Theory on Grandmaester Pycelle

[Knight Of Winter]

I love how everyone comments on how amazing his beard is/was and how cruel it was of Tyrion to chop it off. It's like his beard was his best quality. Also claming Sansa has traitor's blood and lieing about Margery getting the moon tea are a few more examples of Pycelle being a giant douche. I really liked it in the show when Tyrion wakes up and Pycelle is literally gloating over Tyrion because Tywin is back. The guy is the worst kind of lackey.

All more reasons why I despise this guy.

What's even more interesting is how he remains loyal to Lannisters even after they humiliate him every now and then: Tyrion cuts of his best part and locks him into cell, Tywin telling him he "lost his wits along with his beard", Cersei humiliating him and threatening him with black cells, Jaime thinking how it's no wonder that Cersei considers Pycelle to be useless. And even after he's been through all that, as soon as he gets into posizion of power - like an obedient dog he invites Kevan (yes, another Lannister) to serve as Regent. Really, it seems that this guy has no self-respect at all.

ETA: oh, and he also helped to kill Jon Arryn - a good man and a fine Hand of the King. So much about him caring for realm's benefit.

[Lord Illidan Stormrage]

All more reasons why I despise this guy.

What's even more interesting is how he remains loyal to Lannisters even after they humiliate him every now and then: Tyrion cuts of his best part and locks him into cell, Tywin telling him he "lost his wits along with his beard", Cersei humiliating him and threatening him with black cells, Jaime thinking how it's no wonder that Cersei considers Pycelle to be useless. And even after he's been through all that, as soon as he gets into posizion of power - like an obedient dog he invites Kevan (yes, another Lannister) to serve as Regent. Really, it seems that this guy has no self-respect at all.

ETA: oh, and he also helped to kill Jon Arryn - a good man and a fine Hand of the King. So much about him caring for realm's benefit.

He believed Tywin is better for the realm them Jon and Robert - as i said he worshiped Tywin.

[Knight Of Winter]

He believed Tywin is better for the realm them Jon and Robert - as i said he worshiped Tywin.

I believe some people are evil jerks without whom world would be a better place - but I won't kill them or have them killed. I also think many insitutions and organizations earned enormous amounts of money on suffering of others - but I won't steal from them or rob their headquaters. My point is - there is a line between believing something would be good to happen and actually doing everything, no matter how wicked or immoral, to ensure that happens. There is a line, and Pycelle crossed it many times over - which gives impressions he cares more for Lannisters in power that he does for the realm he consistently harms with his actions. And yes, I'm aware that Pycelle maybe thinks these two are mutually connected, but you really have to be extremely arrogant and self-entitled jerk to think your opinion is so important that it justifies murders, rapes and other atrocities Lannisters commit to come/stay in power.

[Lord Illidan Stormrage]

I believe some people are evil jerks without whom world would be a better place - but I won't kill them or have them killed. I also think many insitutions and organizations earned enormous amounts of money on suffering of others - but I won't steal from them or rob their headquaters. My point is - there is a line between believing something would be good to happen and actually doing everything, no matter how wicked or immoral, to ensure that happens. There is a line, and Pycelle crossed it many times over - which gives impressions he cares more for Lannisters in power that he does for the realm he consistently harms with his actions. And yes, I'm aware that Pycelle maybe thinks these two are mutually connected, but you really have to be extremely arrogant and self-entitled jerk to think your opinion is so important that it justifies murders, rapes and other atrocities Lannisters commit to come/stay in power.

Well i support the Lannisters and i think Tywin would have been the best ruler. As i said Pycelle wants to serve the realm - his way might be flawed, broken or so on but he wants what he believes is best for the realm.

[House Lothston]

Actually I always thought, that Pycelle wasn't really completely pro-Lannister but instead loyal to the citadel in Oldtown and the citadel was always Anti-Targaryen, because of their dragons. After all they despise the magic that might come with them. (I think this was mentioned in the books at some time). The citadel always had their own view on things (Lady Dustin mentions that to Theon as well). Aegon and maybe Rhaegar as well had planned to revive the dragons, something the citadel had to prevent!

That would explain, why he wanted Aerys to open the gates to Tywin.

Also he was loyal to competent Lannisters, like Tywin and Kevan, simply because with them on top of the realm as Hands, it was most likely that the Targaryens would be kept out of the realm.

When he realized, how incompetent Cersei really was, he was quick to object against some of her foolish plans.

So... why would he let Jon Arryn die and why was he clearly working against Ned?

I think that he wanted the realm to stay stable. He definitely knew that Arryn found out about the true father of Cersei's kids and if that came out, it would come to a civil war (what actually happened in the end). The same happened with Ned, although Pycelle, like most of the other members of the small council (except Littlefinger, who always wanted chaos) didn't want Ned to die... with Ned as a hostage, they could have ended the war faster.

Though his concern wasn't really about the realm, I think he was more worried, that the Targaryens might come back in the confusion of this war.

So yeah, I think he was simply Anti-Targaryen from the beginning and allied with the Lannisters because it helped him to achieve his goals.

I could be wrong, but I guess we will see, once the citadel sends a new Grand Maester to Kings Landing. ;)

[Thendel]

I believe the OP is asking why Pycelle urged Aerys to open the gates, and I'm of the impression that the answer Pycelle gave Tyrion during his arrest was an honest one: He hoped Tywin would take the throne.

As for why Pycelle opposed Tyrion as Hand: For all his scheming, Pycelle is not the most astute political analyst. He simply underestimated Tyrion and the formal backing he had, and he had grown accustomed to the thought that Cersei was Tywin's best agent in King's Landing, nor did he seem to consider why Tyrion was sent in the first place.

[Naathi Prince]

Pycelle hero-worshipped Tywin Lannister. He thought he was the greatest leader Westeros ever had, and became utterly loyal to him.

[not in the face]

That is the genius of Tywin Lannister. There is also the maester in White harbor that is a Lannister. Send your lesser relatives to the Citadel to be maesters then have them sent out to all the houses of Westeros to gather intel for you.

[Theda Baratheon]

I don't necessarily think he's a Lannister man. But he's definitely a Tywin man.

[Jslay427]

I think during the mad kings reign Pycelle saw how it was, that Tywin was running the realm, and sought to ally himself with him, knowing that going against Tywin would not turn out well. Before that, I bet he was loyal to the IT.

[ckongo]

Pycelle is just loyal to the Lannisters. I don't really know why. It just seems to ruin his reputation. He actually got scolded for letting Jon Arryn die and telling Arys to open the gates for Tywin.

[Beorn Snow]

The most likely and most popular reason is simply that Pycelle admired Tywin and thought he and the realm were better served with him in charge.

It is most likely, althought I´d like it if he was doing the citadel´s work and that the citadel had wanted the Targaryens dead, and a stable rule without them.

Edit: But let´s not forget that a maester swears an oath to serve the castle of each holdfast. Maester Luwin has to give Theon sound advice although he might prefer the starks. If Joffrey is king, then Pycelle has to serve him and his family loyally. Same if Tommen is king etc.

[Hempen Dan the Ropemaker]

Has he told the citadel the truth about Joffrey Myrcella and tommen? I think he has.

Maesters talk about everything in their letter. This of halfmaester in griffins roost at a out of the way castle he basically learns everything that is happening. The maesters tell everything to each other, pyrcelle told the archmaesters and they r keeping the secret.

[Victor227]

I've my doubts about Pycelle being of a Westerland family. That's absolutely the sort of thing Varys would have picked up on and used to help feed Aerys' paranoia.

[Zman1863]

I don't think he would have to be connected to the family by blood or alliance ties to have come to the conclusion that the Lannisters were a good team to root for. I think he was just smart enough to know that Tywin was someone you shouldn't bet against and in whom loyalty would be well placed. It makes less sense to me that he let this translate to becoming Cersei's creature; that got his beloved beard cut. But perhaps he saw serving Cersei as serving Tywin.

[Naathi Prince]

I don't think he would have to be connected to the family by blood or alliance ties to have come to the conclusion that the Lannisters were a good team to root for. I think he was just smart enough to know that Tywin was someone you shouldn't bet against and in whom loyalty would be well placed. It makes less sense to me that he let this translate to becoming Cersei's creature; that got his beloved beard cut. But perhaps he saw serving Cersei as serving Tywin.

I think he did see serving Cersei as serving Tywin, What is a bigger question is why he didn't see Joffrey for what he was.

[Lady Shadow Cat]

Actually I always thought, that Pycelle wasn't really completely pro-Lannister but instead loyal to the citadel in Oldtown and the citadel was always Anti-Targaryen, because of their dragons. After all they despise the magic that might come with them. (I think this was mentioned in the books at some time). The citadel always had their own view on things (Lady Dustin mentions that to Theon as well). Aegon and maybe Rhaegar as well had planned to revive the dragons, something the citadel had to prevent!

That would explain, why he wanted Aerys to open the gates to Tywin.

Also he was loyal to competent Lannisters, like Tywin and Kevan, simply because with them on top of the realm as Hands, it was most likely that the Targaryens would be kept out of the realm.

When he realized, how incompetent Cersei really was, he was quick to object against some of her foolish plans.

So... why would he let Jon Arryn die and why was he clearly working against Ned?

I think that he wanted the realm to stay stable. He definitely knew that Arryn found out about the true father of Cersei's kids and if that came out, it would come to a civil war (what actually happened in the end). The same happened with Ned, although Pycelle, like most of the other members of the small council (except Littlefinger, who always wanted chaos) didn't want Ned to die... with Ned as a hostage, they could have ended the war faster.

Though his concern wasn't really about the realm, I think he was more worried, that the Targaryens might come back in the confusion of this war.

So yeah, I think he was simply Anti-Targaryen from the beginning and allied with the Lannisters because it helped him to achieve his goals.

I could be wrong, but I guess we will see, once the citadel sends a new Grand Maester to Kings Landing. ;)

I like your thoughts about the Citadel not wanting Targs/dragons back. I think this makes more sense than simply saying-He's Tywin's ,man. The Citadel is definitely up to something.

[Sansa_Stark]

I like your thoughts about the Citadel not wanting Targs/dragons back. I think this makes more sense than simply saying-He's Tywin's ,man. The Citadel is definitely up to something.

I think so too. I don't think Pycelle wanted the Lannisters in power because they were best for the realm.... If he wanted to avoid war and was looking in the realm's best interest, he would have simply ratted the Lannisters out. Despite the fact that he was a worm and corrupt as hell, I don't his reputation wasn't completely awful.

[Lord Martin]

Pycelle's motivation is that he knew that Tywin was the ideal ruler of the 7 kingdoms. But I like the suggestion that the Citadel exploited this and hoped Pycell's proTywin stance could harm the Targaryen establishment.

[thecryptile]

Wow... I never thought that Pycelle was a hatchetman for the Citadels anti-Targ policies... but now I do! that's why I come to this forum! Great theories!