thelittledragonthatcould Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Does family mean nothing??? She sat behind her walls while her brother and father and sister fought for their lives - fought in a war which she had started by sending that fake letter to Cat.She was a traitor to her King and husband. She might not be a traitor to Robb the King but she was a traitor to her family by deliberately and knowingly getting them into a war which destroyed them.Wasn't she forced to have an abortion by her father and then marry some old guy to strengthen his political position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rishav Banka Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 After reading this, I would blame Robb's worst betrayal to be from Aegon the conqueror. If he hadn't conquered the seven kingdoms, Robb would have been King in the north, after his father died ofcourse. Which would also mean that Ned's worst betrayal ALSO came from Aegon I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoyalStarkBannerman Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Lysa was never going to aid her family (Stark or Tully) in the Wot5K, because she was working against them the entire time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Lysa was perfectly safe - she could have sent half the Vale's army and the kept the remaining half with herself and it would have been more than enough to defend the impenetrable bloody gate.Just like the North was safe with the Crannogman in the Neck and Manderly in White Harbour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barty Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Wow, no. She owed nothing to Robb. She protected her people with selfish reasoning but even a sane person would have no reason to help him. She is rulling Vale as a Regent for her son(an Arryn), being the Aunt of Robb was in no way an obligation to help him.What about her sister and her father and her brother?? Did she owe nothing to them as well?? I'm not saying she should have proclaimed Robb her King but she should have sent men when her father was dying, her brother was captive and her old home besieged. She should have sent men when she realized her family would die if she did not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Heir Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 One last thing and that's about MasterJack's comment. She was only playing to her affecting for Little Finger and her obsession for her son. She betrayed her family member, Robb would have went to war to protect Lysa or her son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoyalStarkBannerman Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 What about her sister and her father and her brother?? Did she owe nothing to them as well?? I'm not saying she should have proclaimed Robb her King but she should have sent men when her father was dying, her brother was captive and her old home besieged. She should have sent men when she realized her family would die if she did not.Lysa cared about them less than she cared about pleasing Petyr Baelish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manderlay Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I think Robb was just young to shoulder the burden of king in the North, he was shouldering it well but it still weighed heavy on him, we can blame catelyn but it was also understandable, it was also Robbs mistakes, he realizes that he is winning battles but loosing the war, that speaks volumes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterJack Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 What about her sister and her father and her brother?? Did she owe nothing to them as well?? I'm not saying she should have proclaimed Robb her King but she should have sent men when her father was dying, her brother was captive and her old home besieged. She should have sent men when she realized her family would die if she did not.We see things differently, we will agree to disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Heir Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I agree with Barty as well regardless of closeness to them Lysa had a responsibility to her family. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barty Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Wasn't she forced to have an abortion by her father and then marry some old guy to strengthen his political position.She was carrying the bastard of a low born scumbag who didn't even love her and only f*cked her because he thought she was her sister. And Jon Arynn was a great match - how many second daughters get to marry a lord paramount? Hoster Tully saved his daughter from dishonor and marriage to LF - and seeing as how Lysa died a few weeks after her marriage to LF, Hoster probably saved her life as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Heir Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Well said Manderlay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barty Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Just like the North was safe with the Crannogman in the Neck and Manderly in White Harbour?The North was safe - if it wasn't for infighting in the North the ironborn would have easily been kicked out. And just who was Lysa fearing?? Lannisters?? If so then why not send men to destroy that threat once and for all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barty Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 Lysa cared about them less than she cared about pleasing Petyr Baelish.Which is why she is a treacherous scumbag.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MasterJack Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 She didnt fear the Lannister that much, the reason she says she hates them is because they killed her husband, which is a lie since she did it herself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Heir Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 The smart option for Lysa would have been to join Robb and take out one of the strongest allies to the crown if Little finger really wanted the crown how could have had the North handled through infighting later. Once the Lannisters were gone the Throne would have lost all its power over the seven kingdoms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grip Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 So basically you are saying that we should not blame Lysa because she was a coward?? I am blaming her for being a coward while you are excusing her actions because she was a coward. Either way cowardice in war is punished via death.We can call her actions cowardly, and brand her as such. However this does not mean that she betrayed Robb, as she was under no obligation to help him. As the Regent of the Vale she was perfectly within her rights to sit back and watch. And if she is a coward why have her knights go storming off to help a cause which she isn't interested in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manderlay Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 If anyone is interested here is the link as to why "young wolf" is such an apt name for Robb, Robb Stark the Young Wolf its in the Ice and Fire animal project: Wolves thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 The North was safe - if it wasn't for infighting in the North the ironborn would have easily been kicked out. And just who was Lysa fearing?? Lannisters?? If so then why not send men to destroy that threat once and for all.No it wasn't. I'm dealing with events in the series and the North was not safe. If you want to discuss hypothetical scenarios then fair enough, had Balon not died the Ironborn would of cemented their hold of the West of the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mindchap Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 After reading this, I would blame Robb's worst betrayal to be from Aegon the conqueror. If he hadn't conquered the seven kingdoms, Robb would have been King in the north, after his father died ofcourse. Which would also mean that Ned's worst betrayal ALSO came from Aegon I.See my earlier post. It's the firstmen's fault, if they had never come there would be no Robb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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