The connection between Ned and Joffrey

[The Prince of Ice]

This topic gve me cancer

This one made me laugh a little but ended up giving me a migraine in the end lols

[Bridgeburners]

My great grandfather was actually the original author of a Game of Thrones. He started writing it in the trenches of Ypres, and only got to a little past where Ned reaches KL, before he (my great grandpa) was ordered into battle and killed.

It was supposed to be a standalone novel (not a series) with a generally uplifting happy ending. Ned solves the murder of Jon Arryn, a plot hatched by Pycelle and Littlefinger all along, and he has them arrested. Danaerys convinces Khal Drogo to be a peaceful tribe, and they wander around Essos helping people, while she travels to Westeros, makes her peace with Robert, and marries Tyrion. Also, it turns out there was only one Other past the wall, and he was cursed because he lost his love before he died. Sam finds the book about him and learns her name, and Jon braves going near the Other and telling him her name. With that, the curse is broken. Everyone in Westeros lives happily ever after.

I guess GRRM had other plans....

[That Demon Monkey]

No, Ned warged into Sandor Clegane.

:eek:

You...

You could be on the something here!

I will stand as champion for this theory.

[joluoto]

Ned warged into Ser Pounce.

[Tiki]

Ilyn Payne sounds more likely.

[profilebegone]

Hi everyone! None of my theory threads have been doing so well. I'm truly trying my best to give theories that people can agree with but.. I guess my threads aren't well-written enough. From here on out I'm going to focus on making well-evidenced theories that people really can agree with. I hope you'll see that I'm serious and I genuinely believe that these theories are real.

First of all, let me start off by saying that Ned is a Warg--that is, like the other Starks, he can transfer his consciousness into other living beings, with his consciousness controlling the body of that living being he transferred his consciousness into. Why wouldn't Ned be a Warg? All of his children are. Why should his children be Wargs and not him? As long as someone can give me a good reason to the contrary, then I'll assume that Ned is indeed a Warg.

I'm also assuming that Ned knows that he is consciously a Warg. Unlike the other Stark children, he had years and years to practice this skill and be aware that he has developed it. So it's pretty clear, in my mind, that he can use his powers through the sheer force of his will. Let's consider the connection between Ned and Joffrey, which this thread title is based on. During Ned's execution, Ned had two choices: to Warg into someone and live on, or to have his head chopped off and die. I think the choice that Ned was going to pick is pretty clear.

Yes, I believe that Ned Warged into Joffrey on the day of his execution, and spent the rest of his life as Joffrey until Storm of Swords, for the following reasons:

1) to be close to his daughter Sansa and take care of her, marriage and all. Warging into Cersei would not allow him to be close to his daughter.

2) to ruin the Lannisters by being a bad King, and allow the North to win a predictable war.

3) to spy on the Small Council and give information to the North when possible.

Ned, with his consciousness inside Joffrey, acted as Joffrey until his death during the Purple Wedding for these reasons. He even had to command his daughter Sansa to be beaten, for the sake of his act so that he could allow the North to win the war, so that no one would notice Joffrey acting out of the ordinary. Ned truly must have been an honorable man to show Sansa his former body's head and say he wanted to serve Sansa Robb's head during his wedding--all for the reason of keeping his act up.

I have one piece of evidence for this theory that I think is really convincing. Joffrey was never a POV character. This means that GRRM was trying to keep Joffrey's true identity a secret. He didn't want readers to see Joffrey's (Ned's) guilt when he commanded his daughter beaten, and so on. GRRM was wise.

The implications of this theory are the following: Ned died during the Purple Wedding, and Joffrey was the one who died (or was replaced, anyway) during his execution. What do you guys think?

You, sir, are a dedicated professional. I appreciate the effort and the creativity. 7/10.

:cheers:

[profilebegone]

My great grandfather was actually the original author of a Game of Thrones. He started writing it in the trenches of Ypres, and only got to a little past where Ned reaches KL, before he (my great grandpa) was ordered into battle and killed.

It was supposed to be a standalone novel (not a series) with a generally uplifting happy ending. Ned solves the murder of Jon Arryn, a plot hatched by Pycelle and Littlefinger all along, and he has them arrested. Danaerys convinces Khal Drogo to be a peaceful tribe, and they wander around Essos helping people, while she travels to Westeros, makes her peace with Robert, and marries Tyrion. Also, it turns out there was only one Other past the wall, and he was cursed because he lost his love before he died. Sam finds the book about him and learns her name, and Jon braves going near the Other and telling him her name. With that, the curse is broken. Everyone in Westeros lives happily ever after.

I guess GRRM had other plans....

Basically this: http://www.shockingfunny.com/?p=1814

[profilebegone]

Ilyn Payne sounds more likely.

Nah, he warged into the High Septon, then during the riot he warged into Lollys, Tyrek Lannister, and Mandon Moore (he's a polywarg). During the Battle of Blackwater he warged into Aurane Waters, Lothor Brune, and Tywin Lannister; when Tywin dies, he wargs into Qyburn so he can then warg into unGregor.

Note how well he's strategically positioned himself - he has Sansa, the Royal Fleet, unGregor, Stokeworth, and oncew Tyrek re-emerges, Casterly Rock. Just wait until he wargs into Dany, though, that'll be the awesomest.

[Groat]

Would it still be considered incest if Ned warged Joffrey and then had sex with Sansa. My brain tells me no, but my heart tells me yes.

[MRHD]

I find it hard to believe that someone can be as evil as Joffrey. It seems overdone and fake to me.

Plenty of leaders in history more evil than Joff. Hitler, Vlad the Impaler, Pol Pot...

[profilebegone]

Would it still be considered incest if Ned warged Joffrey and then had sex with Sansa. My brain tells me no, but my heart tells me yes.

I'm going to go with "it would be so corrosive to the human soul as to barely matter."

[Arya rules]

I think it is more likely that Ned warged in to GRRM just before the beheading, then Martin warged in to Joffrey, and just before Joff went down Martin warged back in to Ned who had warged in to Cersei who was having sex with Jamie at the time. Cersie was really confused so Martin jumped out of Cersei in to Jamie which turned Jamie in to a defacto warg. Jamie then warged in to Martin only to find Ned there. Im getting confused... help...

[Nucky Baratheon]

Wait, I thought Khal Drogo warged into Joffrey.......

[Osric]

:lmao:

[Northbound]

Why would Ned, as a wargged Joffery make his own daughter; look at his chopped off head on a spike?

Why would Ned, as a wargged Joffery command his daughter to be beaten in front of the entire court?

:bang:

I know, I know! It was to keep everyone thrown off, that he wargged Joffery.

[Bob Sacamano]

Hi everyone! None of my theory threads have been doing so well. I'm truly trying my best to give theories that people can agree with but.. I guess my threads aren't well-written enough. From here on out I'm going to focus on making well-evidenced theories that people really can agree with. I hope you'll see that I'm serious and I genuinely believe that these theories are real.

First of all, let me start off by saying that Ned is a Warg--that is, like the other Starks, he can transfer his consciousness into other living beings, with his consciousness controlling the body of that living being he transferred his consciousness into. Why wouldn't Ned be a Warg? All of his children are. Why should his children be Wargs and not him? As long as someone can give me a good reason to the contrary, then I'll assume that Ned is indeed a Warg.

I'm also assuming that Ned knows that he is consciously a Warg. Unlike the other Stark children, he had years and years to practice this skill and be aware that he has developed it. So it's pretty clear, in my mind, that he can use his powers through the sheer force of his will. Let's consider the connection between Ned and Joffrey, which this thread title is based on. During Ned's execution, Ned had two choices: to Warg into someone and live on, or to have his head chopped off and die. I think the choice that Ned was going to pick is pretty clear.

Yes, I believe that Ned Warged into Joffrey on the day of his execution, and spent the rest of his life as Joffrey until Storm of Swords, for the following reasons:

1) to be close to his daughter Sansa and take care of her, marriage and all. Warging into Cersei would not allow him to be close to his daughter.

2) to ruin the Lannisters by being a bad King, and allow the North to win a predictable war.

3) to spy on the Small Council and give information to the North when possible.

Ned, with his consciousness inside Joffrey, acted as Joffrey until his death during the Purple Wedding for these reasons. He even had to command his daughter Sansa to be beaten, for the sake of his act so that he could allow the North to win the war, so that no one would notice Joffrey acting out of the ordinary. Ned truly must have been an honorable man to show Sansa his former body's head and say he wanted to serve Sansa Robb's head during his wedding--all for the reason of keeping his act up.

I have one piece of evidence for this theory that I think is really convincing. Joffrey was never a POV character. This means that GRRM was trying to keep Joffrey's true identity a secret. He didn't want readers to see Joffrey's (Ned's) guilt when he commanded his daughter beaten, and so on. GRRM was wise.

The implications of this theory are the following: Ned died during the Purple Wedding, and Joffrey was the one who died (or was replaced, anyway) during his execution. What do you guys think?

Provided by your excellent evidence, I can assume after Joffrey's (aka Ned version II) death he warged into someone else during the Purple Wedding. My guess, Tywin Lannister. He is the man with the most power in Westeros at the time of Ned's second death, and would be able to still deliver messages to the North. But, as we know, Tywin (aka Ned version III), was murdered by Tyrion. After his 3rd death, Ned warged into Tyrion and is currently under contract with the Second Sons on mission to get back to Westeros with the ultimate goal being father/husband to Sansa. Thank you OP, for bringing me to this logical conclusion.

[jobmartell]

I'm ned.

[Glenn of House Patrick]

Why don't you just focus on not making theories at all instead of throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks?

[Hound Dog]

No, Ned warged into Sandor Clegane.

That's what I was thinking all the while reading this. This poster's creativity is incredible, although his/her ideas are ones I don't really agree with. This post was much more interesting than crackpot, at the very least, Ned being a warg. But him warging into Sandor Clegane would make the most sense, as the Hound was strangely kind to Sansa in the second book, and took care of Arya in the third. Do I actually believe this? I'd be disappointed if it did happen... because I love the Hound. I wouldn't want him to be Ned... even though I loved Ned. Anyway, if Ned was the Hound, he wouldn't have left Sansa in King's Landing... and he wouldn't have been so afraid of the fire either. I'm not even sure why I'm writing this. I suppose I'm that bored at work today.

To the OP: Why would Ned warg into Joff and then not warg out of him while he was choking? Why not warg into Tyrion then? Then he'd be married to Sansa. Again, I can't believe I put so much thought into this post. Maybe Ned was a warg, you could be right, but he'd be too damned honourable to warg into someone anyway. Unless he warged into Ser Dontos. Why am I still typing?

[WatcherOnTheWall]

Hi everyone! None of my theory threads have been doing so well. I'm truly trying my best to give theories that people can agree with but.. I guess my threads aren't well-written enough.

When you have to open every thread with a statement like this it should tell you something.

As Albert Einstein once said:

"Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."

Please stop annoying people with your attention seeking.