Why didn't Tywin Lannister remarry?

[Castel]

Marriage for those people is not about love, it's a political alliance to advance your House. Tywin would have no problem sending his own family to war if that advanced House Lannister. Having a wife who could give you children, which you can later marry to other Houses gives you more pieces on the chessboard to work with.

I think the Lannisters would have been wise to marry Tyrells. They control the most food rich part of the realm, and the Lannisters control the most gold rich part, if the Lannisters had both the money and the food no one would be able to challenge them.

Which Tyrell?

[Amanda Lannister]

IMO, The fact that Tywin did deeply love Joanna means nothing. This is a man who will have no limits to what he will do to further his house (hello have we forgotten Elia and her children). The fact that he never did remarry basically screams at you! He is a very eligible bachelor, and lets be honest, it's not always about the fact that house Lannister will survive, it's about Tywins line specifically. Jamie is KG, no wife no kids blah blah we all know this. Cersei has 3 children, but lets remember that (even though we and a few characters know differently) Cersei's children and BARATHEONS, not LANNISTERS. and Tyrion, we won't even go there, can he have kids? all the whores, and nothing so far? Even a whore would claim Tyrions child because of the wealth of house Lannister (not that Tywin would ever allow that to happen).

Basically what I'm getting at here is some of the arguments (IMO) are irrelevant. Loved Joanna. Already had 3 kids. Loved whores (secretly).

There has to be a reason that he never remarried. He could have strengthened house bonds by marrying. Maybe GRRM will answer this question in the literature someday, you never know. It could come up in Jamie, Cersei, or Tyrions POV, possibly Varys' POV (if he ever has one, last chapter ever?)

Perhaps there was no one in a strong enough house to marry. All that comes to mind to me is Arianne Martell, Dany, Lysa Tully (pre littlefinger obv.) Asha Greyjoy, none of which I could ever see happening. Could the answer be as simple as that? With GRRM, you never know :bang: These women though, are only the eligible chickies while we are reading. I'm sure there were many more before our story started. Tyrell girls before they were married off, etc.

I hope we will eventually find out. GRRM seemingly never leaves anything out or puts anything in the stories without good reason. Time will tell...

[Castel]

One should never make the mistake of assuming that ruthless men are equally rational in all fields. It's much easier to coldly weigh people when they have no link to you.

But either way, all of the people you mention were bad choices for multiple reasons. Dany is treason, Marg is too young and Doran and Arianne hate Tywin and Tywin hates the Greyjoys. Everyone is out.

[cortchuzska]

Not only Tywin deeply loved Joanna; he trusted and esteemed her. Still, he believes Tyrion is a bastard.

If even perfect wonderful beloved Joanna cheated on him...

He would not suffer being made a fool of again.

He would not allow himself anything more than disposable bodies of whores he utterly despises.

[Keirut]

But isn't that a bit benieth his station?

An Hightower? Absolutely not. They even married into House Targaryen. They're one of the noblest families in the whole continent.

[Ludd]

Tywin was widowed about 7 years before Harrenhall. He wolos have been still in his early thirties. Allowing a few years for Grieving he could whn the twins were about 10-11 go looking for a wife. At that stage on the market were:

Dorne - Elia, Ahara Dayne and her sister, a very young Arianne - who would perhpas have been a better match for Jaime

The Reach - We do not rall y jnow

Riverlands Catelyn and Lyssa, the Whent girl, possibly dome blackwoods or Brackens and a Darry - Not a frey

Stormsend - no one really

Iron Island - Not good enought for Lannister

Stark and the North - an 11 year old Lyanna

Other Lannister cousins and bannermen's daughters

[Ser Lepus]

A Tywin in his early thirties, and his children were a kingsguard (not allowed to inherit), a female (who wouldn't inherit so long as a fitting male heir existed) and a dwarf he wouldn't allow to inherit...yes noble ladies (and their parents) would be fighting over him.

The Hightower girl would be fitting, as would be Elia (fifteen years younger). And there would be other marriageable noble-enough girls around.

[The Broke Howard Hughes]

Tywin was much to inlove with his late wife. No woman would have ever been good enough for him. His kids weren't even good enough in his eyes.

[naik2902]

he didnt feel need for it. he had 3 children and two sons as heir.

[Ser Lepus]

he didnt feel need for it. he had 3 children and two sons as heir.

A dwarf which he wouldn't let to inherit, and a kingsguard which the law wouldn't let to inherit. If he doesn't marry and has another son, his best chance to preserve the Lannister line is to marry Cersei to one of her cousins (Daven Lannister, for example?) and let them inherit Casterly Rock, but Tywin would very much prefer to marry Cersei away (to Rhaegar, preferably) and have a healthy son as his own heir.

[Ingelheim]

He didn't want to. We know that Jaime was named a member of the Kingsguard as an insult to Tywin, to snatch his heir. With Jaime unable to inherit, and Tyrion being a dwarf and hated by his own father, Tywin only had Cersei as his heir (although the legal heir was Tyrion). The logic is that he had married again.

And he did not. Therefore, the question is why. And the answer is simple: he didn't want to.

[The Dragon King]

He didn't want to. We know that Jaime was named a member of the Kingsguard as an insult to Tywin, to snatch his heir. With Jaime unable to inherit, and Tyrion being a dwarf and hated by his own father, Tywin only had Cersei as his heir (although the legal heir was Tyrion). The logic is that he had married again.

And he did not. Therefore, the question is why. And the answer is simple: he didn't want to.

We can see that, the relevant question is why didnt he want to, it seems like a big mistake IMO.

[Wavey Sauce]

saw this old thread. What pissed me off about Tywin, if his excuse was he loved his first wife so much to marry again. But yet tries to force his kids into unhappy marriages to secure the reach and the north. Even at any age, Tywin could have had his pick at any female he wanted and any family would take the offer for sure with no questions or demands asked

 

He didnt want to marry again then whatever thats fine. Then don't force Cersei to marry again or your other kids if they dont want to, straight hypocritical. all he cares about his legacy so one would figure he would want to have insurance with as many heirs as possible. I mean with Jaime as  KG, he still even tried to have Tyrion killed multiple times. Is his legacy that important then? Cause what happens when Jaime has no kids with another family? Is he ok with Lancel carrying it on? Oh and he is a sparrow

[Wavey Sauce]

One should never make the mistake of assuming that ruthless men are equally rational in all fields. It's much easier to coldly weigh people when they have no link to you.

 

But either way, all of the people you mention were bad choices for multiple reasons. Dany is treason, Marg is too young and Doran and Arianne hate Tywin and Tywin hates the Greyjoys. Everyone is out.

The bride isnt so much the issue for him. He needs more heirs, he wouldnt be dumb enough to pick and choose every little fault, any of the rich families in the westerlands......he could probably even get a highly looked at female even if she was already married, make it work where he takes her. He holds power of lots of people and in his region tons of rich families, its more about him needing more heirs as well, not what woman is worthy of carrying them

[Ser Frasier of House Crane]

1. Tyrion genuinely loved Joanna and no one could fill that void.

2. I think Tywin had a bit of a martyr complex, especially as far as Tyrion was concerned. He could lord his mother's death and his father's resultant unhappiness over his dwarf son's head.

3. He would mistrust anyone who would try to marry into the Lannister family.

[Wavey Sauce]

1. Tyrion genuinely loved Joanna and no one could fill that void.

2. I think Tywin had a bit of a martyr complex, especially as far as Tyrion was concerned. He could lord his mother's death and his father's resultant unhappiness over his dwarf son's head.

3. He would mistrust anyone who would try to marry into the Lannister family.

He mistrusts everybody

 

But he would be able to trust his own actual kids with whatever set person

[Lion of the West]

saw this old thread. What pissed me off about Tywin, if his excuse was he loved his first wife so much to marry again. But yet tries to force his kids into unhappy marriages to secure the reach and the north. Even at any age, Tywin could have had his pick at any female he wanted and any family would take the offer for sure with no questions or demands asked

 

He didnt want to marry again then whatever thats fine. Then don't force Cersei to marry again or your other kids if they dont want to, straight hypocritical. all he cares about his legacy so one would figure he would want to have insurance with as many heirs as possible. I mean with Jaime as  KG, he still even tried to have Tyrion killed multiple times. Is his legacy that important then? Cause what happens when Jaime has no kids with another family? Is he ok with Lancel carrying it on? Oh and he is a sparrow

The issue is that Tywin had the luck of loving the woman he was to marry, and he did and had children to carry on the Lannister name. Now his children will do the same, and if they find love, very well, but historically love has not been needed in a marriage in Westeros. The issue with his kids are however very different and something that goes beyond then needs of 21th century Western sentiments. For the first part, Cersei has proven to have a very bad influence on her children and is also the subject of the most vicious rumors, to marry her off reduces her influence at court and also makes a mark against the incest rumors (we know they are true, but they can't possibly be proven within Westeros at large). In regards to Tyrion, Tywin has to my knowledge never tried to kill Tyrion a single time before the supposed murder of Joffrey. And finally in regards to heirs, there are loads and loads of Lannisters who can inherit and if it comes to worse, the husband of a Lannister lady can take the Lannister name and continue the line that way. Heirs are not an issue. What is an isse however is the present political situation where House Lannister had gained the outmost power and influence across Westeros and now naturally needed to secure that power for the future and prevent it from being a House of cards, hence then need for prominent Lannisters to marry, both to secure the alliance between the Rock and Highgarden for a generation or so, but also to strike a blow at the most prominent seat of anti-Lannister feelings and separatism, the North. If Tywin's kids feels that they should be allowed to gain on the advancement of House Lannister they should also be ready to work for its advancement, in this case by marriage.

1. Tyrion genuinely loved Joanna and no one could fill that void.

2. I think Tywin had a bit of a martyr complex, especially as far as Tyrion was concerned. He could lord his mother's death and his father's resultant unhappiness over his dwarf son's head.

3. He would mistrust anyone who would try to marry into the Lannister family.

I don't think the last part is true. Both Swyft and Marbrand have married into the Lannisters and Tywin don't seem to hold them in any negative light. The matter of Frey is of course a different thing.

[Wavey Sauce]

The issue is that Tywin had the luck of loving the woman he was to marry, and he did and had children to carry on the Lannister name. Now his children will do the same, and if they find love, very well, but historically love has not been needed in a marriage in Westeros. The issue with his kids are however very different and something that goes beyond then needs of 21th century Western sentiments. For the first part, Cersei has proven to have a very bad influence on her children and is also the subject of the most vicious rumors, to marry her off reduces her influence at court and also makes a mark against the incest rumors (we know they are true, but they can't possibly be proven within Westeros at large). In regards to Tyrion, Tywin has to my knowledge never tried to kill Tyrion a single time before the supposed murder of Joffrey. And finally in regards to heirs, there are loads and loads of Lannisters who can inherit and if it comes to worse, the husband of a Lannister lady can take the Lannister name and continue the line that way. Heirs are not an issue. What is an isse however is the present political situation where House Lannister had gained the outmost power and influence across Westeros and now naturally needed to secure that power for the future and prevent it from being a House of cards, hence then need for prominent Lannisters to marry, both to secure the alliance between the Rock and Highgarden for a generation or so, but also to strike a blow at the most prominent seat of anti-Lannister feelings and separatism, the North. If Tywin's kids feels that they should be allowed to gain on the advancement of House Lannister they should also be ready to work for its advancement, in this case by marriage.

I don't think the last part is true. Both Swyft and Marbrand have married into the Lannisters and Tywin don't seem to hold them in any negative light. The matter of Frey is of course a different thing.

He knew damn well Tyrion did not kill Joff.

 

But all Tywin preached about was legacy legacy legacy, carrying on the family name. But didnt care enough it seems, wanted his kids to do the dirty work, he is the one who cares so much not them, he should have least tried for some more heirs if that was the single most important thing to him

[purple-eyes]

Honestly if these people are real figures,  

I think Tywin would marry again at least after jaime took the white. Then tried to get a new heir to replace tyrion. 

It is not about how much he loved Joanna. 

person like Tywin would certainly remarry to seal the heritage of his house. 

And we know he slept with whores so it is not like he kept faithful for his dead wife like bonifer. 

but story wise, GRRM can not make Tywin has a third son. 

if so, Tyrion's story will be heavily affected. 

 

 

[Orphalesion]

saw this old thread. What pissed me off about Tywin, if his excuse was he loved his first wife so much to marry again. But yet tries to force his kids into unhappy marriages to secure the reach and the north. Even at any age, Tywin could have had his pick at any female he wanted and any family would take the offer for sure with no questions or demands asked

 

He didnt want to marry again then whatever thats fine. Then don't force Cersei to marry again or your other kids if they dont want to, straight hypocritical. all he cares about his legacy so one would figure he would want to have insurance with as many heirs as possible. I mean with Jaime as  KG, he still even tried to have Tyrion killed multiple times. Is his legacy that important then? Cause what happens when Jaime has no kids with another family? Is he ok with Lancel carrying it on? Oh and he is a sparrow

Tywin is a hypocrite; he forces his children to make sacrifices he does not. It's as easy as that.

As tto who will be Lord of Casterly Rock and Lord Paramount of the Westerlands; well I personally think that Tywin, to the moment of his death, held on to the delusion that he'd manage to somehow, somehow, get Jaime out of the KG and to become his heir. Remember the reason Tyrion consented to marrying Sansa was that Twyin made it clear to him that he'd nevevr get Casterly Rock, but "maybe Winterfell" if he marries the Stark Girl. 

As to who would have inherited....well that's the situation we have right now. Technically Cersei is Lady of Casterly Rock and from her it can pass to Tommen and Tommen's second son can restore the Lannister name and become Lord of Casterly Rock.

Of course, Tommen being King and LP of two more regions would make him very unpopular among the other Great Houses, Feudalism is about distribution of power in exchange for loyalty, not centralization and I don't think Tommen is in a good enough spot to ever pull off that grade of centralization.

If it doesn't pass to Tommen, Lancel is still not needed, the Lannisters have a whole town full of side branches. I think next in line would be Martyn (Lancel's brother) and Daven after him, probably.

The real question is what they plan to do with Storm's End (I know, nothing, because Cersei is a moron and Tommen is just a kid) but unlike the Lannisters the Baratheons don't have any living side branches (that we know of) so they'd have to chose a new lord of Storm's End and, more importantly, a new LP for the Storm Lands.