Reviewing Kissed by Fire

[Westeros]

As HBO only provided us the first four episodes of the new season, from here on out our Game of Thrones episode guides will get update only after the initial airing. We hope to be able to get at least the analysis and book-to-screen up by the time the west coast airing is completed, but the extensive recap tends to take rather longer than that, and will probably not appear until later on Monday.

Until then, however, we’ve now posted our book to screen information on the episode guide fror “Kissed by Fire”.

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[Conchobar]

Great great episode! And nice review !

[boojam]

Great episode.

Roughly, very roughly, 38 chapters in.

With five episodes to go.

That's kinda fast.

If chapter 52 is Episode 9 lot of territory , tho there is a lot Jon, Sam and Bran for 6, 7 and 8.

Dany's chapter in between could be elaborated more.

If we get to chapter 56 in episode 10 , that's 70% of SoS.

Now I began to wonder how much of books 4 and 5 are going to be pulled forward.

So that makes me wonder what Dave , Dan and Bryan talked to George about lately in Santa Fe?

Even making a mint on the show, HBO is now probably asked Dave and Dan about the end game.

George maybe now has all the money he needs? ... but it hard to see an author letting a show over-run his books.

Unless GRRM is going to finish Winds this year.

I am guessing that season 4 will be a hit too, and HBO will have no problem with giving a go for season 5.

But it's starting to look like , not sure, 7 seasons top, tho I can see 8 as a hard stop.

Puzzled.

[King Aemon I]

Ridiculous with numbers... They said Renly had 100.000 men.. And now Tyrells -according to this episode- have 12.000 foot and 1800 riders.. All together less than 20k.. So what now, Baratheon bannermen had 80.000???

And how can Karstarks hold half of Northern army?

[Little Wing]

Awesome episode!

I'm really happy with the Beric and Hound duel... I watched breathlessly! And Arya and Gendry..... maybe a tad too much said there, but emotional nonetheless. I really appreciate how much Ned gets mentioned all around, from that cave, to KL....

Another cave scene that hasn't disappointed is Ygritte and Jon's - first time I cared a bit for showYgritte...

Jaime and Brienne in the bath was... just. perfect!!! More of this on the show, please!

I could go on and on... it's easier to say what I didn't like, because everything else was so good... that weird Frankenstein moment with Selyse made me lol... so, didn't like it, but I agree that Loras jumping in bed with that squire is out of character...

Like all the introductions - Selyse is spot on, Shireen is adorable and I really liked her interaction with Stannis and Davos, and Grey Worm was great! A storm of awesome performances, truly, all around!

[Ran]

I've given up trying to make sense of the logistics of the War of the Five Kings in the show. It's an utter mess. I just don't think they care very much about getting the figures right, and just drop whatever number sounds good to them at the time.

[Dragonstoned]

Doubt there were many unsullied at home with their abacuses out. The showrunners don't appear bothered with the strategy and movements or the numbers and are just doing the individual fights and human drama, but it's approach that makes sense.

Even in the books there's unbelievable military material (cough, Rodrik Cassel).

[King Aemon I]

I've given up trying to make sense of the logistics of the War of the Five Kings in the show. It's an utter mess. I just don't think they care very much about getting the figures right, and just drop whatever number sounds good to them at the time.

True entirely.. But it is unbelievable how creators of such a good show can be so stupid about numbers? Even while they have books in front of them they can easily follow..

[eaglestate]

Great character development in this episode. The bath scene was incredible. Gave such depth to the "Kingslayer." Before he was so adept at bull shitting everyone, but he was brutally honest during that scene and the actor portrayed it so well. I also loved The Hound and Beric fight.

[briantw]

I've given up trying to make sense of the logistics of the War of the Five Kings in the show. It's an utter mess. I just don't think they care very much about getting the figures right, and just drop whatever number sounds good to them at the time.

I just generally think it doesn't matter. I barely pay attention to the numbers when I watch the show because they're largely insignificant, and I can't imagine the average casual viewer who hasn't read the books is paying more attention than I am.

Bottom line:

Starks losing troops

Lannisters winning the war

Greyjoys doing something

Stannis doing nothing

You really don't need to know much more than that to follow the war on the show.

[Ran]

And yet they have Sophie Turner's corset -- never seen until season 2, and barely then -- sewn with little details like the dragonfly from the get go, in a Peter Jackson's LotR-esque attention to detail.

They have a weird myopia. The production team pays attention to a lot of tiny details, at their direction, and yet they leave some rather significant background details as plot holes for no apparently good reason. It's quite strange.

[FuriousGeorge]

Weakest episode of the season so far IMO. Scene between Jon and Ygritte was very cringeworthy (can't remember if she robs his sword in the books but if she does i think they should have changed it because it just looked ridiculous when put on camera - like they were 5 year olds playing kiss chase). I know you can't predict the books from decisions made by the people who make the show but every week I find it more difficult to believe that D&D would have cast Kit Harrington as Jon Snow if they knew Jon Snow was going to become the central character of the whole series. Bit where Jaime cried about being judged by Ned Stark also didn't feel right to me I envisaged that very differently but that scene seems to have gone down well with most people so that is probably just me.

[Joyful Union]

True entirely.. But it is unbelievable how creators of such a good show can be so stupid about numbers? Even while they have books in front of them they can easily follow..

How are they stupid at numbers? All they did is make the Karstark's much more important as a fighting force. I also think that the numbers supplied by Olenna were excluding Tyrell bannerman.

The thing that is most confusing about the war in the show, is the geography. I have no idea where the Ironborn are supposed to be, apart from Deepwood Motte. The situation in the Westerlands last season was equally confusing.

[DurararaFTW]

Ridiculous with numbers... They said Renly had 100.000 men.. And now Tyrells -according to this episode- have 12.000 foot and 1800 riders.. All together less than 20k.. So what now, Baratheon bannermen had 80.000???

And how can Karstarks hold half of Northern army?

Stannis said all of Renly's bannermen defected to him save the Tyrells. i assume he include those of the Reach. Now all these people defected again after Stannis lost but not because of the Tyrells sayso. So Olenna is probably talking about the Tyrell household exclusively rather then all the Reach.

What Robb is spouting is nonsense tho.

[Abaddon]

Ridiculous with numbers... They said Renly had 100.000 men.. And now Tyrells -according to this episode- have 12.000 foot and 1800 riders.. All together less than 20k.. So what now, Baratheon bannermen had 80.000???

What's ridiculous is how harsh some are in criticizing something they evidently didn't even bother to listen carefully to. Here's the quote:

What is it, 12,000 infantrymen the Tyrell family has supplied, 1800 mounted lancers, 2000 in support...

It's blindingly obvious that Oleanna is talking about a portion of the overall Tyrell force that has been "supplied" to unite in defense of the kingdom. Not the entire force. It is left unsaid what percentage of the Tyrell forces has been supplied, but it's obviously not their entire army.

I agree that they are pretty sloppy with the force numbers and the war strategy, but if you're going to complain, you should at least attempt to make it a valid complaint.

Stannis said all of Renly's bannermen defected to him save the Tyrells. i assume he include those of the Reach. Now all these people defected again after Stannis lost but not because of the Tyrells sayso. So Olenna is probably talking about the Tyrell household exclusively rather then all the Reach.

That's a very good point as well.

[Beric Zoolander]

Weakest episode of the season so far IMO. Scene between Jon and Ygritte was very cringeworthy (can't remember if she robs his sword in the books but if she does i think they should have changed it because it just looked ridiculous when put on camera - like they were 5 year olds playing kiss chase)...

I actually thought the stealing of the sword bit which IIRC is not how it happens in the book, worked well, and yes it was like 5 year olds, but I think that was absolutely the point and it worked really well. Also that whole scene in the cave was pretty true to the book I thought.

I enjoyed this episode, just about half-way we are going to really be ramping up to the big finale at this point, the fight between the Hound and Beric was good as was Jaime's scene.

I'm still confused the way they are using Robb's tactics, they really mixed them up from the book.. NOW he's planning on going west to Casterly Rock, really interesting they way they are handling it. I guess they'll drag out his trip to the Twins over the next few episodes.

Was Selmy in fact not on the Small Counsel or was he lying to Jorah?

I also thought it was interesting they are giving Shireen, Patchface lines.

[Abaddon]

Was Selmy in fact not on the Small Counsel or was he lying to Jorah?

In the show, he was not on the Small Counsel. It is unclear whether he is aware of the arrangement with Jorah but it seems likely from the scene that he does know.

[FuriousGeorge]

I actually thought the stealing of the sword bit which IIRC is not how it happens in the book, worked well, and yes it was like 5 year olds, but I think that was absolutely the point and it worked really well. Also that whole scene in the cave was pretty true to the book I thought.

Don't get me wrong the scene was well constructed and pretty true to the books but Kit Harrington is just a shit actor in my opinion. I do not think he was meant to looks as ridiculous as he did when chasing Ygritte into the cave. Rosa Leslie is actually wicked though.

In the show, he was not on the Small Counsel. It is unclear whether he is aware of the arrangement with Jorah but it seems likely from the scene that he does.

Yup I think we can safely assume that was Selmy trying to get Mormont to go quietly before forcing the issue.

[Bayard]

Ridiculous with numbers... They said Renly had 100.000 men.. And now Tyrells -according to this episode- have 12.000 foot and 1800 riders.. All together less than 20k.. So what now, Baratheon bannermen had 80.000???

And how can Karstarks hold half of Northern army?

Well, you could say that those 20.000 are the Tyrell troops given to the Lannisters... so, Randyl Tarly's army, which is guarding the border with the Riverlands.

Anyway, brilliant review, I agree with it 100% (a first :) )

[PatrickStormborn]

Ridiculous with numbers... They said Renly had 100.000 men.. And now Tyrells -according to this episode- have 12.000 foot and 1800 riders.. All together less than 20k.. So what now, Baratheon bannermen had 80.000???

And how can Karstarks hold half of Northern army?

I *hope* that what they mean is 12,000 foot and 1,800 riders have been contributed to the army and the rest have been sent home.

Karstark having half the Northern army, however, is just ridiculous.