HERESY 50

[Capon Breath]

Congratulations heretics on getting to H50 a really good achievement and always a good read.

[TheButcherCrow]

A splendid essay indeed which saves me from having to write it :bowdown:

The only thing I'd add, which we've touched on before, is that according to Mel (and who are we to doubt her) the Azor Ahai prophecy was recorded 5,000 years ago, which would be contemporary with the wars between the Valyrians and the Ghiscari

Maybe the monster that AA slew was the Harpy of Ghis?

[King Tyrion VIII]

The answer is the bloodthirsty Children.

[Black Crow]

Ah, shame on you for suggesting that the cuddly little tree-huggers might not be the good guys.

[Frey family reunion]

Might the ovens in the Nightfort have been used for another type of sacrifice?

[Black Crow]

Doubt it. I think the conclusion we came to when discussing this last was that the building predates everything except the wall. It was the portal between the realms but after the Night's King was overthrown the door was locked (so to speak) and the building re-used as a kitchen when the Nightfort was built around it.

[Toccs]

Anyone else think that Mance went to Winterfell via the Black Gate rather then scaling the Wall?

[Neumond]

hello heresy 50 (!) followers,

congratulations on your successful monster-thread-series! May I intrude and ask for your opinion? Pretty sure, you already discussed it. But perhaps someone could tell me where to find the relevant pages?

I´ve thought about Joramun´s horn. It obviously sounds a lot like Midgard snake´s horn.

So what if, Midgard snake/Joramun is the wall itself? It´s long and meanders/sidles through the whole continent (world?). Hopefully someone understands what I want to say.

The Midgard snake was slaughtered by Thor and killed him with its venom. What if the horn isn´t what brings the wall down? Couldn´t it be the very thing that resembles the venom and will appear as a result of the downfall of the wall? To poison the one who brought down the wall?

This leads to another question. If Joramun brought the NK down. Does this mean, the wall reacted somehow to his "sins"?

I apologize for my intrusion in your fabulous threads.

[Tyryan Lannister]

A splendid essay indeed which saves me from having to write it :bowdown:

I feel the exact same... go team lazy!

[Tyryan Lannister]

Congratulations heretics on getting to H50 a really good achievement and always a good read.

And it only took us a year and a half (so suck it RLJ :devil: )

:cheers:

:commie: :commie: :commie: :commie: :commie:

[Tyryan Lannister]

Ah well, based on the description of the kitchen with its domed roof, and of course the well or shaft with its stair leading down to that secret magic portal (worth remembering that the portal can't be found if you don't know how to), the conclusion was that the building wasn't originally built as a kitchen and may indeed predate the rest of the Nightfort.

Addendum: The Well was first, then came the building now known as the kitchen. Originally, the building was the housing for the guardian of the Well. Over time, others joined the guardian at his post, eventually growing big enough to form a mini-army now known as the Night's Watch. When the area around the original building became populated with barracks and the like, the original building, already containing the means of a kitchen due to it once having needed one for itself, becomes fully converted into a kitchen.

Also makes you think back to the stories such as the Rat Cook, Mad Max ((?)--the ax killer with the four or five boys trailing behind him), etc.--maybe they were originally stories about certain Guardians who had to take drastic steps to preserve the sanctity of the Well, the Portal, and the (Heretically presumed) Sacrifices thereof.

[Tyryan Lannister]

Anyone else think that Mance went to Winterfell via the Black Gate rather then scaling the Wall?

Maybe he went through with Gared and the she-wolf? :dunno:

[Tyryan Lannister]

hello heresy 50 (!) followers,

congratulations on your successful monster-thread-series! May I intrude and ask for your opinion? Pretty sure, you already discussed it. But perhaps someone could tell me where to find the relevant pages?

I´ve thought about Joramun´s horn. It obviously sounds a lot like Midgard snake´s horn.

So what if, Midgard snake/Joramun is the wall itself? It´s long and meanders/sidles through the whole continent (world?). Hopefully someone understands what I want to say.

The Midgard snake was slaughtered by Thor and killed him with its venom. What if the horn isn´t what brings the wall down? Couldn´t it be the very thing that resembles the venom and will appear as a result of the downfall of the wall? To poison the one who brought down the wall?

This leads to another question. If Joramun brought the NK down. Does this mean, the wall reacted somehow to his "sins"?

I apologize for my intrusion in your fabulous threads.

As to the Horn itself, look no further than H49, where we started discussing it in length once more. As to the Midgard snake--well, time for me to reiterate one of my theories:

Bloodraven = Odin (wise, uses ravens, linked to a tree)

Bran = Fenrir (great wolf, son of Loki, kills Odin during Ragnarok)*

Arya = Hel (mistress of death, daughter of Loki)

Mance = Thor (god of thunder and lightning, protector of Midgard, son of Odin, kills and gets killed by the Jormungandr during Ragnarok)**

Jon = Jormungandr (the World Snake of Midgard; son of Loki; holds tail in its mouth; once he lets go of his tail, Ragnarok begins; kills and gets killed by Thor during Ragnarok; sometimes described as an Ice Serpent)***

Ned = Loki (father of Jormungandr, Hel, and Fenrir; god of mischief; dies during the Ragnarok)****

*While Bran won't be killing BR, he is replacing him, and BR will likely let himself pass into the trees once he knows that Bran is ready to assume his role--hence Bran "killing" him

**Which ties into my (and others) theories about Mance and Bloodraven being related--and regardless of blood relations, there is a reason why Mance wheres a raven-helm, which I say ties him with BR in some fashion

***Which is, for me at least, where the significance of Rhaegar being Jon's father comes from--it makes Jon the Ice Dragon, or, in other terms, the Ice Serpent

****While I am fully aware that Littlefinger is the actual Loki of the series, Ned fits the role of an unwilling Loki: he is the father (slash father-figure) of the Hel, Fenrir, and Jormungandr figures, and it is his involvement in things that causes the beginnings of Ice and Fire's Ragnarok--if he didn't meddle in the Lannister's affairs, a lot of the chaos that has happened wouldn't have

[Neumond]

Thanks for your helpful insights Tyryan Lannister. Very interesting stuff.

I don´t get, why Jon is Jormungandr.

But the others are so amazing, that I seriously ask myself how I could have overlooked it!

I will read the previous thread. Thank you for pointing me to it.

[Tyryan Lannister]

Thanks for your helpful insights Tyryan Lannister. Very interesting stuff.

I don´t get, why Jon is Jormungandr.

But the others are so amazing, that I seriously ask myself how I could have overlooked it!

I will read the previous thread. Thank you for pointing me to it.

1) Jon is the Ice Dragon (or Serpent, if you'd prefer)

2) Jon's "death" at the end of Dance is him finally losing his grip on reality and himself (Jormungandr literally loses his grip on himself)

3) Jon's loss of grip on himself is what will be the official start of Winter* (Jormungandr letting go of his tail signals the beginning of Ragnarok)

4) Jon and Mance are on an inevitable collision course with each other (Jormungandr and Thor fight to the death during Ragnarok)

*Winter (capitalized) should not be confused with winter (lowercase). Winter (lowercase) is the simple season, which would have come regardless of the above; Winter (capitalized) is Ice and Fire's version of Ragnarok.

[JungWheats]

What up! I lurk in the heresies a lot and I want to shout you guys out for getting this deep in the thread count. You guys always bring out the best theories and point me towards pretty cool stuff. Thanks!

Anyways, the first few essays got me to thinking about Bloodraven. It may have been more clearly discussed in previous threads, but anyways. I don't think Bloodraven is the 3EC. He gives Bran an evasive answer when prompted about his identity--but what do we know about Bloodraven? He has a 1000 eyes and one. Not 3.

[JungWheats]

1) Jon is the Ice Dragon (or Serpent, if you'd prefer)

2) Jon's "death" at the end of Dance is him finally losing his grip on reality and himself (Jormungandr literally loses his grip on himself)

3) Jon's loss of grip on himself is what will be the official start of Winter* (Jormungandr letting go of his tail signals the beginning of Ragnarok)

4) Jon and Mance are on an inevitable collision course with each other (Jormungandr and Thor fight to the death during Ragnarok)

*Winter (capitalized) should not be confused with winter (lowercase). Winter (lowercase) is the simple season, which would have come regardless of the above; Winter (capitalized) is Ice and Fire's version of Ragnarok.

I missed this one while posting my last thing about Bloodraven...but...If Jon and Mance are destined to come into conflict is Mance, then, the author of the Pink Letter?

[Black Crow]

Nobody has yet come up with a convincing answer to the authorship of the infamous pink letter, but Mance has certainly figured as a candidate. after all we don't know what he's really up to and why.

[Neumond]

Tyryan thank you again for your explanations. I didn´t saw the death at loss of grip on himself. But it makes much sense.

If I could be bold and ask: What would be the venom, Jon would use against Mance?

If he is a Ice Dragon, frozen fire comes to mind. This seems as impossible as living dead.

Mance as the writer of the pink letter? Very interesting idea.

[Black Crow]

I think he'll just cut his head off, it tends to be a bit final.