Isael92 Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 On the chance that Jon really is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna does that make him the true heir to the throne? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StannisandDaeny Posted April 23, 2013 Share Posted April 23, 2013 On the chance that Jon really is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna does that make him the true heir to the throne?He's taken the Black, thus, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maegor the Cuddly Posted April 24, 2013 Share Posted April 24, 2013 He's taken the Black, thus, no.Basically. And if they were unmarried he'd be legally a bastard child anyways. Plus, there was that whole, "War of the Usurper" in which the kid's possible dynasty was kinda overthrown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolanDeschain14 Posted April 26, 2013 Share Posted April 26, 2013 If he were to forsake the Black brotherhood, then I think yes. Ned never got a chance to tell his bastard who his mother was. He may have been with the fisherman's daughter or whoever but I think Jon is really Ned's nephew and Rheagar's son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedChick Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I believe that Jon is Rhaegar's son as well. I'm just done with the first book and the hints that Martin drops makes me believe that Lyanna died during childbirth and Ned's overall demeanor toward the Jon Snow situation made me feel like there was more to the story. Don't know if I can comment on Jon having a claim to the throne though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avb Posted April 30, 2013 Share Posted April 30, 2013 Why would ned hide the fact jon wasn't his from cat she resented ned for bringing jon up with his legit children would it not have been easier just to tell her Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siknes Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 Why would ned hide the fact jon wasn't his from cat she resented ned for bringing jon up with his legit children would it not have been easier just to tell herIt was better that course,or chance having his friend king Robert find out and kill his nephew. Rae. and Lyanna had to of gotten married because it is told later that the three Kingsguard are there and will not throw down their swords(protecting heir(S). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winterz Posted May 1, 2013 Share Posted May 1, 2013 There are way too many aiming for the throne wether it is by right of contest or by next in line, it really doesn't matter.Stannis would rightfully be next in the Baratheon line after Robert but Robert isn't King anymore nor was he the previous.IMO the Lannister usurped the throne and so it makes it right by contest too though far less legitimate. And their approach for usurping the throne was also different than Robert's but anyway, if Tommen dies the succession may fall to one of his uncles or perhaps the Queen? No idea.In the Targaryen lineage, Jon would be first in line if R+L=J is true but if not Aegon is the next one, that, if he's not fake.Anyway, there's something that confuses me. I don't get it why people say that Stannis is rightful heir to Robert yet also say Jon would be rightful heir if R+L=J is true. If Jon is the next in line even though he's bastard, wouldn't that make Edric Storm also above Stannis is the Baratheon line? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woftis Posted May 3, 2013 Share Posted May 3, 2013 God no.Targs were rulers by right of conquest, the Baratheons took T7K by the same rightJon is a member of the NW and thus relinquished right to lands or titlesThere's no such thing as a true heir - if you have the most muscle, you have the throne.On top of R+L we need proof that a marriage was conductedand finally a later books spoiler (I 100% do not recommend you read this, it's a BIG spoiler): If Aegon is indeed genuine, which many posters doubt, he would be the Targ heir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bahlrokhin Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Jon has no apparent right to the Iron Throne. However, he can take it by conquest if he is able. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Elsa Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 On the chance that Jon really is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna does that make him the true heir to the throne? The Night's Watch says, "No." The Iron Borns say, "He must pay it with the Iron price." The Baratheons and Lannisters say, "The Targaryens rule no more." Dorne would think it was Elia's children. The rest of the Great Houses, Kingdoms, Lords/Ladies would support someone who could give them the best benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coatzin Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 It puts him over Dany in the line of succession... but since Robert Baratheon conquered the realm they both are heir to nothing. IMO the Lannister usurped the throne and so it makes it right by contest too though far less legitimate. And their approach for usurping the throne was also different than Robert's but anyway, if Tommen dies the succession may fall to one of his uncles or perhaps the Queen? No idea. As far as the realm is concerned Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen are Baratheons... no usurping there for the Lannisters. If all of them died without heir then it goes to uncle Stannis :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheNiggardlyBastard Posted December 25, 2013 Share Posted December 25, 2013 He's taken the Black, thus, no. I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 There are way too many aiming for the throne wether it is by right of contest or by next in line, it really doesn't matter.Stannis would rightfully be next in the Baratheon line after Robert but Robert isn't King anymore nor was he the previous.... Uh... no spoilers for the later books. You're in the AGOT section. IMO the Lannister usurped the throne and so it makes it right by contest too though far less legitimate. And their approach for usurping the throne was also different than Robert's but anyway, if Tommen dies the succession may fall to one of his uncles or perhaps the Queen? No idea.If Tommen dies, Myrcella is next in line. Unless you're subscribing to the Dornish rules of succession, like Arianne tried to, in which case Myrcella should have been the queen already, since she's older than Tommen. Cersei and the rest of the Lannisters have no claim to the throne whatsoever, and Joffrey, Myrcella and Tommen would have had no claim to the throne either if it were proven that they were Jaime's bastards. If all of Cersei's kids die or are proven not to be real Baratheons, Stannis is officially the rightful king; if you believe Robert was and believe in the rules of succession (i.e. if you don't accept that the Targaryens heirs have more right than the Baratheon heirs). Anyway, there's something that confuses me. I don't get it why people say that Stannis is rightful heir to Robert yet also say Jon would be rightful heir if R+L=J is true. If Jon is the next in line even though he's bastard, wouldn't that make Edric Storm also above Stannis is the Baratheon line? Bastards have no right to the throne, unless they are legitimized. People who think Jon would be the rightful heir believe that Rhaegar and Lyanna got married (since polygamy used to be practiced by the Targaryens before, although it hadn't been a long time). But even if that were the case, his Nightwatch vows mean that he's given up all claims to any crowns or lordships. Otherwise Maester Aemon would have become the king 70 years ago. There is a distant possibility of releasing people from the NW vows, but it's rare and unlikely. Besides, would Jon even want to be a king? He's very dedicated to his NW duty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Akalya Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Jon's taken the black so even if l+r=j is true n rhaegar had married lyanna and Jon was a trueborn ,it still doesn't matter as taking the black means renouncing all claims so AEGON is the heir. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Annara Snow Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 Jon's taken the black so even if l+r=j is true n rhaegar had married lyanna and Jon was a trueborn ,it still doesn't matter as taking the black means renouncing all claims so AEGON is the heir. Dead people aren't heirs to anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ogi Posted January 2, 2014 Share Posted January 2, 2014 By what right does the throne belong to you? You take it and give some excuse that it belongs to you (so anyone with some Targ/Baratheon blood would have that excuse/claim). Do not read the spoiler! You little rebel. I like you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliemental Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 On the chance that Jon really is the son of Rhaegar and Lyanna does that make him the true heir to the throne? I've been using 15th Century English laws of succession (I know GRRM based a lot of the series events on Wars of the Roses). So, I assume Jon would be barred from the throne due to his illegitimacy. Dany would be rightful heir due to being the Mad King's daughter born directly into the legitimate bloodline. Jon, even if legitimate, would be his grandson (I think; if I have the relations right). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ko Rakharo Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Again assuming Jon is legitimate and a Targaryen: the sole fact that he's a man gives him priority over Dany at any time; we're not in Dorne. Dany has no right over any trueborn man. Besides, the Targaryens were essentially exiled. Any one of them coming back without armies (or dragons) would probably get killed or sent to the NW (hey, Jon) right away, even after King Robert's gone. Just to correct the dude above me, he's Aerys' grandson, yes, but being son of Rhaegar (firstborn) he has priority over his aunt Daenerys. And again, Dany is a girl :( Lastly, all the Seven Kingdoms agreed when Robert claimed the Iron Throne. That makes Stannis (or perhaps Joffrey, considering few people know and even less believe he's a Waters and not a Baratheon) the rightful king, both by blood and manpower. Houses Tyrell and Frey are, for me, the best examples of how the 'goodness' of all claims is based on power, and not on blood in Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elliemental Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Right of Conquest can come into this. If Dany is successful with her invasion, she wins by right of conquest regardless of who ranks above her in the bloodline (as did Henry VII and William the Conqueror - to give real life examples; the Conqueror was even illegitimate). Does Westoros have Salic Law (or an equivalent)? :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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