Akal Colzet Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Being trained by a master at arms in a castle most definitely means he's above average swordsmanship. You do realize the majority of soldiers are just farmhands and shit like that right?That would depend on how average is defined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys' Pecker Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Jon is a fifteen year old boy who has spent the last year fighting untrained thieves. There's very little to indicate that he's anything above average in swordsmanship. He's no Jaime Lannister.Mance did to him what pretty much every knight (including people like Meryn Trant) or trained adult male in Westeros would do. Jon was only surprised because he overestimates his own swordsmanship.Edit: And why is Victarion being brought up? He got outdueled and maimed by Talbert Serry.I agree with you on Jon, he's not as good as the fans think he is. As for Victarion vs Serry? Well Victarion wins because he caught the sword with his FREAKING hand then manhandled Serry and promptly threw him overboard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagon Greyjoy Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Serry fought honorably, Serry fought nobly, Serry fought valiantly... And Serry lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeWareOfMyHouse Posted April 27, 2013 Author Share Posted April 27, 2013 Not only did he try to take the top of a little girl's head, he failed to do so. His ego is so over the top it's ridiculous.You have to wonder if Darkstar Dayne really just gave himself that nickname ;)Yeah, I'm getting on the Mance Rayder bandwaggon now. He might be getting a little bit older, but I hardly see a young challenger coming in to take his place. I agree that Sandor Clegane is better than Gregor, but so far as we know those two are both dead (Knowing GRRM, they'll both be Un-Cleganes before the end of it, though.)I never said Victarion, or any other notable battle commander, was disqualified. I simply said using their famous victories on the field as the sole argument was illogical, because we're talking about the best one-on-one fighters.That being said, I'd put a portion of my money on Bronze Yohn Royce at this point. He sounds like a badass from the Vale that really hasn't been talked too much about yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys' Pecker Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Serry fought honorably, Serry fought nobly, Serry fought valiantly... And Serry lost.Exactly, we're talking fighters here. I judge based on the hard results of the fights not the aftermath or what ifs. Example: Oberyn danced, spun, dizzied Gregor with his amazing agility and skill. But at the end of the day he still got his skull bashed in by the latter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leagon Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I agree with you on Jon, he's not as good as the fans think he is. As for Victarion vs Serry? Well Victarion wins because he caught the sword with his FREAKING hand then manhandled Serry and promptly threw him overboard.He brought a hand to a swordfight. While it worked out for him this time, I can't imagine its the sort of habit that any long-lived man has ever had.Serry fought honorably, Serry fought nobly, Serry fought valiantly... And Serry lost.Hahahaha....awesome. I need to start using that quote in my daily life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jason Ironborn. Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I think it's between Areo Hotah, Garlan Tyrell, Mance Rayer, and Harris Harlaw. Corbray, the Blackfish, and a few others are definitely in the mix as well.Hotah seems like a true badass with his wife in his hands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys' Pecker Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 He brought a hand to a swordfight. While it worked out for him this time, I can't imagine its the sort of habit that any long-lived man has ever had.I see your point but it worked on Serry. It was obviously a once in a lifetime move (or rarer than that though Halfhand did it), but would Serry have killed him on another occasion? Maybe Victarion would have killed him cleanly on another? That's the point of Ice and Fire, a great warrior could face death at any moment no matter how good he is.Still, with the evidence in front of me, I go with Victarion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leagon Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 I see your point but it worked on Serry. It was obviously a once in a lifetime move (or rarer than that though Halfhand did it), but would Serry have killed him on another occasion? Maybe Victarion would have killed him cleanly on another? That's the point of Ice and Fire, a great warrior could face death at any moment no matter how good he is.Still, with the evidence in front of me, I go with Victarion.I'd pick Victarion over Serry 9 times out of 10.But someone who gets disarmed then maimed against Talbert Serry - even if they still win - is not, imo, one of the elite warriors of Westeros.But who knows, maybe Serry was a badass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 The description of the ironborn in battle makes them look almost superhuman. It's actually weird. Vic x Serry was a one time thing, though... I don't know if it's all that consistent. Anyway, there should be some pretty good ironborn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Varys' Pecker Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 The description of the ironborn in battle makes them look almost superhuman. It's actually weird. Vic x Serry was a one time thing, though... I don't know if it's all that consistent. Anyway, there should be some pretty good ironborn.Haven't the Ironborn been consistently described as fierce and hard warriors but poor soldiers? I think that nails them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecryptile Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 The only objection to Victarion and the Iron Fleet's men, is that they aren't in Westeros, right now they are in the Slaver's Bay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Reaver Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 By "westeros" I understood "GRRM'S world", but I suppose if you're going to be a stickler about it...Then again, I don't see people making objections when Barristan's name comes up, and he's in Essos too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecryptile Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 We're talking post-AFFC here. Who's the best FIGHTER alive in Westeros in 300-301 AL?Sword, axe, fire, whatever. Please note that at this point Jaime Lannister has one hand, Barristan Selmy is on the verge of applying for membership to the AARP, and we're not talking about being a battle commander. Someone like Stannis Baratheon or Victarion Greyjoy doesn't get to be the best one-on-one fighter just because he's a proven commander.People like the Dothraki and/or Jorah Mormont don't count, because they're not in Westeros.'nuff said Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BastardWithNoName Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Garlan is the best despite never having fought anyone of note and killing a bunch of fleeing enemies at the Blackwater. The answer is Jaqen H'ghar.Definately Jaqen, his business is killing and business is good. If character are allowed to use magic or special abillities I would say Jon snow as he can warg Ghost as he fights and who can beat a giant direwolf as well as a capable swordsmen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jorah the Explorer Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Jason Mallister Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Stark Posted April 27, 2013 Share Posted April 27, 2013 Jaqen H'ghar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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