Most Powerful Person in ASOIAF as of ADWD

[Axeingar]

Militarily - Mace, Aegon, Then DT ( not counting her dragons)

Politically - High Sparrow, LF,and Vary's

Magically - Bloodraven, Bran, and Mel

Wildcards - Arya, Tyrion, Jon Snow ( no way is he dead), Cat, Dany with control of dragons.

[Jasta11]

Varys.

[Nictarion]

We don't know. Torrhen bent the knee.

Exactly. If it was as easy as just roll out some wargs and take command of the dragons I'm sure it would have been tried.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Bloodraven and Bran the newbie

Exactly. If it was as easy as just roll out some wargs and take command of the dragons I'm sure it would have been tried.

oh! do we know how many wargs were around to "roll them out"? Do we know if there was even one warg around?

[Nictarion]

Bloodraven and Bran the newbie

oh! do we know how many wargs were around to "roll them out"? Do we know if there was even one warg around?

I'm sure there were some wargs around. Especially with the presence of the dragons most likely strengthening the power of magic in the realm. But you are right, its all speculation. We just don't know.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I'm sure there were some wargs around. Especially with the presence of the dragons most likely strengthening the power of magic in the realm. But you are right, its all speculation. We just don't know.

so you don't know you assume and imagine without an actual evidence.

If we can just imagine and assuming what we want maybe there were 100 wargs around but there were babies 2 and younger. There is that possibility right? So, how can someone send infants to warg a dragon.

Also you don't know if the dragons strengthen the magic or the magic strengthen the dragons.

[Nictarion]

so you don't know you assume and imagine without an actual evidence. If we can just imagine what we want maybe there were 100 wargs around but there were babies 2 and younger. There is that possibility right? So, how can someone send infants to warg a dragon.

Also you don't know if the dragons strengthen the magic or the magic strengthen the dragons.

Not sure of your point. I admitted it was just speculation on my part. But isn't that a lot of what goes on here, speculation and guessing about parts of the story not told? And I thought it was pretty clear the dragons strengthening the magic. The warlocks in the HOTU confirm it.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Don't know where all this " she only has one dragon" stuff comes from. Last time I checked Rhaegal and Viserion are still alive and will be well guarded til she returns. And I'm sure there were wargs around during Aegon's conquest, how did that work out?

Two dragons that she cannot ride and that are now feral. Well guarded? Yeah, in the sense that they've escaped their confines and are as likely to incinerate Dany's friends as they are her enemies.

Aegon, in one of his smarter decisions, avoided heading North where most of the wargs would have been. Gee, wonder why?

Exactly. If it was as easy as just roll out some wargs and take command of the dragons I'm sure it would have been tried.

There is one warg per 1,000 people with strong First Men blood, and many of those people may not even ever be aware that they even possess that gift. Just because it didn't occur to Torrhen (would he have even known about wargs or known any?) doesn't mean it can't or won't be done. Gee, if only we had a greenseer and/or a warg or two with Targaryen blood ... :rolleyes:

[Nictarion]

Two dragons that she cannot ride and that are now feral.

Aegon, in one of his smarter decisions, avoided heading North where most of the wargs would have been. Gee, wonder why?

Wasn't it because the north surrendered without him having to go there?

[Jon's Queen Consort]

Not sure of your point. I admitted it was just speculation on my part. But isn't that a lot of what goes on here, speculation and guessing about parts of the story not told?

You assumed that there were wargs around. And yes this is what happens but with evidence not without them.

And I thought it was pretty clear the dragons strengthening the magic. The warlocks in the HOTU confirm it.

no it is not clear especially since we saw that the Magic was there before the dragons.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Wasn't it because the north surrendered without him having to go there?

And Aegon didn't face the North until Torrhen marched down to the Riverlands. Aegon didn't face the northerners until he had to — he focused almost all of his attention on the Vale, Reach, Riverlands, Westerlands, Crownlands ... pretty much every Kingdom but the North until Torrhen forced his hand. Curious, no? Almost as if GRRM is deliberately denying us a precedent and almost as if Aegon wanted to save it for last for some reason.

Good to know you've given up on the plural dragons, by the way. Did you forget that she can only ever ride one of them?

[Jabronius Maximus]

Two dragons that she cannot ride and that are now feral.

Aegon, in one of his smarter decisions, avoided heading North where most of the wargs would have been. Gee, wonder why?

Forget Aegon, why didn't the Valyrian empire, which existed for 5000 years, just cross over and take Westeros? I can't remember the chapter but in adwd Tyrion brings this up, wondering why the Valyrians stopped at Dragonstone, while 'the real treasure lay further west' or something like that. I think its likely the Valyrians knew wargs existed, and stayed the hell away.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Forget Aegon, why didn't the Valyrian empire, which existed for 5000 years, just cross over and take Westeros? I can't remember the chapter but in adwd Tyrion brings this up, wondering why the Valyrians stopped at Dragonstone, while 'the real treasure lay further west' or something like that. I think its likely the Valyrians knew wargs existed, and stayed the hell away.

Exactly.

[Yukle]

Almost as if GRRM is deliberately denying us a precedent and almost as if Aegon wanted to save it for last for some reason.

I agree.

There's a lot to suggest that the First Men's relationship with the Children of the Forest seem to have given them closer ties to nature than the Andals and the Rhoynar, so it's not surprising that they seem more likely to be wargs (or even exclusively likely; are any others mentioned from other ethnic groups?).

[Nictarion]

I agree.

There's a lot to suggest that the First Men's relationship with the Children of the Forest seem to have given them closer ties to nature than the Andals and the Rhoynar, so it's not surprising that they seem more likely to be wargs (or even exclusively likely; are any others mentioned from other ethnic groups?).

Bloodraven?

[Yukle]

Bloodraven?

Since I haven't read the Dunk and Egg stories, I keep forgetting of their existences. Was he a warg or just a greenseer?

[Jabronius Maximus]

Since I haven't read the Dunk and Egg stories, I keep forgetting of their existences. Was he a warg or just a greenseer?

He's a greenseer, but he has FM blood from his mom's side (Blackwood).

[Yukle]

He's a greenseer, but he has FM blood from his mom's side (Blackwood).

Oooooooh, well that explains it. Makes sense. Must suck being an inbred Targaryen when you could have married a Northern Lord and had kids who could fall asleep as cripples and dream as direwolves.

And... dragons. :devil:

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Bloodraven?

Bloodraven is a greenseer/warg because of his Blackwood mother, not his Targaryen father. Like how Jon is a warg because of his Stark mother, not his Targaryen father. I use them as examples because some people have it in their heads that only Targaryens can control dragons. I'm saying, we have two Targaryen wargs right here.

ETA: I know that wargs are a specific type of skinchanger. I use warg as an umbrella term because frankly it's easier to type and works better as a verb. Anyone who dislikes this, tough. :P

[lady m]

Since I haven't read the Dunk and Egg stories, I keep forgetting of their existences. Was he a warg or just a greenseer?

He's a skinchanger and a greenseeer, wargs are associated with wolves. But Bloodraven is the only instory example of First Men and old gods worshiping person mating with a Targ and producing a child, outside of Jon. Bloodraven's mother was a Blackwood, they're the only family mentioned that still worship the old gods in the Riverlands.