Vampire Squid Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Talking of dragons and others, I am not convinced by the point that both have to be destroyed to restore order: the others are something unnatural, while the same cannot be said about dragons, which are powerful but nonetheless "natural" creatures.Says who? Cold and heat are equally natural things (and in any case, if Westeros needs to lose everything "unnatural", there won't be much of what we recognise as civilisation left). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinkie Baelish Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 What if they team up to form, Dragothers?I, for one, welcome our Dragother overlords. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackfyre the Bold Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I wouldn't mind if a A Song of Ice and Fire is actually about Danaerys and Jon; their journeys and their eventual union. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukle Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I wouldn't mind if a A Song of Ice and Fire is actually about Danaerys and Jon; their journeys and their eventual union.This is put about a bit, especially since there's no need for additional theories such as R + L = J. It'd just be a Stark of Ice and a Targaryen of Fire. That also means that the "Ice and Fire" are on the same side of a power trying to fight the Others, rather than a battle of ice versus fire as seems more obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackfyre the Bold Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 This is put about a bit, especially since there's no need for additional theories such as R + L = J. It'd just be a Stark of Ice and a Targaryen of Fire. That also means that the "Ice and Fire" are on the same side of a power trying to fight the Others, rather than a battle of ice versus fire as seems more obvious.Wait, do you like my idea or naah? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yukle Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Wait, do you like my idea or naah?I think there's a lot of merit to it. I have no idea if it will happen or not but there's certainly a lot of reasons why it'd make for interesting reading. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackfyre the Bold Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I think there's a lot of merit to it. I have no idea if it will happen or not but there's certainly a lot of reasons why it'd make for interesting reading. :DI'm also warming up to the idea of Danaerys ruling in Essos and possibly rebuilding Valyria with her dragons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Black Wolf Smith Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 I wouldn't mind if a A Song of Ice and Fire is actually about Danaerys and Jon; their journeys and their eventual union.If you were a man.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LykatheaAflame Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Its simple. Everyone's gonna die and get resurrected as a wight and The Others will reign supreme in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lady m Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 Are you seriously suggesting that we won't get to see the DRAGONS setting fire to the WHITEWALKERS? Sure, something else COULD happen. But WHAT could possibly be cooler? And I think the Lannisters are as important as the Starks in Westeros (not as good, not as personal to the reader (debatable) I grant ye, but as important). Besides, the Targaryens stand apart big time.First of all extreme cold and snow accompany The Others, which does not sound like good conditions for dragons that don't like to fly in rain. And further, I doubt this is how it will go as the two are different sides of the same coin. Others=fear & death, dragons=fear, death & subjugation. The seven kingdoms didn't unite for any reason but that the high lords were scared to death of themselves and their people being mass slaughtered by Aegon & his sisters. That sounds oh so cool to me.i think it's the Kindly Man that relates the story of Valerya and how dragons aren't cool, they are tools those use who want to subjugate people, and that Braavos hid itself till after the Doom since it was founded by escaped slaves who feared the dragons finding them.On the other side the free folk leave the far north because they are scared, and to escape. Same as the founding of Braavos.I think the point is both are bad and good men have to step forward and put aside their differences - like the petty games being played in Kings Landing - and defeat both forms of fear to be free. The Northern story was just the beginning of this. Makes for a much less *cool* ending, but fits with GRRMs more complicated & human vision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter George Stewart Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I'm sure a lot of people would be disappointed if the climax didn't involve some sort of interaction between the Dragons and the Others - but who "wins", or whether they ally, or cancel each other out, that's totally up in the air.Fire melts Ice, true, but Ice (in the sense of sufficient cold) can kill Fire too (after all, there's a permanent "Winter is Coming" for the whole Universe as we know it, the Heat Death :( ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King's Ruin Posted February 16, 2013 Author Share Posted February 16, 2013 First of all extreme cold and snow accompany The Others, which does not sound like good conditions for dragons that don't like to fly in rain. And further, I doubt this is how it will go as the two are different sides of the same coin. Others=fear & death, dragons=fear, death & subjugation. The seven kingdoms didn't unite for any reason but that the high lords were scared to death of themselves and their people being mass slaughtered by Aegon & his sisters. That sounds oh so cool to me.i think it's the Kindly Man that relates the story of Valerya and how dragons aren't cool, they are tools those use who want to subjugate people, and that Braavos hid itself till after the Doom since it was founded by escaped slaves who feared the dragons finding them.On the other side the free folk leave the far north because they are scared, and to escape. Same as the founding of Braavos.I think the point is both are bad and good men have to step forward and put aside their differences - like the petty games being played in Kings Landing - and defeat both forms of fear to be free. The Northern story was just the beginning of this. Makes for a much less *cool* ending, but fits with GRRMs more complicated & human vision.Whilst I admire your maturity in offering a solution I'm not sure if it's not a little naive also. Civil war in the Middle Ages was like technilogical revolutions today - they happen all the time and they're always MEGA HUGE and important. I don't think a single country in a single nation in the world has ever gone more than 100 years without going to war, either with themselves or with each other. Even *if* GRRM gives us a resolution to the current issues facing the political realm of the Seven Kingdoms - even a promise of peace and prosperity - in reality it can only last for so long. Except if you introduce one crucial factor, something that completely changes the rules of the game [of thrones]: dragons. As you say, dragons crush the nobles and smallfolk alike and there's plenty of flaming fields of flaming armies and villages and castles in the books. But think of it; a dynasty that lasted nearly 200 years! This is the hallmark of a successful reign. Say what you like about the Targaryans, mad as they were, forced as the alliances may have been by the fear of death and destruction, progress (of a sort) was made and the Seven Kingdoms did pretty well for a time. Because dragons win hands down every time it restricts the sway of power to the Targaryans alone. If they didn't have incesteous relationships, things would probably work out okay and even if they don't it's certainly a way of giving a sane Targaryan a chance to do some real good because no one will dare challenge him. I am not committing myself to either side, I am simply saying it is not as black and white as all that.As for the rest of these lame people trying to say we won't get to see dragons fight Others, yeah, sure I get it, maybe not. But I don't think the impulse to have something fresh and original need apply to the things we want to see. Will you be busy saying it's corny if any of the Starks reunite? Will you deny yourself the pleasure of anticipating Dany's arrival in Westeros with her dragons? I don't know about you but I can't wait to see the Others become full-bodied characters, talking at length with POV chapters. imagine that! Whitewalker POVs! Just because it seems inevitable, does that really make it any less desirable? My heart aches for those things and if GRRM decides to break it then he will do so deliberately, thus will I enjoy the full measure of his pen where you will be too busy being cynical and skeptical about stuff he clearly wants you to expect and build up all the more suspense because of it. Dragons VS Others: Say YES. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Creighton Posted February 16, 2013 Share Posted February 16, 2013 I, for one, welcome our Dragother overlords.Why are the others in Drag? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinkie Baelish Posted February 17, 2013 Share Posted February 17, 2013 Why are the others in Drag?It would make their invasion much more FABULOUS, which would definitely win the support of the Night's Watch who are in desperate need of a fashion makeover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogo_1 Posted February 19, 2013 Share Posted February 19, 2013 I don't know about you but I can't wait to see the Others become full-bodied characters, talking at length with POV chapters. imagine that! Whitewalker POVs! Just because it seems inevitable, does that really make it any less desirable?GRRM has made it clear that there will be no new POV characters for the remaining 2 books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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