Heresy 53

[addicted to snow]

On the topic of Souls in GRRM's Westeros: I think many will agree that Roose is up to something - that is that Roose has a card of some kind (likely sorcery based) that he intends to play at some point. GRRM has certainly laid the groundwork for this...

I think that Roose has a 'Robert-Strong-Like' creation under the Dreadfort. I think that when Roose is killed or at a time of his choosing, Roose's soul will revert into this creature... who is probably based largely off of Domeric...

[theriveryeti]

From an Iron Man 3 on Facebook fake-newsfeed:

Tony Stark: I have to leave.

Peppert Potts: Where are you going?

Tony Stark: Robb just left for war and there must always be a Stark in Winterfell!

:lmao:

http://www.funnyordi...tures_and_words

Watch out, Ramsay!

[wolfmaid7]

Yeah Roose gives me the heebie Jeebies, i was reading Theon's account of him.

His face was clean shaved, smooth skinned, ordinary, not handsome but not quite plain . Though Roose had been in battles, he bore no scars. Though well past forty, he was as yet unwrinkled, with scarce a line to tell of the passage of time. His lips were so thin that when he pressed them together they seem to vanish altogether.

There was an agelessness to about him, a stillness; on Roose Bolton’s face, rage and joy looked much the same. All he and Ramsay had in common were their eyes. His eyes are ice. Reek wondered if he ever cried. If so, do the tears feel cold upon his cheeks.

Firstly,how the hell could you be in numerous battles and have "no scars" to show,no wrinkles. What is this guys juicing regime?

I have no idea where the rest of my text went,but on the topic of Roose.

In the non canonized books there is a extended story concerning the "first son".

[redriver]

The question of the weirdwoods isn't that important anyway. If what Bloodraven said is true, when Bran is at full capacity, he won't need them to be able to see.

I don't think that's the case.He said he would be able to see beyond the weirwoods themselves.Not quite the same thing.

For example I think he could,using the heart tree in Winterfell,leave the tree and see all of the castle.The only other way is warging animals,but no doubt he could leave the tree and warg the nearest raven.

[Black Wolf Smith]

http://www.funnyordi...tures_and_words

I liked the one where he didn't remember Hawkeye, and then called him a want a be Robin hood pansy.

There were certainly heart trees in the godswoods, but were they actual weirwoods?

No they weren't, but didn't Bryn Blackwood say that he could see thru other trees, and Bran could in time?

:commie: :commie: :commie: Congrats on 6K :commie: :commie: :commie:

ETA: first time all week I been able to get on, and not have problems, got a lot of catching up to do.

[Black Crow]

What evidence do we have about WWs not using the apparent methos the Fire lot uses? It'd seem that the 'BSs' the body and memories from the original human being, I'd even say that there's no destruction of the previous being, rather a change, an enhance on the original person. And there's Craster's wifes/daughters calling the WWs as Gilly's son's brothers, wich persuades us into thinking they weren't sacrificed as in killed, but sacrificed as in offered. Again I humbly ask, because I'm not getting it, which hints are you following to conclude they may be killed/drained?

There are essentially three opinions as to what happens. There are still some who violently argue that Craster was just killing them off. Then there is the draining of life force, and thirdly there's what Gilly's mother tells Sam about the White Shadows being Craster's sons.

I'm inclined to believe her. In the first place its in the text and so far not contradicted. Secondly its consistent with the cold preserves while fire consumes theme, and thirdly, its very consistent with the need in Celtic folklore for the Sidhe or Otherlanders to take humans (changelings) either as servants or to replace their own losses.

ETA: and its also consistent with their counterparts, the Red Shadows (of the desert) being likewise transformed.

[Little Wing]

Ah, I hate it when life gets in the way of my Heresy.... haven't been around, just popped in to share this nice piece of fan art of our friends, the Others from the Prologue :)

[Tyryan Lannister]

Ah, I hate it when life gets in the way of my Heresy.... haven't been around, just popped in to share this nice piece of fan art of our friends, the Others from the Prologue :)

I like that so much better than the show's Ice-Tree People--but there's probably a reason for them being treeish

EDIT: also, is it just me, or does it look like they're holding slim, blue lightsabers?

[Lord Martin Sheol]

EDIT: also, is it just me, or does it look like they're holding slim, blue lightsabers?

May the 4th be with you! And the WWs ^_^ Awesome fan art!

[Hrafntýr]

There are essentially three opinions as to what happens. There are still some who violently argue that Craster was just killing them off. Then there is the draining of life force, and thirdly there's what Gilly's mother tells Sam about the White Shadows being Craster's sons.

I'm inclined to believe her. In the first place its in the text and so far not contradicted. Secondly its consistent with the cold preserves while fire consumes theme, and thirdly, its very consistent with the need in Celtic folklore for the Sidhe or Otherlanders to take humans (changelings) either as servants or to replace their own losses.

ETA: and its also consistent with their counterparts, the Red Shadows (of the desert) being likewise transformed.

I guess that I'm not sure that I think there's necessarily a difference between options two and three. Nor do I thin that Gilly's mother's comments point to some clear difference. We don't really know how Mel and Moqorro became as they are, or at what point in their lives they became fireflesh. I know we have the case of Victarion to consider, but I'm in wait and see mode until his behavior comes to resemble other fireflesh beings.

I understand the argument that if the WWs already have the magic to turn little babies into whatever the WWs form is, then this would be the process of making iceflesh. But it could just as easily be an incorporation of the babies into an already existent WW, and Gilly's mom's comment would still make sense without her being figured as some superstitious dumb old lady. I don't think of older women that way, or look down upon their knowledge at all! I just think that what she's saying is simply that there's some relationship between the WWs and Crastor's sons.

[Hrafntýr]

No they weren't, but didn't Bryn Blackwood say that he could see thru other trees, and Bran could in time?

Some of the heart trees are weirwoods. I'm pretty sure that Robb is before a weirwood heart tree at Riverrun, and Arya before one at Harrenhal. And Brienne definitely sees a young weirwood at the Whispers, though as an abandoned site, that may no longer be part of any godswood.

[Black Crow]

Yeah, I've found it. Arya is practising her "dancing" in the godswood at Harrenhal and there are various references to it.

[Black Crow]

I guess that I'm not sure that I think there's necessarily a difference between options two and three. Nor do I think that Gilly's mother's comments point to some clear difference. We don't really know how Mel and Moqorro became as they are, or at what point in their lives they became fireflesh. I know we have the case of Victarion to consider, but I'm in wait and see mode until his behavior comes to resemble other fireflesh beings.

Judging by Victarion's experience there's a fairly involved magical process, and I wonder if its a matter of putting fire inside. Mel's recollections seem to suggest it was painful and although I don't think its canon Selyse prays to have her sins cleansed by fire. In the case of Craster's boys I'm thinking of Adara, with Winter inside her. Different story same concept.

[Joken79]

We know that the Others can be killed by dragonglass.

But what might be a weapon against those like Melissandre?

Quote from Melissandre:

"Dragonglass. Frozen fire, in the tongue of old Valyria. Small wonder it is anathema to these cold children of the Other.”

What is the opposite of "frozen fire"?

It's also interesting that Melissandre didn't know that the dragonglass can kill the Others . I think that the fiery ones should know their enemy.

[Profion]

frozen fire is oppose to melted ice? So, Water? xD

[Black Crow]

Didn't seem to do Moqorro any harm. There is of course the story of the dark-eyed youth preparing some weirwood arrows, but I do wonder about bone/antler daggers.

[Joken79]

frozen fire is oppose to melted ice? So, Water? xD

Sounds logical, but I fear that's to simple. :laugh:

[Joken79]

Didn't seem to do Moqorro any harm. There is of course the story of the dark-eyed youth preparing some weirwood arrows, but I do wonder about bone/antler daggers.

It was indeed a post above who mentioned the bone dagger of Val who got me thinking about a weapon against the fiery ones. But I found no satisfying reason why bone should kill them.

[nedhed]

We know that the Others can be killed by dragonglass.

But what might be a weapon against those like Melissandre?

Quote from Melissandre:

"Dragonglass. Frozen fire, in the tongue of old Valyria. Small wonder it is anathema to these cold children of the Other.”

What is the opposite of "frozen fire"?

It's also interesting that Melissandre didn't know that the dragonglass can kill the Others . I think that the fiery ones should know their enemy.

Absolute zero wind cold enough to freeze stuff instantly ( prob burns to) kinda like fire is like really really hot heat, capable of turning of turning other things into fire?

[nedhed]

Yeah Roose gives me the heebie Jeebies, i was reading Theon's account of him.

His face was clean shaved, smooth skinned, ordinary, not handsome but not quite plain . Though Roose had been in battles, he bore no scars. Though well past forty, he was as yet unwrinkled, with scarce a line to tell of the passage of time. His lips were so thin that when he pressed them together they seem to vanish altogether.

There was an agelessness to about him, a stillness; on Roose Bolton’s face, rage and joy looked much the same. All he and Ramsay had in common were their eyes. His eyes are ice. Reek wondered if he ever cried. If so, do the tears feel cold upon his cheeks.

Firstly,how the hell could you be in numerous battles and have "no scars" to show,no wrinkles. What is this guys juicing regime?

I have no idea where the rest of my text went,but on the topic of Roose.

In the non canonized books there is a extended story concerning the "first son".

Isn't there a theory that it has to do with putting his blood in leaches and burning ( or freezing) them? Blood magic