a five year gap between the VERY end of ASoS and AFfC for characters to grow(Samwell to train to be a maestor, Arya as an assassin, Sansa as LF's pupil, Bran as a greenseer, Jon Snow as Lord Commander, etc.) and I think GRRM said he was originally planning that the battle of Meereen WOULD have happened in that time and Dany would've been forced to flee to Asshai where she'd be at the start of AFfC.

But then he was so reliant on flashbacks and whatnot, that he got fed up and scraped the idea and i'm pretty sure NOW the whole "going to Asshai" thing was scraped all together.

Pretty sure Dany passing underneath the giant shadow of Drogon at the end of her last chapter in ADwD is supposed to be the substitute to fill in the prophecy. In hindsight, the "shadow" in that prophecy now works as a redherring since everyone thinks it means Asshai.

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Just because we don't see something happen, doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Most of Robb's campaign was off camera, Barristan taking Mereen through the sewers was the same.

I think it could be similar. We might have Dany leave for Asshai in one of her PoVs, then be back in Slaver's Bay in another one.

he has said he isn't changing any part of the plot, so although there isn't a 5YG, everything will happen the way it was originally planned.

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When they killed Mago in the first season on the HBO series, GRRM said he appears again in the books. Since he is Khal Jhaqo's bloodrider and Dany has now encountered Jhaqo's khal, I believe their arc will be dealt with in TWoW.

“It was a cruel fate,” Dany said, “yet not so cruel as Mago’s will be. I promise you that, by the old gods and the new, by the lamb god and the horse god and every god that lives. I swear it by the Mother of Mountains and the Womb of the World. Before I am done with them, Mago and Ko Jhaqo will plead for the mercy they showed Eroeh.”

The Dothraki exchanged uncertain glances. “Khaleesi, “ the handmaid Irri explained, as if to a child, “Jhaqo is a khal now, with twenty thousand riders at his back.”

She lifted her head. “And I am Daenerys Stormborn, Daenerys of House Targaryen, of the blood of Aegon the Conqueror and Maegor the Cruel and old Valyria before them. I am the dragon’s daughter, and I swear to you, these men will die screaming.

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I think Dany will definitely show up in the sixth book. I will freaking freak out if she doesn't.

Also, i think she's going to go to Valyria at some point so we get to see what the Doom did to the place. Maybe that's what the Shadow means? I'm probably way out there but I reckon she's going to go there at some point and discover some knowledge or magic or something that will help her and the other two 'heads' control the dragons.

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What we've had up til now is a more realistic sense of travel times(but never exacts) of how long it truly takes to get around.

Danny could break that all open with the fact she's flying a dragon, it might only take her days to get to asshai, and days to get back, instead of months.

This is really important because then the world opens up and it means she will be the dragon queen of not only slaver bay, but possibly a new empire, especially if volantis rises for her, which it has too.

That would bring her Into conflict with bravos and perhaps the FM.

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... especially if volantis rises for her, which it has too.

That would bring her Into conflict with bravos and perhaps the FM.

I'm not sure I follow your reasoning. Volantis is currently her enemy. If you meant the slaves rising for her, I can't see how that would bring her into conflict with Braavos or the FM. A return to aggression by Volantis is going to scare the hell out of the Free Ciies nearest them, and Braavos has supported them in resisting Volantis in the past. Volantis wants to be the new Valarian empire, while the Braavosi and the FM were the ones who escaped from the original empire's grasp.

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... especially if volantis rises for her, which it has too.

That would bring her Into conflict with bravos and perhaps the FM.

On the contrary, a pro-Dany, anti-slavery regime change in Volantis might even bring her the support of Bravos and the FM.

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I can't see any major interlude in Asshai happening mainly for reasons of structure and pacing. Dany spent a large amount of page time in Meereen and it seems even longer to us because of A Feast For Crows. If he's really going to fit everything into two more books, she needs to start making steady progress towards Westeros. I expect that Winds of Winter will end with her being landed in Westeros or very close to doing so. If she's not there by the last volume it might end up seeming too fast paced in comparison with the rest of her story. GRRM can't afford to leave her out of another book. There's too much to resolve between her landing in Westeros and the end of Dance. If her forces are going to prevail in Meereen she'll need to be present. Several characters are still in the process of converging on Dany. For that to be complete she'll have to actually meet those characters. She can't be an absentee for long if the the story is to move forward.

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I believe WoW will bring all the major players to one continent, so if Dany is in Meereen/Drogon's pit she would have to be in the book to make it to Westeros at some point.

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Dany has to be in TWOW. There is no way GRRM could complete her story arc in one book. Most likely we will find Dany and Drogon allying with the Dothraki, hopefully.

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She might come late into the book like Victarion in ADwD.

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He has tied up loose ends and will do so, kill may minor pov persons in the first few chapters of TWOW so that major characters like Dany will be in the this and subsequent books. In other words, she will be in there.

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Originally there was supposed to be a five year gap between the VERY end of ASoS and AFfC for characters to grow(Samwell to train to be a maestor, Arya as an assassin, Sansa as LF's pupil, Bran as a greenseer, Jon Snow as Lord Commander, etc.) and I think GRRM said he was originally planning that the battle of Meereen WOULD have happened in that time and Dany would've been forced to flee to Asshai where she'd be at the start of AFfC.

correct. that is why he is trying to fit the pieces together. The non-gap is the reason Bran's story has hardly progressed over the 5 books alongside Dany from book 3-5, because they have to catch up to characters like Jaime, Cersei, Jon, Stannis, and Tyrion.

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Bran's story has hardly progressed over the 5 books

Just thinking of Bran's story:

Season 3 - filmed 2012, broadcast 2013 - ends (presumably) with him going through the Wall

Season 4 - filmed 2013, broadcast 2014 - getting to the cave? possibly doing things in the cave?

Season 5 - filmed 2014, broadcast 2015 - doing a few things in the cave, learning powers? something new?

Season 6 - filmed 2015, broadcast 2016 .....?

Given these filming assumptions. Bran's story will need some Winds of Winter material for filming in July 2015 (Season 4 is starting filming this July). Script writers will need time to turn it from a book to a script so the book would have to be ready by start of 2015? (if not properly edited and published).

So maybe we will see Winds of Winter published in 2015? I don't think GRRM will want the show to overtake the books.

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...I think GRRM said he was originally planning that the battle of Meereen WOULD have happened in that time and Dany would've been forced to flee to Asshai where she'd be at the start of AFfC.

I haven't read that. Do you know where that comes from?

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